Applying for a new job while pregnant

[Traveller3367]

7 months pregnant
Saw a job that I thought I would be good at
Applied without mentioning I was pregnant
Been offered the role and have informed employer I am pregnant and due to go on mat leave soon
They will see if they can get cover but I have offered to decline the position if they cannot.
My question is was I being unreasonable in applying in the first place?
(Ps I wasn't hiding my pregnancy. I didn't know when was best to mention it. Didn't want employer to think I was using it against them if they declined me. Also I valued the chance to network and get some interview practice. Was not expecting to get the role as a big jump for me career wise)

@SecretSpAD

For,those who have insulted my sister, she currently employs 15 women who have, at various points in the many years they've worked for her, been on mat leave.

She works in an industry where over 50's are discrimated against on a regular basis. She employs people who are experienced and reliable and it is actually insulting to assume that an older woman might not have the skills to do that job (after 30 odd years in the business).

She also employs women and men who have caring duties for elderly parents.

She employs three women with learning disabilities.

What she won't hire now, after years of training and investing in women who come in pregnant, fuck off for a years mat leave and then return pregnant - are younger women.

Her company has benefitted massively from investing in older women who were put on the scrap heap by their previous jobs. She now reaps the benefit of their experience and knowledge of the industry.

None of the other stuff she does makes up for her appalling attitude towards women under the age of 50. I would not be proud of my sister if she did this.

Would you speak up for her this way if she was wonderful to everyone apart from disabled people? Or apart from a certain ethnicity?

Would you speak up for her this way if she was wonderful to everyone apart from disabled people? Or apart from a certain ethnicity?

The appropriate comparison would be if she positively discriminated for disabled people or those of a particular ethnicity. MN really hates older women.

@Blossomtoes

Would you speak up for her this way if she was wonderful to everyone apart from disabled people? Or apart from a certain ethnicity?

The appropriate comparison would be if she positively discriminated for disabled people or those of a particular ethnicity. MN really hates older women.

Yes the ageism on here is appalling...

@Blossomtoes

Would you speak up for her this way if she was wonderful to everyone apart from disabled people? Or apart from a certain ethnicity?

The appropriate comparison would be if she positively discriminated for disabled people or those of a particular ethnicity. MN really hates older women.

I do happen to think she's wonderful. As do her staff - all of whom stay with her for a long time. Some through 3 or 4 mat leaves. The only difference is that they put the time in before and didn't take the piss by starting the job pregnant, take a year off, come back pregnant, work for a few months and then fuck off for another year.

Believe me there are a lot of employers who think the same as my sister.

@Blossomtoes

Would you speak up for her this way if she was wonderful to everyone apart from disabled people? Or apart from a certain ethnicity?

The appropriate comparison would be if she positively discriminated for disabled people or those of a particular ethnicity. MN really hates older women.

I don’t have an issue with her employing older women - I don’t know the legalities around positive discrimination in recruitment though.

What I have an issue with is someone actively discriminating against a protected group. I would feel the same if someone was actively discriminating against older women and only recruiting younger women.

*I do happen to think she's wonderful. As do her staff - all of whom stay with her for a long time. Some through 3 or 4 mat leaves. The only difference is that they put the time in before and didn't take the piss by starting the job pregnant, take a year off, come back pregnant, work for a few months and then fuck off for another year.

Believe me there are a lot of employers who think the same as my sister.*

I know lots of employers think the same as your sister. Doesn’t make it right. I think they are just as appalling as she is.

What if the pregnant woman applying for the role lost her job because her past employer discriminated against her (and this happens all the time!) just tough shit? Pregnant woman are discriminated in the workplace in a number of ways because people can’t stand them taking maternity leave which they are entitled to, and your sister is as much as part of the problem as anyone else. She’s so far from wonderful it’s disgusting.

Older woman are discriminated against in the workplace too @islandbeach. The numbers of employers who actively discriminate for them - on perfectly valid business grounds - is vanishingly small. Pregnancy doesn’t trump age.

What if the pregnant woman applying for the role lost her job because her past employer discriminated against her (and this happens all the time!) just tough shit? Pregnant woman are discriminated in the workplace in a number of ways because people can’t stand them taking maternity leave which they are entitled to, and your sister is as much as part of the problem as anyone else. She’s so far from wonderful it’s disgusting.

🤷🏻‍♀️ you do you.

Will you be entitled to maternity pay if you’ve only just started?

Is there a probation period?

From the employers perspective it must be quite annoying. If it was on zoom how could they see you were heavily pregnant? Of course they can’t discriminate (and can’t tell you they’ve changed their mind when they offer the job and THEN you announce you’re heavily pregnant), but imagine taking on a new member of staff, training them up then having to find cover for their role two months later (or earlier if you have any medical problem that requires you to start mat leave earlier). And there’s no guarantee you’ll return after 6 months, many women take a year off or apply for part time or choose not to RTW at all after having a baby.

This part of @islandbeach’s comment really stood out to me:

How about organisations just stop discriminating against all women in the first place so we don’t have to sacrifice a particular group of women to help other women

It’s funny because I am persistently expected to sacrifice my plans and free time, and organise holiday etc., around the needs of my colleagues with kids. I’ve covered - in addition to my own job - 15 maternity leaves since 2015. I’m routinely told, when I mention this, that it takes a village, that I’m privileged because I’ll be promoted faster (we’re all on the same grade where I work), that being a parent is hard, that their kids will be paying my pension, and that this is a feminist issue.

The above quote equally applies to single women, but nobody gives a toss when they’re treated as second class citizens. It’s no longer a feminist issue.

@FateHasRedesignedMost
No expectation to have mat pay.

@Blossomtoes

Older woman are discriminated against in the workplace too *@islandbeach*. The numbers of employers who actively discriminate for them - on perfectly valid business grounds - is vanishingly small. Pregnancy doesn’t trump age.

I’m not sure why you keep replying to me about older women. I know older women are also discriminated against, and disabled people, and on other grounds too. I don’t agree with any of it. My posts are about women being refused roles or chastised for taking on a new job purely on the basis they are pregnant. I’ve never suggested a pregnant woman should get offered a job over an older woman.

I really can’t understand why you think it’s not ok to discriminate against older women but it’s ok to discriminate against pregnant women. Which is exactly what PPs sister is doing. How about we just stop discriminating against any women.

@AudacityBaby I've had the same over the years. Of course when, in one job, I did get promoted faster that was wrong as well. It does seem as if some people want the workplace to accommodate only a certain demographic of women - whilst throwing older women, childfree women under the bus.

It's funny reading these comments
Truly it seems it's women who try and oppress other women
Luckily my boss is more of a feminist than many on here or indeed the future colleague that tried to scare me off.

No discrimination is acceptable
It's NOT ok to be nicer to one group than another
@SecretSpAD I assume your sister has never taken a maternity leave? How pathetic of her to discriminate against young women.
Discrimination of any kind is wrong

I will be hiding this thread soon as it seems to have attracted an underclass of people who feel society shouldn't progress with Equal rights and pregnant women should disappear until they can work again

I hope for others following this thread, if you are pregnant and an opportunity comes up, GRAB IT with both hands. DO NOT let pregnancy hold you back.
As a PP said, theres enough discrimination out there, so don't discriminate against yourself

It’s funny because I am persistently expected to sacrifice my plans and free time, and organise holiday etc., around the needs of my colleagues with kids. I’ve covered - in addition to my own job - 15 maternity leaves since 2015. I’m routinely told, when I mention this, that it takes a village, that I’m privileged because I’ll be promoted faster (we’re all on the same grade where I work), that being a parent is hard, that their kids will be paying my pension, and that this is a feminist issue.

You’ve got an employer problem. This used to grate on me before I had DC (I didn’t have an issue with employers but just the attitudes of some parents I worked with) and now I am a parent I would never expect someone without children to sacrifice when they take holidays etc. Why aren’t your workplace hiring maternity cover?

[quote SecretSpAD]@AudacityBaby I've had the same over the years. Of course when, in one job, I did get promoted faster that was wrong as well. It does seem as if some people want the workplace to accommodate only a certain demographic of women - whilst throwing older women, childfree women under the bus. [/quote]
Where has anyone on this thread suggested that only pregnant women should be accommodated and other women should be thrown under the bus? The only group being thrown under the bus on this thread is pregnant women. By other women.

Of course all groups of women also have their problems in the workplace - it’s because we are women! I bet the men just love seeing us fight amongst ourselves.

I agree - let’s not discriminate against any women. That means the onus is on employers to cover every single maternity leave, have policies which allow flex working for anyone, ensure that all leave is allocated fairly, and that childless women aren’t covering antisocial shifts or working additional hours to cover other women.

I kinda feel like this wouldn’t go down well with parents, though, which proves my point - you’re happy to sacrifice other women as long as it’s in pursuit of your chosen feminist issue. If that’s how it is, fine, but be honest about it (and maybe stop calling what you’re doing feminism!)

As I say, OP, YANBU. Despite everything I say above I do think it’s important that young women aren’t kept out of the workplace. I just wish employers got the balance right.

@islandbeach
Re men. DH can't even understand why it's an issue! He can't fathom that pregnancy is a valid reason not to apply for a position. Oh to be a man!

Why aren’t your workplace hiring maternity cover?

I worked in the NHS (non clinical) for decades and lost count of the number of times my workload significantly increased by virtue of maternity leave. Maternity cover wasn’t hired because there was no money for it. Have you any idea how much it costs to effectively pay two people to do the same job?

@islandbeach

It’s funny because I am persistently expected to sacrifice my plans and free time, and organise holiday etc., around the needs of my colleagues with kids. I’ve covered - in addition to my own job - 15 maternity leaves since 2015. I’m routinely told, when I mention this, that it takes a village, that I’m privileged because I’ll be promoted faster (we’re all on the same grade where I work), that being a parent is hard, that their kids will be paying my pension, and that this is a feminist issue.

You’ve got an employer problem. This used to grate on me before I had DC (I didn’t have an issue with employers but just the attitudes of some parents I worked with) and now I am a parent I would never expect someone without children to sacrifice when they take holidays etc. Why aren’t your workplace hiring maternity cover?

I know that I have an employer problem. I also have a colleague problem - many of my parent colleagues DO expect that. And they’re not alone; mumsnet threads are full of the same attitudes.

Public sector means money is tight and it’s never justifiable to arrange cover, in essence. Plus it’s a specialised role and few people are interested in covering it for a temporary period.

@AudacityBaby I agree re the fair conditions. And fair leave entitlement. I don't think parents shud get preferential treatment in these issues.
I personally think great reimbursement packages for employers to support maternity/paternity leave would improve the situation. Including remuneration for the extra recruitment and training involved in covering the leave. But eh one can dream

@Blossomtoes

Why aren’t your workplace hiring maternity cover?

I worked in the NHS (non clinical) for decades and lost count of the number of times my workload significantly increased by virtue of maternity leave. Maternity cover wasn’t hired because there was no money for it. Have you any idea how much it costs to effectively pay two people to do the same job?

I'm NHS as well, though clinical. Plus civil,service. There is no money so it's the same people that demands are being made of all the time. It doesn't seem to matter that we get burnt out - as long as others get to see their children in nativity plays and their year long mat leaves every other year, not to mention the endless Christmas leave demands and sulks when a childfree person dares to want to see their family.

If that makes me sound bitter, then maybe it's because after 30 years of this treatment in the workplace, I am.

I was brought up to believe that feminism supported all women. However I've come to realise that these days it means only supporting mothers. In which case feminism can fuck right off because I - and millions of women like me - have had enough.