To ask why so many M25 drivers seem to have a deathwish?

[BlueBloodedBlue]

Drove DS back to Uni today, so drive half way around the M25 twice, OMG, some of the driving was bonkers - undertaking, cutting across lanes at 90+mph - so dangerous.

What makes people believe they are invincible? There were a number of long delays due to accidents and yet, some of the driving was dreadful.

We drove on 2 other motorways but it was only on the M25 that it was frightening.

Not just M25 - motorway driving generally. It’s awful. I stick to the left behind the lorries.

No mention for the (Manchester ring motorway) M60 yet? It's got the same number of junctions as the M25, in less than half the length. You do the decent thing and move over to the left hand lane, and immediately there's a sign telling you the left lane is filtering off at the next junction, so you have to move back over and nobody will let you in.

Not forgetting where the motorways merge.
Cars speed onto the M60 and nobody seems to give a damn if there is already a car there. No slowing down whatsoever.

@DriveInSaturday

I do M6 M61 M60 B something.

Utterly hell much prefer M25 far easier to navigate!

I'm probably in a minority because I enjoy motorway driving far more than any other type of roads. I find very windy narrow NSL country roads with steep inclines at the side and no streetlights far more terrifying! That feels like taking my life into my own hands!

@GorgonzolaSouffle hope your friend is doing better very soon, agree with pp re the water cannons for the XR idiots. Everyone of those who sat and blocked a road should be prosecuted.

I always found the M25 a nice motorway...but then after the Ring in Brussels and the E40, any UK motorway seemed a bastion of civilisation by comparison.

I just don't understand people getting impatient when someone is going 70mph in any lane. The real problem is anyone wanting to overtake at a speed over 70. The speed limit is there for a reason - most people think it doesn't apply to them and then think others are idiots for "blocking them". The mentality is just shocking.

I think there are impatient idiots everywhere. Sometimes I'd rather drive on any motorway than on the local roads around me, where some people seem to think they're competing in a rally.

I have used the western quarter of the M25 for many years (junctions 10-16) and have never noticed that the driving is much worse than on other motorways.

More recently I have been using the southern section (junctions 10-2) and find it a lot worse. The habit of driving only in the two outside lanes is very common there.

I think the western section is usually busier so there is probably less scope for stupid driving if people in all lanes are driving at 40!

M5 can be ridiculous round the oh so common holds ups around Bristol. Travelled down on Friday, got caught in a stop start queue and was undertaken by a bloke who was weaving in and out of the gaps between cars. The third time he passed me he slammed into the rear of the car in front... and tried to tell the woman driver it was ok, no damage done. She flashed a badge at him and told him to pull over, a lorry driver blocked the road on front so he had to weave across to the hard shoulder where, I assume the woman had a pretty good about at him.

The woman in the car next to me said it was a pretty common occurrence, made me quite glad I don't have to do this run often!

That and I've never chatted to the driver of a car in the ' fast lane' before. It all felt quite odd 🙄

It's rarely possible to get above 65mph on the M25 and it's entirely covered by average speed cameras, so I'm surprised at these stories of speeding.

The left-most lane appears to be for lorries doing 54mph, the second from left lane is for lorries over-taking at 55mph. The problem with the cars in the 3rd lane doing 65mph is not that they're not moving over, they're permanently overtaking lorries, and if they did find a gap to move into, they'd have to move back within 30 seconds, if anyone would let them in. The problem is they're doing 65 when they could be doing 70, so they're unnecessarily holding up everyone who is capable of sticking to 70.

The fourth lane is for people who want to overtake people in the third lane.

The long sections of roadworks with average speed cameras.

The amount of people that's still dangerously slow down for the cameras then speed up and then drive touching your boot because you stick to the speed limit 🤦🏼‍♀️

Middle lane hoggers are just arses
But there's the ones who dip in and out of the left lane as well

HUH? you can't have it both ways. Either people dip in and out of the left lane to overtake and then tuck back in or they stay in the middle lane. What do you want people to do?

It may not be the motorway, just the time you drove it.

When I used to drive around to different sites for work - weekdays - I noticed the general standard of driving was merely average, whereas at weekends it descended into pisspoor.

@lllllllllll

Standard of driving in this country is horrendous now.

@firsttimedad79 I can’t say I disagree, but what has changed? Driving tests are surely more rigorous than ever! There are presumably millions more people on the roads than there were 20-30 years ago - could that be it?

It's because people have changed. We have all noticed that people in general have really started to lack in common sense over the past couple of generations.

Youngsters today just don't have a clue!

[quote RandomMess]@DriveInSaturday

I do M6 M61 M60 B something.

Utterly hell much prefer M25 far easier to navigate![/quote]
I used to do similar, but just moved. Had to do Chorley to Runcorn on a Monday and return on a Friday.

Coming home was worse as it was always rammed and took me twice as long as it should!

I’m in north Manchester but lived in London for 7 years - the N. Circular is the worst road I’ve ever driven on. My friend’s husband is a traffic cop at Camden and told me that London driving is so bad because so many people have passed their test abroad and the tests vary widely in driving standards. Additionally, some countries don’t have motorways and people who move to London just don’t know how to drive on them. He also pointed out that it’s estimated that one in ten cars in London are being driven uninsured.

Feeling the Bradford pain. I have a friend in Keighley and will always either drive from mine to hers via Colne or Halifax rather than M62 and through Bradford. Takes longer but at least I know the way and won’t be spat out somewhere like Otley or Harrogate…

@firsttimedad79 the morons that I saw on the m25 certainly weren't "youngsters".

I think one of the issues with the M25 is that many people choose to drive in the 2nd Lane because (a) the first Lane so often turns into a dedicated 'off ramp' lane, so you have to keep moving out, and (b) then the 'on ramp' Lane turns into a normal driving lane so you have to keep moving back over. And moving out or in is not that easy on a road with such a dense volume of vehicles.
In many ways it makes sense to keep the inside Lane for on/off and lorries. It's a 4 lane motorway so still two lanes for faster traffic and overtaking. It's the drivers who end up in lane 3 doing 59mph but are too scared/ignorant to move back over that cause the problems.
And we should have laws that make moving over more than one lane within 6/8 seconds illegal. You need to acclimatise in each lane and carry our fresh observations. Two lanes - two cycles of MSM.

I was on both the M25 and N Circular yesterday, driving from Sussex to Chigwell and back again. Although it was very busy, I didn't think it was too bad.

Undertaking seems to be the norm, now though. I've kind of come to expect it, and as long as everyone uses their mirrors carefully when changing lanes, it doesn't really bother me to much.

One thing I actually liked was people flashing to let you know they were letting you in, and people flashing their hazards to thank you when you'd let them in. It was busy and fast, but sensible and polite at the same time.

It was knackering though. I must be getting old.

90+ on the M25??? Where?

Usually it's 40mph if you are lucky and even if it isn't a carpark the whole thing is covered in speed cameras.

You want to try the A1M for nutters.

I actually think the standard of driving, politeness and consideration in this country are quite good. I'm in London zone 2, I regularly drive to Norfolk (inc M25), Weybridge area, Newbury. I see a lot of letting people out with a flash, thank you with hazard lights, always stopping at crossings etc. I think a lot of people need to be more confident on the road, then they wouldn't find confident drivers intimidating.

I drive London regularly. A406/ A12 don’t bother me, central is fine. I’ll drive down the M3/ M20 without a thought … but yes: wtaf is with the M25? I don’t mind some North bits but towards and past Heathrow is mad. No keeping left, you’d be filtered off or a lorry sandwich. Cars undertake you at 80/90 in the lane about to filter off. You can be doing 80 and someone will ride you bumper. They’ll flash you to go fast when you’re in a wall of traffic. There’s no particular rule as to which lane flows faster.
I thought I hated motorways. I realised I’m fine. It’s just the M25.

You want to try the A1M for nutters

Totally. I use it at least once a week and every time I’m astonished that more people don’t get killed on it.

I live in East London. Nothing is as bad as driving around here in rush hour traffic. If I can drive here, I can drive anywhere. I just assume every other driver is an idiot.