AIBU to think there's more to the petrol "crisis" than meets the eye?

[tartantroosers]

AIBU to think there's something very weird going on with the fuel "shortages"!
Big caveat- I'm not a conspiracy theorist but it's so bad where we are (Just inside M25) that many people I know won't be able to get to work this week. Garages have queues which are blocking all main routes and they're not even open! Is this a novel way of ensuring that we all "STAY AT HOME" ?!

You're an idiot if you think the fuel suppliers are doing this deliberately to boost profits. It doesn't stand up to a moment's scrutiny.

Some of us lived through the 70s

Lordy yes... sugar shortages, power cuts, do I remember flour shortages too??

I have heard (through someone who works there) that a very large haulage company is now cutting wages!!!

My thoughts are;

1. there was 40k missed driving tests during covid
2. it’s a shit job that can cost you personally thousands to train into leaving you in debt
3. the 20k drivers estimated to have left had no real ties to the uk, see next point
4. a LOT of people trafficking from Europe is made nearly impossible now - so no drivers to exploite
5. changes to agencies and IR35 means it harder to exploit workers

I genuinely think there will be a big reveal on how disgusting we have treat EU workers at some point

The thing is most people like stuff being cheap or cheaper (still expensive compared to many places) and the govt sold Brexit on the basis that it would lower foreign employment and reduce immigration. But immigration is an essential part of the economy we mostly enjoyed, it's simple supply and demand. Now that supply has been tampered with artificially and we'll see the knock on through our economy

@Silvercatowner

Some of us lived through the 70s

Lordy yes... sugar shortages, power cuts, do I remember flour shortages too??

Yep remember going to bed with a candle and toasting bread on the coal fire.

@NewlyGranny

I honestly don't see how everyone with a car filling up over the space of a day or three could cause anything remotely like what we're seeing. There have to be supply shortages on top and we know there have been. I hear motorway services have been prioritised which makes good sense. It's inconvenient if you run out of fuel on a B road; potentially lethal on something starting with M. I'm nearly 200 miles from home visiting family for the weekend and have been out and about draining my quarter of a tank trying to fill up. All the big supermarket filling stations are drained and closed as is anything on a major road. DS knew of a tired old little one in an industrial back street. Job done, I can go home a day late but confident of getting there.

It's a perfect storm of Brexit, Covid and longstanding underlying driver shortage, I think, and a heavy handed message that our just-in-time logistics are on the edge of failure all the time and are not fit for purpose in a post-Brexit post-Covid world!

We need margins and we need them now.

its because most petrol stations get enough supplies at a time for 3 or 4 days. That's what their tankage will hold. Of course there is a margin for extra customers but by and large its normal for them to be more or less empty on delivery day. Under normal circumstances, there is also likely to be delivery slack to get a delivery a day early if its needed. If people panic buy and go to fill up earlier, say a couple of days earlier, than they normally would, or do top ups, then the station is going to run out early...except there is already a shortage of drivers so that makes it worse. Its like Macdonalds saying please don't get a table until you have your food...the food sale/time taken to eat algorithm only works if people don't take a table until they need it.

I definitely think there is something else going on - probably several things but I dont think it’s related to getting people to stay at home. I do think someone (with power) will be getting rich off this but not necessarily the companies. Our government seems to have sleepwalked us all into this and even with a pandemic it seems negligent (basics like fuel and food shouldn’t ever be off the radar)

@Orangejuicemarathoner

www.theguardian.com/business/2021/sep/26/uk-essar-energy-second-biggest-oil-refinery-on-brink-of-collapse-reports

Stanlow oil refinery on the brink of bankruptcy

This is not related to lorry drivers, is it.

Stanlow has been wibbling for a while. That's why Shell sold it. I am guessing they sold it complete with contracts which is how it kept going

There are no queues near me, no closed petrol stations or any I have heard that have ran out. I’m in a pretty remote area as in far from any motorway.

I can remember a fuel shortage once before but no the cause, not the 70s but some time in the 90s most likely. I remember queues then and emergency vehicles being prioritised.

@DarkDarkNight

There are no queues near me, no closed petrol stations or any I have heard that have ran out. I’m in a pretty remote area as in far from any motorway.

I can remember a fuel shortage once before but no the cause, not the 70s but some time in the 90s most likely. I remember queues then and emergency vehicles being prioritised.

refineries were blockaded by haulage firms and tractor drivers in the 90's. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_protests_in_the_United_Kingdom

@LemonSwan

Is there any gas / oil in Afghanistan? I thought they mostly grew poppies - for both legitimate and illegal drug purposes.

I dont think so, or I think there is but its not currently utilised.

Like I said he has no idea how it would be related. Just its a coincidence and so he's decided its a possible theory.

Well, I think it’s Martians. No reason why, I just think it’s a coincidence that planet Earth is surrounded by space

Stanlow oil refinery on the brink of bankruptcy

Yes, over a tax bill. There’s a big difference between a business that’s been badly managed and one that is unviable. The refinery will just get sold or taken into public ownership.

"It comes as Petrol Retailers Association last night warned drivers to 'keep a quarter of a tank' of fuel in their vehicles in preparation for potential closures of local petrol stations."

Petrol retailer urges people to buy more petrol you say? In other news, bears defecate in wooded areas and the Pope is suspected of religious belief.

Fuck me, was critical thinking the first casualty of The Covid Era?

@Orangejuicemarathoner

www.theguardian.com/business/2021/sep/26/uk-essar-energy-second-biggest-oil-refinery-on-brink-of-collapse-reports

Stanlow oil refinery on the brink of bankruptcy

This is not related to lorry drivers, is it.

I wondered if this had anything to do with it. The government get the media to engineer panic buying, everyone has fuel to last them over a few days/ a week in case of disruption while the receivers are called in.

Could it be a way to Nationalise things. Competition in Gas and Electric suppliers is not working if lots go bust, so could we see that being Nationalised?
Petrol and Diesel supply chain issues, has now resulted in suspension of Competition Law so competing companies can share data. Nationalisation via the back door?

In June 2021 there was a Downstream Oil Resilience draft bill. Now today Government has announced that they are implementing the Downstream Oil Protocol. Hmm... any connection there?
The draft bill gives Government the power to require the oil industry to "provide vital information to ensure we can identify potential disruptions and monitor the impact during a crisis".

It's probably all a coincidence but maybe it's all part of a bigger plan which we do not know about.

Can’t see this government wanting to nationalise. They’ll have their mates in the wings waiting to snap things up for a song. I’d be delighted to be wrong and would like public services nationalised again.

Gavin Williamson looked very shifty on the Trevor Williams programme on Sky News.

At one point he said we need to reassure people. I suspect that means there is a fuel shortage.

They've done it deliberately in order to justify issuing visas to foreign drivers.

Maybe we will get a Fuel Dashboard which shows where has fuel in real time!

Reassure the public - how will Gavin do that? He never got DfE to produce reassuring guidance for in-home childcare workers, when he was with DfE. Now he's left there, will he really reassure us about National Infrastructure being secure and able to keep up with supplies?

@antoniawhite

Can’t see this government wanting to nationalise. They’ll have their mates in the wings waiting to snap things up for a song. I’d be delighted to be wrong and would like public services nationalised again.

Gavin Williams was born looking shifty.

@BrightYellowDaffodil your post is spot on. And the last line had me laughing out loud, it’s known as the pandemic if stupidity in this house

BrightYellowDaffodil

LemonSwan
Is there any gas / oil in Afghanistan? I thought they mostly grew poppies - for both legitimate and illegal drug purposes.

I dont think so, or I think there is but its not currently utilised.

Like I said he has no idea how it would be related. Just its a coincidence and so he's decided its a possible theory.
Well, I think it’s Martians. No reason why, I just think it’s a coincidence that planet Earth is surrounded by space hmm

Stanlow oil refinery on the brink of bankruptcy

Yes, over a tax bill. There’s a big difference between a business that’s been badly managed and one that is unviable. The refinery will just get sold or taken into public ownership.

"It comes as Petrol Retailers Association last night warned drivers to 'keep a quarter of a tank' of fuel in their vehicles in preparation for potential closures of local petrol stations."

Petrol retailer urges people to buy more petrol you say? In other news, bears defecate in wooded areas and the Pope is suspected of religious belief.

Fuck me, was critical thinking the first casualty of The Covid Era?

We only have this issue as ppl have panic bought again 🙄 if ppl bought like normal we would not be having this issue

Stanlow is on the brink due to mismanagement - it’s owned by Essar Oil - they owe a fortune in tax, it announced last Tuesday that it wouldn’t be able to meet payments to HMRC.

Then we have an announcement that there is no petrol shortage from the government which of course everyone believes means there is definitely a shortage.

So they panic buy.

And how many petrol station forecourts does Essar Oil have? And how much fuel has gone through them in the last 72 hours? And how much money have they made?

So now they’re going into receivership with some lovely healthy bank accounts as a result of an unprecedented run on fuel caused by the government announcement when the bloody government is a major creditor.

At one point he said we need to reassure people. I suspect that means there is a fuel shortage.

Jesus wept. It’s been made clear again and again and again that there is no shortage of fuel, there were distribution issues affecting a small number of one retailer’s outlets, then panic buying has temporarily affected the rest of the chain because demand has vastly outstripped the reserves petrol stations hold. Those reserves are based on expected sales, not availability of fuel.

Maybe - just maybe - he’s reassuring people because a) there’s REALLY nothing to be concerned about and b) they need people to stop creating a problem that otherwise doesn’t exist.

@DrCoconut

The government are saying there's no fuel shortage. Therefore we can conclude there is a fuel shortage.

^^ this

When do they ever tell us the truth ?

@PrtScn

The only petrol station round here still open for fuel is the one that has been limiting fillups to £30 max. If the others had followed suit we’d probably not be in quite so much shit.

they did that wrong. It should have been £30 minimum fill up. That stops the twats who's needle has twitched off the full from trying the squeeze £5 in, clogging up the forecourts, and only permits those who do need to fill up to do so. There's some good maths surrounding it.

It will all settle in a day or 2 as once everyone's car is full they cant fill up again. It's just a blip where for a few days where more fuel is stored in cars than normal.

Maybe - just maybe - he’s reassuring people because a) there’s REALLY nothing to be concerned about and b) they need people to stop creating a problem that otherwise doesn’t exist

I agree that the problem is almost entirely self created.

But it's no longer nothing to be concerned about. The number of filling stations which are out of action goes well beyond the initial small number - Petrol Retailers Association saying that 2/3 of its members are out of fuel. That is concerning.

And it doesn't matter whether there's an underlying shortage or not when you just can't buy any. One hopes it means that supply can be restored in a few days, maybe a week, rather than needing to prepared for the longer term. But that isn't any help ver this coming week.