To ask how people will cope with Universal credit cut.

[ponyexpress22]

Surely they aren't going ahead with cutting it by £20 a week? I'm shocked that the government could stoop this low. What the hell are they doing.

@Badgerbonce

PalmarisLongus Absolutely its because you should work to earn your money. Is that not normal now ?

You tell me, you refuse to work full time. You make that choice. You feel you're entitled to make that choice. But you'll criticise others for making the same choice.

Hypocritical at least, abhorrent at worst.

It's unbelievable that there are people who begrudge someone £20 a week to help with their living costs.
There but for the grace of god!
The same people actually believe that Dave and Sandra down the road who are on benefits actually spend their money living the high life, have the most expensive media package, latest techno and iPhones, while shopping at Waitrose, along with jetting off to Marbella twice a year to stock up on their cheap fags! Oh, and let's not forget Sandra's beauty treatments too.
Poverty? What poverty? Dave and Sandra are rolling in cash, no poverty in their house, which is paid for by the state, naturally, along with the council tax, school meals, uniforms and all the rest of it.
How could anyone working 500 hours per week on minimum wage begrudge them that?.

I'm very lucky in that I've never been in the position to have to claim benefits and I don't begrudge a penny of those who do.
I'm pretty sure that no one wakes up one morning and thinks ' sod working for a living, I'll just claim benefits'.
I'm also pretty sure that no one who is already on benefits wakes up one morning and thinks ' oh, I think I'll just have a couple more kids to get even more benefits'.
I'm more angry that a wealthy country pays their employees so little while the fat cats get ever fatter, and actually sit back while the fat cats rob the pensions of those low paid workers.
Money breeds money.
A country as wealthy as the UK actually having food banks and poverty is absolutely shameful. A country in which rather than making employers pay a living wage that keep people off the breadline, would rather pay that employer to keep those people at that level.....then wave £20 at them before snatching it away again.
Like bloody bullseye where the contestants lose out on the prize with a ' just look at what you could have won'!
Parents going hungry to ensure that their children eat?
Mother's dying to ensure their children eat?
House fires because parents have lit a candle to try to save electricity so they can make their children hit food? ( This happened in my town and sadly, the children perished)
People being driven into further debt and poverty?
People committing suicide due to their terrible circumstances?
I could go on.
And we begrudge £20 per week??
Dear God!

PalmarisLongus
I worked full time when i needed to support myself and continue to do so when I need the money.
I do not expect anyone to support my lifestyle that is the difference . Can you not see the difference ?

Iggly
I am.not saying that people should not get help i am talking about people actively choosing it as a lifestyle. There is a difference.

@OhGiveUp

Thing is.
When people are sat in the warm wren kitchens, sipping the Nespresso, in their mortgaged properties, reading the paper that was just freshly delivered, it's very easy for them to nod along with the stories of massive benefit cash hand outs that they read in the papers that are owned by billionaire Tory supporters.

Doesn't cross their mind that Benefit Porn is like sexual porn. It's not an accurate reflection of the reality.

If they looked at the reality, they'd find depression, debt, hunger, cold, death and deprivation.

That's why, when someone asks them to answer a simple question, as I did above they will fall silent. The facts don't back up their view, the view pushed on them by media owners.. those they aspire to be.

@Badgerbonce

PalmarisLongus I worked full time when i needed to support myself and continue to do so when I need the money. I do not expect anyone to support my lifestyle that is the difference . Can you not see the difference ?

So who is the we in your post then.... Are you going to tell me your partner... Your kid...

@Badgerbonce I have always worked full time, as does my husband, does this entitle me to sneer at the less fortunate and give them a kick when they're down, rather than a helping hand?
Again, there but for the grace of God.

@PalmarisLongus I completely agree.
The same sort of people who would kick a blind beggar in the street rather than give him a few pence.
It smacks of back in the reign of Henry VIII when the starving paupers used to go to the palace to watch the court feasting on a banquet in the hope that they would get a half eaten chicken leg to put in their starving bellies while the court laughed. Disgusting.

Most people want to work
This a very idealistic and naive reality.

Most people want to work minimum hours that give them a decent income, want to do a job they enjoy, that isn't stressful, for a nice boss that will allow all sort of flexibility and colleagues who are all supportive.

Sadly, only a minority of jobs offer these advantages and they go to very selected people who often had to work hard to get there.

When you start telling people they have to work 40 hours, in stressful and/or tiring jobs, without the flexibility to pick hours, for an income that gets you only a bit better than if you were on benefits, there are suddenly much fewer candidates and indeed,many who think it's not worth it and rather rely in benefits and then moan they moan they don't get enough. When the little extra they would get working might indeed be to be able to heat the house any time they are cold and buy the food they need and even love.

I haven't read the whole thread yet but this will damage the economy by removing all of the extra £20s from it.

People on UC usually spend all of their money every month through necessity.

All of their money goes straight back into the economy.

Rich people save their money.

PalmarisLongus
Thing is it does not have to be extremes of peoole sitting.in their warm expensive kitchens.
Our kitchen was £ 20 from fb .
It is falling apart.
If i want an expensive kitchen, I will work for it.
I also donate , and have done for 30 years to charity and often buy homeless people a sandwich or meal of their choice.
Please do not stero type people in the same way as you may assume that I do. I am not into povety porn or whatever. I am not talki ng about people who cant get jobs etc i am.talking abour people who.choose to work less to keep benefits and do this as a long term lifestyle choice only because i feel ,that their lifestyle ,on occssions,is supported by the taxpayer. I think for those activlwt choosing.that in many.cases is wrong as it.is expecting others to.fund a lifestyle choice in some instances.
Yes i work part time. As i said if i need more money i earn it.

Rich people save their money
The vast majority of our society are neither poor nor rich and spend the most back on the economy.

"We really love to hate the poor in this country. That's what comes from having an utterly toxic class system, I guess"

"No, we gate those with an entitled mindset and this thread has shown that sadly, there are many of them. "

Why do you assume there is nobody entitled at the 'top' of the pile, @vivainsomnia ? What a bizarre comment.

Prince Andrew thinking he's above the law, Boris taking bribes...I suppose that isn't entitled? That's what I'm talking about. A toxic class system. We are a nation of forelock tuggers and cap doffers. Can we stop living like we are in an episode of Downton Abbey, perhaps?

@Badgerbonce you know what, so what?

Are there people 'gaming' the system? Sure. So what? Why should then mean that all the people in real need should go without?

It's like going to Tesco to get your food shop and the shelves being bare because someone shoplifted something that day, so nobody can have anything.

You're seriously happy to see people - the disabled, kids, etc - be pushed further into poverty just on the off chance we 'catch out' the n'eer do wells?

Saw this just now, thought it was relevant..

Cutting universal credit by £20 a week is an “unconscionable” move that breaches international human rights law and is likely to trigger an explosion of poverty, the United Nations’ poverty envoy has said.

In an excoriating intervention alongside a letter to the UK government, Olivier De Schutter, the UN-appointed rapporteur on extreme poverty, told the Guardian that the withdrawal of the £1,000-a-year uplift from next month was “deliberately retrogressive” and incompatible with Britain’s obligation to protect its citizens’ rights to an adequate standard of living.

“It’s unconscionable at this point in time to remove this benefit,” he said, adding the decision to cut universal credit – which was boosted last year to help people get through the pandemic – was based on a “very ill-informed understanding” of its impact on claimants.

“For these people, £20 a week makes a huge difference, and could be the difference between falling into extreme poverty or remaining just above that poverty line … If the question is one of fiscal consolidation to maintain the public deficit within acceptable levels then you should raise revenues, not cut down on welfare at the expense of people in poverty.”
...
Ministers have argued that the withdrawal of the temporary universal credit uplift, introduced as a pandemic measure in April 2020 and worth £1,050 a year to more than 6 million out-of-work or low-paid working recipients, is necessary as the government focuses on getting people into work or working more hours as the economy opens up.

De Schutter said this did not justify the cut. “There are many studies showing that the condition for a healthy and well-qualified workforce to emerge is to provide adequate levels of social protection. You will not improve the productivity of workers or the rate of people employment by pushing people into poverty.”

www.theguardian.com/society/2021/sep/16/unconscionable-universal-credit-cut-breaks-human-rights-law-says-un-envoy

@SpittinKitten yes, I saw that. The UN envoy seems to have far more understanding and empathy than quite a few of the below posters, but I'm sure they still think they know best...

@Badgerbonce if you choose to work part time and can still afford to live then great. But you must have and/or someone else who also earns money. Low or non existent housing costs. No childcare costs.
Can you not see that other people don't have that and therefore need top ups. And yes maybe they could work full time. But maybe they couldn't for whatever reason and don't want to tell you. And if they could and they choose not then yes its annoying. But why should "genuine" cases suffer because of a few who play the system.

I did not say that the most in need should.not get it. I said that I do not like tge culture of avoiding addional work, as a lifestyle choice, in order to keep benefits. I have no issue at all about those who use it because they need it if thwy cannot get a job
I am talking about a spefic group of people who work part time amd expect benefits to support that lifestyle.and view that it is ok to feel entitlwd that others who work full time contribute to.that choice
As i said i do work part.time.i
The differnce is i do not expecr others tp pay for my choice.

@Badgerbonce you have very niche interests, then.

Over £80 a month less but coped before and will again. I’m just grateful I live in a country with a welfare system in place.

@Badgerbonce

I did not say that the most in need should.not get it. I said that I do not like tge culture of avoiding addional work, as a lifestyle choice, in order to keep benefits. I have no issue at all about those who use it because they need it if thwy cannot get a job I am talking about a spefic group of people who work part time amd expect benefits to support that lifestyle.and view that it is ok to feel entitlwd that others who work full time contribute to.that choice As i said i do work part.time.i The differnce is i do not expecr others tp pay for my choice.

So you don't use NHS? Tax subsidised buses? Or any other form of of tax supported and funded services like fire, police, ambulance etc?

You could work more to support them, you choose not too, so shouldn't benefit as much as others... Bet you'd be shocked if someone said otherwise though wouldn't you?
Not exactly fair you put in less than you take out is it? Or less than you could...

Good for goose... Good for gander..

I totallt agree.. that as you put it .
Genuine cases should not suffer. I am not arguing. I am talking about a demographic that openly turn down additional.work so that they keep benefits . And they do not have depwndants or physical or mental health issues. They just want to work part time but expect their choice to be paid for.

The people i kmow who do this are not the picture of poverty but are middle class " snoflakes " for want of a better word ,who.want an easy life. They are not the poor they are the boden brigade.. sterotypes used in humour that you get thepicture .

But how do you know they don't have mental health issues? 99% of my acquaintances don't know about mine. Or the physical ones. Sometimes it's easier to let people think i don't work for reasons other than my MH.

And if they have no dependents they aren't going to be entitled to a lot.

The award for spectacularly missing the point goes to...drum roll

...
@Badgerbonce

Prince Andrew thinking he's above the law, Boris taking bribes...I suppose that isn't entitled? That's what I'm talking about. A toxic class system
It is, very much so, but that's it the topic of this thread.