To think these changes to the housing waiting list are not “cruel” but simply realistic?

[Eastie77Returns]

Our council has announced changes to the local housing waiting list from next month. There are tens of thousands on the list who will never be housed as they are not deemed to be in urgent need so they will now be removed.

The council has said they will be offered “personalised support to explore their options” which probably means advising they leave London, advances to help with private rent etc. I understand in many cases that is really not helpful but a close relative of mine who works in housing has been on the phone to me in tears because of the level of abuse she has faced from frustrated residents who have been on the list for years and are being removed.

Now a parent from DD’s school is organising a march on the town hall to protest all of this and has asked parents for support. She has been offered a council house 100+ miles outside London and is refusing to leave as her support network is here and I fully understand that. However, I do think a dose of realism is needed. There are 15,000 people on the waiting list here and a few hundred council properties become available each year. This parent has been told she does not fall into the 3 bands that will be kept on the list so she will never get a council house and she has responded by accusing the council of unimaginable cruelty

I don’t understand where she expects the council to magically just find thousands of homes and change that situation?

Lifetheuniverseandeverything

I was a nanny to a family of 3 under 5s . Parents both worked full time in property ironically renting a lower half of a house. Landlord gave them barely any notice that works needed doing so they had to upsticks the only place they could find in the area near school / nursery at such short notice. Nice place but the steps from the kitchen door had a massive drop with no railings being mindful of that I was with the twin toddlers in the outdoor area. Next door a builder starts knocking the wall down bricks flying into the their space really unsafe. Turns out they weren’t even supposed to be knocking wall down? Renting with young children where u have no security they literally can just give u a month to find somewhere to live.Where u chop and change constantly at the whim of a landlord. It completely put me off having children as I will never be able to achieve home ownership.

My cousin and his wife have a council house in a nice part of South London. They emigrated to Australia 15 years ago and rent it out privately. This shouldn’t be allowed.

Council should make visits to homes routinely, no notice. Check with royal mail and insurance companies. Sub letting is big business. A lot of times the poor tenant has no idea. After that terrible fire in the block of flats, nobody knew who was living there.people wait for years to get a home but others see it as an opportunity to cash in

Around where i live, council homes/flats/buildings are being destroyed to build private flats for years now. Government/councils are doing what is more profitable to them it appears.

@MrsSchadenfreude

My cousin and his wife have a council house in a nice part of South London. They emigrated to Australia 15 years ago and rent it out privately. This shouldn’t be allowed.

I have known people who do this. I have also known families who have been housed in W1 because they ‘must be near family’ (private renting by the council) and then rented out the flats - a neighbour said they were divorcing and needed a further property (then rented out both).

It’s infuriating when some people merrily play the system but people I have met through work:

Couple (with a baby) living in a basement studio flat and desperate for a flat.
Couple with 2 small children in a 1 bed flat
Couple with a toddler living in a garage (I’m not kidding)

I got moved from my council "chosen area " housing list 150 miles away 35 years ago, best thing that ever happened to me, although i didnt think it at the time, i was young home sick but eventually settled down.

I also wouldnt live in London if i was paid to do so, give me village life every time.

Well, for a start you can't sublet a council house. So if you know someone doing it, report it to the council.

Well - people do! Also when the council rents a property via a private landlord.

Sub letting is at an all time high. Why haven't the council sorted it

Because for most people it’s not started out as a let’s scam government plan. They maybe have 2 kids and want move in with their new partner who has nice house few miles away and out of their high crime tower block. They don’t want give up flat officially as never get back into the area every again, they maybe think we do this for year and if all goes well I will give up flat. Then charge less market rate to keep things quiet “say your my sister”. Then they get used to the money and goes on and on. Ideally you could give up temporally let of your home for 6-12m but hold on the rights. But if your mum lives 200miles away and you need look after her you can’t give up your home 20y and don’t want leave it empty either for medium short term. The system can’t cope so people sort for themselves. That’s not to say it’s not wrong but I understand how often happens. This sort thing is different for air BnB adverts where making massive amounts of money because their good luck have nice council home in decent area.

The thing is @Akire only people in council housing are realistically able to "hold on" a property in that way.
As homeowner with mortgage or privately rented accommodation you can't just up sticks and rent the property out without giving notice.
On top of that, in your scenario, the single parent would commits further crime by not declaring that they move in with a partner. Otherwise there would be questions / cuts to benefits.
To me, that looks like planned fraud. Nothing innocent or naive there!

True! Guess I’m more sympathetic to those with very messy lives but as I said still fraud and a crime

Subletting is very, very common. When DP moved here (from another European country) he lived in a sublet council flat for a year or so. That was over 20 years ago and as far as we know the owner is still renting it out.

I agree that many people who do it live precarious or economically uncertain lives. They may move in with a partner but are not sure it will work out. If the relationship fails, they have zero chance of ever getting a place in London again so I understand why they wish to safeguard their homes especially if they have children.

I do understand the frustration people feel towards sub-letters though.

@Ddot

Crack down on sub letting, its bloody greedy and shamefully shit. Unfortunately it's very common in cities

Yes, I think it should be cracked down on

@Eastie77Returns

Subletting is very, very common. When DP moved here (from another European country) he lived in a sublet council flat for a year or so. That was over 20 years ago and as far as we know the owner is still renting it out.

I agree that many people who do it live precarious or economically uncertain lives. They may move in with a partner but are not sure it will work out. If the relationship fails, they have zero chance of ever getting a place in London again so I understand why they wish to safeguard their homes especially if they have children.

I do understand the frustration people feel towards sub-letters though.

They could just not move in with their partners if they want to prioritise their children. Plenty of people in self-paid, privately rented property these days are careful because of how hard it is to find decently priced housing near to children’s schools and with a good landlord. Council housing is like a lottery yes it’s hard to get one and you wait ages but those who DO get one are set for life.

@Darlingx

Upamountain43

Right to buy you only have to prove you are willing to work in the UK loophole and property sits empty like a piece of the monopoly board. Loads being sold to overseas investors unoccupied. Sometimes I feel those high rise apartments branded as luxury apartments are the social housing that should have been built. It’s been in overdrive like lego buildings popping up everywhere the fraction of affordable is not affordable housing.

Yes. Round my way are several overpriced (above open market value) Shared ownership and Help to Buy new builds, plus 'luxury' flats (which are often bought up by absent investors).

It's an area of high housing demand with loooong waiting lists for social rented homes. Homeless families and vulnerable individuals are socially cleansed out of area into crap but expensive private rented.

@Barney60

I got moved from my council "chosen area " housing list 150 miles away 35 years ago, best thing that ever happened to me, although i didnt think it at the time, i was young home sick but eventually settled down.

I also wouldnt live in London if i was paid to do so, give me village life every time.

But lots of people, whether they like their home area or not, need to stay close to family or support networks. Particularly vulnerable families or disabled individuals.

Also, the most vulnerable can't just leave London because, being vulnerable, they're reliant on benefits and need social housing. The security aside, more and more private landlords don't accept tenants on benefits. Being from London they're not able to get priority for social housing elsewhere - due to Cameron and Osborne's local connection rules.

Anyway, if all the low paid left London, who does the low paid but essential jobs?

MrsSchadenfreude Your cousin and his wife who for the past 15 years have lived in Australia, aren't allowed to rent out their former council home. It should have been handed back so that a family who needed it got the benefit. It is a criminal offence to sub let council housing. No doubt they are also asking for market rent, rather than the more affordable rent for social housing. I think it's immoral when there are people desperately in need of decent accommodation.

I suppose it's arguable that social housing is not a public service or a given right for people who would not be able to pay market rental.

However, in my opinion, if that argument is accepted, then there should be caps on the rent that landlords may charge and much better security of tenure, as is the case in other European countries. Many people in Germany, for instance, are not so wedded to buying property BUT they invariably have much better standard and cheaper rented accommodation available.

My friend has rented his 2 bed council flat out for the last 12 years, £1200 a month. He's keeping it for his Daughter.

Berliners have voted it in, non binding though.landlords will be compensated.
qz.com/2065655/berliners-voted-to-seize-housing-from-big-corporate-landlords/

@lalafafa

My friend has rented his 2 bed council flat out for the last 12 years, £1200 a month. He's keeping it for his Daughter.

So essentially committing fraud and making a profit.

Doesn't it annoy you?

It may be accepted that living in a particular location, such as London, should not be seen as a right. However, I do believe that if people have lived in a particular location for many years and have all sorts of ties and support systems within that location, it is advisable that they remain in that locality.

Most people, though not all is it true, benefit from having the security that comes from having friends and family around who can offer support and a sense of belonging. It is hard enough being shifted around within a locality (which might involved children having to change schools) without moving to a totally alien environment with no support network.

@MrsSchadenfreude

My cousin and his wife have a council house in a nice part of South London. They emigrated to Australia 15 years ago and rent it out privately. This shouldn’t be allowed.

So why has noone reported it then?

@lalafafa

My friend has rented his 2 bed council flat out for the last 12 years, £1200 a month. He's keeping it for his Daughter.

So why haven't you reported it?