Or is the competitive under eating on mumsnet harmful?

[foreverlobsters]

Full disclaimer- I have a history of eating disorders myself so am possibly over sensitive to this.

Have been reading through another currently active thread as well as what we eat in a day etc (which I occasionally post on and do find interesting). Why do people feel the need to post about their extremely low calorie days on here, or give potentially harmful advice? What's the incentive exactly- and are these people lying about how much they really eat or is most of the mumsnet population in an extreme calorie deficit? Do these people not see how selfish and damaging these posts can be?

Annoyedanddissapointed

absolutely and I think it what OP was getting at. average people without the OPs eating disorder history are still going to feel pretty shit about themselves after reading competitive under eating threads.

And yes I think if average people do post its then just a nice thread about what different people eat.

But if when a normal eater posts what they eat, only then to be told "oh my goodness, I could never manage that amount" it again makes that poster feel shit, and other people reading it, then less people post about an average diet. leaving a thread to competitive under eaters. it's like a vicious circle.

I don't actually feel bad when I read of posters eating less than me. I just think, well, maybe I burn more through activity than them.

When I was struggling to lose weight, I felt hopeful reading them that I wasn't 'magic' somehow (not needing of much food to an almost miraculous level) and there were others like me and worse off than me that put on weight easily if they ate what other people claim are healthy portions.

I did lose all my excess weight which puts me at the lower end of healthy BMI. But that is my small frame. I've a good body fat percentage now which wasn't the case at higher BMIs I did have to up my exercise and adjust portion sizes to achieve this. I also increased my salad/non starchy veg portions. Once I got used to the difference though I still felt like I was eating the same amount. Takes me the same amount of time to eat my meal as everyone else. It's amazing the physiological cues with appetite (along with physical cues such as sugar levels and heavily industrialised food designed to be extremely more-ish).

I think if you go in with the attitude that everyone has individual needs and copes with them differently then you are less likely to feel bad in comparisons.

And tbh what I eat would read as normal. I have just carefully adjusted portions for my needs. Fried eggs on toast for breakfast with tea. Chilli with cheese on top and a side of hummus on crackers with a coffee and a chocolate for lunch. Not particularly unusual eating.

@NewYearNewTwatName

Annoyedanddissapointed

absolutely and I think it what OP was getting at. average people without the OPs eating disorder history are still going to feel pretty shit about themselves after reading competitive under eating threads.

And yes I think if average people do post its then just a nice thread about what different people eat.

But if when a normal eater posts what they eat, only then to be told "oh my goodness, I could never manage that amount" it again makes that poster feel shit, and other people reading it, then less people post about an average diet. leaving a thread to competitive under eaters. it's like a vicious circle.

You are absolutely correct!

@Blondebakingmumma

I don’t get it. You have an ED, so instead of leaving the dieting threads well alone, you are going to report them???

Leave the poor people who are trying to be healthy alone. They may have diabetes and have been told by their dr to lose weight and are looking for support. You don’t know their story and you are not their dr so don’t know if they have been told to eat 1200 cal a day.

There are drs recommending fasting and using it in their clinics with patients. Again, it’s none of your business if people choose to eat in a time restricted window. Leave them be and stick to AIBU or relationships boards

I feel this is very unfair.

Firstly with regards to 'leave the poor people alone'- I'm not trying to attack dieters trying to better their health, and have repeatedly said I'm not attacking a 1200 calorie diet either- that's all come from other posters. So please don't insinuate I'm trying to attack a vulnerable group when I've never mentioned anything along those lines.

Secondly, the problem isn't just on the dieting boards, as many people have pointed out now. It eeks its way through to AIBU and chat on a fairly regular basis.

I am sorry about the 'poor people' you mention, and of course they should be able to access support they need to improve their diets, but that doesn't mean that other vulnerable people with present and historic eating disorders should be subject to damaging and disturbing posts that wouldn't be amiss on a pro ana site. Surely a balance of posts is possible with some moderation.

average people without the OPs eating disorder history are still going to feel pretty shit about themselves after reading competitive under eating threads.

But who is average? As I have said I don't feel shit. I might feel sorry for them if for one reason or another they can't eat very much.

Am I less average than you?

grasstreeleaf

I think you missed my point in the second post.

if it's just a thread about what different people eat its interesting but the food threads are a magnet to weight obsessed people, Who then comment on others intake being far too much for them..... and as there is likely more competitive under eaters already on the thread it swings out of balance.

Add in that as a society young girls and women grow up with the whole weight and appearance issue, for many women reading or posting, a teckless comment can easily make them question themselves and their food intake.

it's good you are happy with you, but I think you can also see my point.

@grasstreeleaf

And tbh what I eat would read as normal. I have just carefully adjusted portions for my needs. Fried eggs on toast for breakfast with tea. Chilli with cheese on top and a side of hummus on crackers with a coffee and a chocolate for lunch. Not particularly unusual eating.

Oh my god, did you just say eggS as in more than one? Gosh, I would be stuffed. But the again I wouldn't have the toast because I can't eat carbs at all. Few eggwites with dash of -enter obscure spice or sauce- will do me until dinner. No wonder we have obesity crisis.

Btw I am pretty sure I am that persone with obscure spices and sauce too, no hard feelings. And yes, your food looks absolutely normal and nice to people who aren't trying to make shit up

@Comedycook

lots of posters chimed in with the usual people just don't know what healthy bodies look like anymore, people are just jealous because you are slim, you sound perfectly healthy to me

Yes I hear this all the time!

But healthy bodies shouldn’t have rolls of fat. I’m not sure why pointing that out is such an issue! Yes bodies are different shapes and sizes. But rolls of fat are rolls of fat and you’ve got them because you’ve eaten too much.

Let’s call a spade a fucking spade eh.

I think the answer is to firmly remember what you eat really is not a competition if you read these threads. Whether that is how much you eat or how little. Secondly everybody's bodies really are different with very different needs and composition and weights.

That is the real solution. Otherwise discussion is brought to a standstill because everyone has competing needs and is triggered by different things. I might feel triggered by overeating you might feel triggered by under eating. If you can't do that maybe just step away and keep telling yourself everyone if different and it is stupid to compete over how much we eat.

But healthy bodies shouldn’t have rolls of fat

Hah! I still have an albeit small stomach overhang but am at lower BMI and in the 'fitness' range for fat percentage. I exercise more than most people. I thus maintain that for all my life the usual requirements are either not quite right for me and I am doing it wrong somehow or that bodies all do look a bit different and are made up differently.

grasstreeleaf

you are being disingenuous.

average food intake a cross many people people is very broad, then you have the extremes either side. The threads we are talking about have a hefty amount of one end of the extreme posting on them.
and I have already explained the vicious circle, and society pressure and judgement on women and girls, meaning it can often not take much for an average eater to feel out of sink, and a bit shit after a comment on their potion size or daily intake.

Think on a bit.

And I am a bit obsessed with all things weight, fitness and metabolism because I find it extremely interesting. I don't think that is necessarily dysfunctional. I am just drawn to subjects that to some extent even alludes the scientific community. Controversy is always endlessly fascinating. It's why people love to present polarised viewpoints.

@NewYearNewTwatName

grasstreeleaf

you are being disingenuous.

average food intake a cross many people people is very broad, then you have the extremes either side. The threads we are talking about have a hefty amount of one end of the extreme posting on them.
and I have already explained the vicious circle, and society pressure and judgement on women and girls, meaning it can often not take much for an average eater to feel out of sink, and a bit shit after a comment on their potion size or daily intake.

Think on a bit.

No, I've just probably read more of these threads than you. You get the competitive over eaters and the competitive under eaters. Along with the people that accuse everyone else of being disordered or dysfunctional or dishonest if they have a different viewpoint to their own.

Oh my god, did you just say eggS as in more than one? Gosh, I would be stuffed. But the again I wouldn't have the toast because I can't eat carbs at all. Few eggwites with dash of -enter obscure spice or sauce- will do me until dinner.
No wonder we have obesity crisis.

And I would say, really? We must burn different amounts of calories.

grasstreeleaf

oh for goodness sake, its wasn't about you 🙄

Are you the person who comments on how much more another poster has eaten?
I take it you aren't by everything you said. so what is it you a are defending here?

all I've done is explain how these threads do turn into competitive eating threads, and why the OP worries about them.

@grasstreeleaf

Oh my god, did you just say eggS as in more than one? Gosh, I would be stuffed. But the again I wouldn't have the toast because I can't eat carbs at all. Few eggwites with dash of -enter obscure spice or sauce- will do me until dinner. No wonder we have obesity crisis.

And I would say, really? We must burn different amounts of calories.

Mate

@Annoyedanddissapointed & @NewYearNewTwatName

Eh?

I'm just saying the solution is to just keep pushing the message that everyone has differing needs. Not silence just about every thread because of a wide range competing triggers around food, weight, health and metabolism.

[quote grasstreeleaf]@Annoyedanddissapointed & @NewYearNewTwatName

Eh?

I'm just saying the solution is to just keep pushing the message that everyone has differing needs. Not silence just about every thread because of a wide range competing triggers around food, weight, health and metabolism.[/quote]
This is the solution.

That and staying away if you have eating disorders.

yes we are on the same page apparently, but you keep arguing against it. Your posts are all over place.

@NewYearNewTwatName, arguing is a bit strong. I've a moderate, nuanced viewpoint. It can come across as agreeable or disagreeable depending upon how polarised your own viewpoint is.

The problem is posts are mere snippets of thoughts which continually interrupt each other and it takes a much more lengthy (book's worth) of prose to coherently do the subject matter justice.

@grasstreeleaf

And I am a bit obsessed with all things weight, fitness and metabolism because I find it extremely interesting. I don't think that is necessarily dysfunctional. I am just drawn to subjects that to some extent even alludes the scientific community. Controversy is always endlessly fascinating. It's why people love to present polarised viewpoints.

If you haven't read it already you might like 'Why we eat too much'. Lots of science and exploration about how our genes etc. Effect our metabolism.

@BelleOfTheProvince, thanks, certainly one for the list. I've just recently read the incredibly frustrating but entertaining 'Burn' by Herman Pontzer and the less frustrating and but equally enjoyable 'Exercised' by Daniel Lieberman.

@NewYearNewTwatName arguing is a bit strong. I've a moderate, nuanced viewpoint. It can come across as agreeable or disagreeable depending upon how polarised your own viewpoint is.wink

😂 that you are polarising my view.

you are very self congratulating, yet at the same time missing the bigger picture.

As I said we are actually on the same page, but you seem blind to the overall effect on many women who are less as enlightened as you.

the under eating threads do have a detrimental effect on many women not just poster with previous ED who are 'triggered' hate that word

As much as you wish everybody could be so confident in there diet and appearance as you. its simply isn't the case.

Were as I don't believe these food threads should not exist, I am trying to point out why they can be detrimental to peoples healthy relationship with food and their bodies. The threads need more input from average eaters to help with balance. but many are put off, I've posted the reasons already.

not commenting on how big someone else potion is, is a start.

We could could have a discussion on how best to achieve the goal of how to make these threads less about competitive under eating and more about the difference in bodies and the effects of different foods to different people.