Slave underclass; No voice, no money, no hope.

[HomeSliceKnowsBest]

Posting for a non Mumsnetter friend...

AIBU to think I am now part of the burgeoning slave underclass in England?

There is no political party which represents my interests or will stand up to the Tory juggernaut, nor does it seem likely there will be one in the near future.

I am stuck in a low pay job with no hope of owning a home nor living in a reasonable quality rental property.

I cannot access help with my increasingly dire mental health as the waiting list is huge.

I live hand to mouth each month, I have no social life or treats as money doesn't permit it and have budgeted down to the last 1p. I do not have the time nor energy to 'take in ironing' , 'do matched betting' etc between kids, work and (badly) running my home.

I will be worked to death, as by the time I am old enough to draw a pension I doubt I will last all that long due to the lifestyle that poverty forces me into.

AIBU to say there is a slave class of people in our population and ask if you think this is deliberate on the part of the Government, to ensure an adequate supply of workers to feed into the machine and earn their peers big money, while keeping us so miserable or strung out on medication that we quietly comply? We are disposable, despised and unheard.
There is not the possibility of working or educating our way out of this situation as there was in the past.
I feel entirely nihilistic and numb plodding through this daily grind for the next 30 years.

@PicsInRed Who is Fransoy?

@PicsInRed

Stories like that of Fransoy, I do not understand why Fransoy would not turn off her water supply at the main? There is no need for her to have lived with water leaking everywhere. Are people that helpless these days?

[quote PlanDeRaccordement]@PicsInRed

Stories like that of Fransoy, I do not understand why Fransoy would not turn off her water supply at the main? There is no need for her to have lived with water leaking everywhere. Are people that helpless these days?[/quote]
It was a council property, an apartment building. The leaks came from another part of the building over which she had no control.

[quote LukeEvansWife]@PicsInRed Who is Fransoy?[/quote]
www.itv.com/news/2021-05-17/mum-who-lived-in-mould-infested-flat-slams-croydon-council-for-not-caring

@PicsInRed
Thank you for answering my question and posting the link. As you said the leak was from flat above which was also in LLs control. Absolutely shocking how the LL (council) neglected their tenants. Poor Fransoy and her family. Also affected her neighbour Leroy as well.

Reminds me of something doctors unofficially call "shit life syndrome". Sounds insulting but is actually just an acknowledgement of the reality of people going to their GP with myriad mental and physical health problems caused by what is essentially a complete failure of society to look after people. They are working every hour or else struggling by on benefits while unable to work for one reason or another while simultaneously juggling caring responsibilities for children and/or sick relatives with no realistic hope of improving their situation, and what can the GP do? Nothing to fix the underlying issues, certainly, and therapy waiting lists are ridiculous, so antidepressants are their only resort.

But surely the lack of care within society is fairly well known. And yet still people are surprised. Nobody should be poor but certain choices make you more vulnerable.

And to fix the underlying causes is such a huge worldwide issue. (Spoiler alert - it won't happen)

Stories like that of Fransoy, I do not understand why Fransoy would not turn off her water supply at the main? There is no need for her to have lived with water leaking everywhere. Are people that helpless these days

This unfortunately is a fairly typical response to poverty and misfortune - to automatically blame the poor person for their circumstances without knowing the facts.

There is no automatic sympathy for this poor family here - they must first justify that their dire situation is not their own fault. Yet the same poster is “offended” by the use of the word slave by the OP and in a song. Try being offended by something that actually matters, like child poverty!!!

Honestly it can’t just be me that the thinks the world has gone f*cking mad and that peoples priorities are insanely backwards.

Children eating their dinner in a mould infested flat with an umbrella = deserving of outrage.

Using the word slave (whether you’re the OP, Justin Timberlake or the many who use the word “wage slavery”) = not a big deal.

There is no automatic sympathy for this poor family here - they must first justify that their dire situation is not their own fault.

What's your point?

Is that what actual slaves think @Gingerandlemont?

What's your point pretty self explanatory, can’t really simplify it any further.

Is that what actual slaves think unlikely that anyone on here knows what any actual slaves think. My guess is that someone who has been through something that awful would have more important things to worry about than the appropriate use of the word slave on an Internet forum. Also pretty sure they would be more likely to empathise with a financially struggling mother (even if she uses the word slave) than a bunch of (likely richer) women berating the struggling women for using the word slave.

The term “wage slavery” has been around for years and years (see link below). And it raises an important debate about the treatment of those stuck in low income jobs living hand to mouth. Cancelling terms like “wage slavery” under the pretence of them being too offensive is really wrong, because it silences the legitimate issues being raised.

And also, the people you’re being offended on behalf of probably genuinely don’t give a sh*t, and would probably want to give a voice to impoverished people going without.
(My opinion only - yes I know I don’t speak for any former or current slaves).

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_slavery

And also, the people you’re being offended on behalf of probably genuinely don’t give a sht*

Same could be said for those articles above. Hand wringing about child poverty and council house issues isn't going to help them.

Same could be said for those articles above. Hand wringing about child poverty and council house issues isn't going to help them

True - this is just an Internet forum, not an actual way of helping people. Although OP asked if she was right to be fed up of her life. Surely more helpful to her to say no YANBU then “how dare you use word slave” etc.

And shit will just become steadily worse, watch food prices noticeably jump in the next few days due to delivery delays.

Nevertheless many of those struggling will be swayed by some fake culture war shit. The media will show the same video of ten people on a leaky boat in the channel every 10 mins calling it ‘breaking news’ and these same people struggling to feed their children will run to the ballot box and vote for more of the same or worse making every excuse as to why.

I’ve just got to a point now where I’ve just thrown my hands up in their air, stopped being frustrated with people voting against their own interests. I just focus on my own family now.

[quote Gingerandlemont]What's your point pretty self explanatory, can’t really simplify it any further.

Is that what actual slaves think unlikely that anyone on here knows what any actual slaves think. My guess is that someone who has been through something that awful would have more important things to worry about than the appropriate use of the word slave on an Internet forum. Also pretty sure they would be more likely to empathise with a financially struggling mother (even if she uses the word slave) than a bunch of (likely richer) women berating the struggling women for using the word slave.

The term “wage slavery” has been around for years and years (see link below). And it raises an important debate about the treatment of those stuck in low income jobs living hand to mouth. Cancelling terms like “wage slavery” under the pretence of them being too offensive is really wrong, because it silences the legitimate issues being raised.

And also, the people you’re being offended on behalf of probably genuinely don’t give a sh*t, and would probably want to give a voice to impoverished people going without.
(My opinion only - yes I know I don’t speak for any former or current slaves).

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wage_slavery[/quote]
What nonsense. you can talk about poverty and low wage jobs without using the word “slavery” or “slave”. Telling you it is offensive and not to conflate poverty with slavery doesn’t silence discussion on legitimate issues like poverty.

@Gingerandlemont
“Stories like that of Fransoy, I do not understand why Fransoy would not turn off her water supply at the main? There is no need for her to have lived with water leaking everywhere. Are people that helpless these days”

This unfortunately is a fairly typical response to poverty and misfortune - to automatically blame the poor person for their circumstances without knowing the facts.

Please note I asked a question to find out the facts....but you go ahead with twisting things to suit your narrative.

What nonsense. you can talk about poverty and low wage jobs without using the word “slavery” or “slave”. Telling you it is offensive and not to conflate poverty with slavery doesn’t silence discussion on legitimate issues like poverty

The way we are going, pretty soon you wont be able to talk about anything without someone getting offended.

@Gingerandlemont

Same could be said for those articles above. Hand wringing about child poverty and council house issues isn't going to help them

True - this is just an Internet forum, not an actual way of helping people. Although OP asked if she was right to be fed up of her life. Surely more helpful to her to say no YANBU then “how dare you use word slave” etc.

No the OP did not ask if she was right to be fed up with her life. Her question was:

AIBU to think I am now part of the burgeoning slave underclass in England?

And the answer is YABU because OP is not a slave, and therefore is not part of the actual slave class that currently exists in England of trafficked humans.

If she’d asked if she was right to be fed up with her life...then yes the answer would be YANBU. But that wasn’t what she asked.

@Gingerandlemont

What nonsense. you can talk about poverty and low wage jobs without using the word “slavery” or “slave”. Telling you it is offensive and not to conflate poverty with slavery doesn’t silence discussion on legitimate issues like poverty

The way we are going, pretty soon you wont be able to talk about anything without someone getting offended.

That might apply to you, but I am confident most people can communicate without using offensive comparisons.

Bullshit unnecessary austerity programme sees services cut to the bone and people struggling.

What do the people do? Vote more Conservative.

As a cover for austerity related issues, Cameron throws in the EU debate as a distraction.

What do the people do? Vote Brexit.

Things get progressively worse.

What do the people do? Vote Conservatives to have an even harder Brexit.

Goods become scarce, can’t buy a house, can’t sell a flat due to cladding, can’t fill your car, on zero hours contract taking your life in to your hands weaving through cars on a moped to deliver McD’s working for Deliveroo.

What will the people do next I wonder? Guarantee they’ll vote Conservative and cite some rubbish about Keir Starmer not wearing a tie or not having enough flags draped behind him as the reason.

This is pure media clickbait, the OP is a journo surely. Why would she post for a non MN user

[quote PlanDeRaccordement]@Gingerandlemont
“Stories like that of Fransoy, I do not understand why Fransoy would not turn off her water supply at the main? There is no need for her to have lived with water leaking everywhere. Are people that helpless these days”

This unfortunately is a fairly typical response to poverty and misfortune - to automatically blame the poor person for their circumstances without knowing the facts.

Please note I asked a question to find out the facts....but you go ahead with twisting things to suit your narrative.[/quote]
Tbf, you did follow the question with a judgement that there was no need to live like that and then ask what I assume was a sarcastic question about people being helpless these days.

Bullshit unnecessary austerity programme sees services cut to the bone and people struggling.

What do the people do? Vote more Conservative.

As a cover for austerity related issues, Cameron throws in the EU debate as a distraction.

What do the people do? Vote Brexit.

Things get progressively worse.

What do the people do? Vote Conservatives to have an even harder Brexit.

"Goods become scarce, can’t buy a house, can’t sell a flat due to cladding, can’t fill your car, on zero hours contract taking your life in to your hands weaving through cars on a moped to deliver McD’s working for Deliveroo.*

What will the people do next I wonder? Guarantee they’ll vote Conservative and cite some rubbish about Keir Starmer not wearing a tie or not having enough flags draped behind him as the reason.

I didn't and won't vote Tory. Still stuck with the bullshit though......

@Porcupineintherough

What's weird is that you are talking as if this is a new thing, rather than representing the way the majority of people have lived throughout history.

Difference is you have had access to free education, have free education for your kids and have free health care. So hardly a slave.

If you feel there is no political party to represent you then you need to do something about that. As you say, you are one of a great number of people in the same position and all with a vote.

This is what I thought too. Sadly but somewhat inevitably there has always been the poor. The poor of 2021 have considerably better lives than the poor of the past. Until not so long ago there were work houses or the streets along with your kids. You have had free education, free health care and in many cases a free private home. Until recent decades it was very normal to share with 3 or 4 other families. There is always that chance to improve life for yourself in England. A slave doesn’t have that chance at all.

@EverNapping

Whilst I agree with what you are saying, slave is not the right word.

You have control & freedom of choice, not to mention some coverage of basic human rights.

A slave has nothing. No choice what to eat, where to live, who to sleep with, whether to leave the house for a walk, talk to whoever they want. A slave can be beaten, raped, bred or killed. And that's only a basic comparison.

That's not necessarily true. Remember that slavery is an ancient institution with many instantiations. Slaves have often had some level of legal or customary social protections, that doesn't mean they aren't slaves.

I sometimes think that because we are taught a very narrow view of what constitutes slavery, we end up being blind to the degree to which many of the goods we use are either products of slavery or class structures where the difference could barely be parsed.