How long would you HOPE it would take for 999 ambulance call takers to answer the phone?

[nevereveragainneverever]

For many years I’ve had a recurring nightmare where something bad happens in the dream and I need to call an ambulance - but in my nightmare I get put on hold for ages while waiting for the ambulance service to pick up the phone.

Last night my nightmare came true.

I had to call 999 at 4.30am after getting some stern advice from my designated medical helpline to do so.

The 999 person asks which service I require. “Ambulance”, says I.

She tried to put me through but then said they were very busy ....and I was being placed on hold for the next available operator.

Now here's the thing; if you had a loved one who was seriously ill or injured / having a cardiac arrest / a child who was choking / not breathing etc - how long do you think you would reasonably have to be on hold to get the ambulance service to actually take your call so you could tell them about it?

I honestly thought it would be 20-30 seconds. After all they had no idea what I was calling about and whether someone was in grave danger.

Well….it was SIX AND A HALF MINUTES!!!!! 😩😠😲. On hold!!!! Before they even picked up the phone to ask if the patient was breathing!!

I am still so shocked by this. I’m NOT blaming them - that's not the point of this thread: they’re just so busy, I think understaffed by Covid and other issues and underfunding .

The 999 ambulance call handler took note of my symptoms and said it was a priority case due to chest pain, issues breathing, worrying oxygen sats, other symptoms.. and my underlying serious medical condition (cancer patient on chemotherapy, subsequently admitted to hospital).

The ambulance then took 2.5 hours to arrive!! On a priority call!

Again, I’m NOT blaming them; they had been delayed because they were flagged down in the road when en route to me by desperate parents whose child was sick…and whose own ambulance was delayed. It transpired that the ambulance they should have got had been commandeered by an aggressive, drunk 25 year old man who was demanding a trip to hospital by ambulance for his injured fist - that he got by punching a wall.

You couldn’t make it up! The crew did the right thing in stopping for the child in my view and again I'm not blaming the crew (who were fabulous) and who explained they have only had a total of ten minutes at base - in the last six months! The rest of the time it’s call out after call out - and he said it’s so often time wasters.

I despair. And thought you would like to know. I don't know what the solution is, but wanted to share my experience.

Rant over. Thank you for listening.

Not really a comment on the ambulance times but I have also got the same recurring dream - sometimes they don't pick up, sometimes I can't type or access my phone, sometimes they can't find me!!

I admire the ambulance services highly, how they have coped under the immense pressure on them. I was watching a programme one night and they were called to attend a priority choking call. No information other than that the patient was choking. Lights, siren and a massive rush to find the woman eating her dinner and describing reflux. They didn’t look impressed but remained professional and asked if she thought she should go to hospital (they can’t refuse if someone says they want to go to hospital), she bloody said yes and off she went wasting an Ambulance and A&E time! These type of people should be charged the price of the time they bloody waste! When she is swanning off in a priority ambulance someone may have been kept waiting whilst dangerously ill!

Oh gosh this is awful.

How are we going to get through winter, living with covid surely means living without back up medical care?

I've had ambulances 3 times for DD as a baby ( respiratory problems) - there within 5 minutes every time, referred from 111 in 2 cases, 999 in one but never waited more than 3 mins on hold.

Once for me hemorrhaging quite a lot with an incomplete miscarriage. They asked DH if I he thought I had bled a mugful of blood, he said yes, they arrived in 5 minutes, straight to a&e.

I'm sure I've been lucky it's not been busy etc but I think they are probably extremely well trained in prioritising certain things based on quickly something can go badly wrong.

The NHS is going to be given more money BUT they are now advertising dor 42 new special managers to be paid £270,000 per annum !!

How on earth is this a wise decision?
WE need more ftont line staff not office wankers.

When I gave birth unexpectedly at home it took them about 45 minutes, which was about 35 minutes after the baby had been born, thank goodness there were no complications.

I have called 999 when my child was choking. They answered immediately but the realisation that even if they got to him in five minutes he would have been dead.

My mum was outside of a&e in a ambulance in dec 20 for 7 hours! That's another reason there is no ambulance coming. Walk in patience got priority over her.

Terrible mismanagement short staff and years of cuts. If there was a token charge at source of contact I think it might deter the dicks.

I despair. And thought you would like to know. I don't know what the solution is, but wanted to share my experience.

I think the solution is putting more money into the ambulance service, training more paramedics and buying more ambulances. Where that money comes form is another question. Higher taxes, or spending existing taxes differently, is probably the answer.

Waiting for a 999 call to be answered really is a thing of nightmares 💐

@EatSleepRantRepeat

There are several times I've had to call 999 for the police in an emergency and kept getting the busy tone. Not sure if it was my network or their service not coping, but I remember the horror and the cold sweat when I realised no-one was coming because I couldn't get through.

Our control rooms, and those of the ambulance service, are on their knees. Managers are shit, don't have a clue and command teams change every 2 years. You can blame political interference in the shape of police and crime commissioners for a lot of the rot in the police service.

I did the job for 11 years so I know it could be anything from instant to minutes
If you've got 20 people handling calls and 50 waiting to be answered..,
Also some calls you have to stay on the line which could tie you up for an hour or more

Still people are arguing and getting really angry about the 1.25% increase in N.I. !!!!!!
This money is supposed to be going to the NHS and Social Care, who knows, maybe it will, maybe it won’t!!
This situation must be terrifying for people trying to get through to the Ambulance Service.
Unfortunately, more people will suffer until the NHS is sorted out.
People are still hung up about maybe elderly people getting “free” care in care homes , rather than seeing the bigger picture.
This underfunding will affect everyone in society, not just elderly people, who most people on Mumsnet want to have euthanised once they get to the age where they may require help and support.

I had this recently with the police.

There was a man outside my house, with a second person, and he was saying repeatedly ‘get down on your knees I’m going to kill you and drag your body home’.

It took so long for the police to answer that by the time they did he had gone. They then roamed the streets for him, and I never heard back if anything had happened.

It was terrifying waiting for them to answer.

Don’t worry, I’m sure I heard the NHS would be getting an extra £350 million a week.

I would add, if you can do a first aid course then do one or even videos on YouTube
Basic stuff like pressure for bleeding, water for burns, how to do chest compressions, what to fo if someone has a fit. Everyone should know it, from primary school up. Then it stops people putting butter on burns or leaving blood spurting out or putting spoons in peoples mouths when they're fitting...

I think the solution is putting more money into the ambulance service, training more paramedics and buying more ambulances.
That would be a sticky plaster over the increasing patients with serious mental health and addiction services the lack of services or inpatient beds.
There is a lot of people walking around who should have MH inpatient care.
I wonder how much of the ambulance services is side-lined for MH care that could be dealt with if services existed.

@DocAutumn

I've called an ambulance once and by the time it got there my family member was dead. I don't think people who can wait over 2 hours for an ambulance need one. They should get a taxi and then life or death emergencies would be attended to in a more timely manner.

Actually, it's the opposite. Anyone who doesn't need an ambulance will realise that while they're waiting and make other arrangements. It's only the people who really don't have any other option that will keep waiting and waiting.

I had to call 999 recently, I was advised to do so by a dr on the phone. They answered straight away but said they couldn't get an ambulance here for at least 2 hours and it would be better to put the patient in the car and drive to A&E.

The last time I had to call 999 I was waiting for about 3 mins, and this was before covid. It was for a visibly broken leg and suspected spinal injury. I was stressed, but kept thinking how glad I was that my friend was conscious and breathing.

I can't imagine how scary it would be if someone wasn't breathing - or you were calling for yourself while having a bad asthma attack or anaphylactic shock for example.

@Kfjsjdbd

I had this recently with the police.

There was a man outside my house, with a second person, and he was saying repeatedly ‘get down on your knees I’m going to kill you and drag your body home’.

It took so long for the police to answer that by the time they did he had gone. They then roamed the streets for him, and I never heard back if anything had happened.

It was terrifying waiting for them to answer.

And even if the call is answered promptly the chances are I have nobody to send as the response teams are usually well below minimum staffing levels - so I may have to divert a crew from a less life-threatening job, drag an available unit from another division 20 miles away, try to get a traffic unit to respond (which means then they can't go to any incoming serious accidents, DICs etc) or worst of all, we cannot send anyone.

I'm an A+E sister and the biggest issue we have is holding patients on the back of Ambulances.
Last night we had at least a dozen outdide some waiting for several hours to offload.
I could hear control calling down the radio that they had category 1 calls (cardiac arrests) waiting for a crew but they were all stuck outside. Most of the patients didn't need to be there. It's all very sad at the minute. We're all shitting ourselves because the Trust have no plan for winter!
We're on our knees in September.

It's an absolute shit show, nationally.
There are so many factors as to why there are frankly inexcusable delays in call answering and ambulance dispatch.
Not enough staff in the control room or on the road.
The worried well, those that can't get through to 111 so call 999 for advice.
The mildly unwell that seemingly cannot grasp self care.
Social problems, mental health problems, domestic problems. Elderly care (or lack there of)
Those that demand an ambulance because they pay their taxes (and unfortunately can't pay for taxis which would often be more appropriate) Those that when you turn up, the patient walks to the ambulance and a family member follows on in one of the fleet of cars that are sat outside.

And then there are the real emergencies. Stroke, heart attack, asthma attack, trauma - the very people that we should be helping we are failing.

Im a paramedic, in my trust it's not unusual to start a shift and to be told there are 200+ calls holding - that is jobs with no ambulances to send to. At the height of the 2nd wave, it was 700+ and call answering was 10minutes+.

The call handlers work from a script, even if the job is a blatant waste of time, they cannot refuse a resource if they trigger a response on the script. Call handlers get 'marked down' if they deviate from the script, hence the set of questions that seemingly infuriate a lot of people.
We are seeing demand now like the middle of winter. It has been a relentless summer.
We can only do one job at a time.
The pressure that control room staff are under is enormous, people are breaking down at work because of the relentless chaos in the room.
And yes we get flagged down, which we have to stop at. There are too many jobs at any one time for our dispatchers to warn us of in case we pass a call that has come in but we're on another one iyswim.

What needs to change?
Funding on all aspects of the NHS. Social care, elderly care, mental health care (which is woefully underfunded)
Better access and understanding of utilising urgent care services, GP sevices.
A large majority of people need to learn how to self care, to take ownership of their bodies and health.
We need to get away from the 'just want to be checked over' brigade.
Covid needs to fuck off.

This winter is going to be hell, like last winter.
I'm not sure how much more I can take, or my colleagues.
I'm regularly doing 15 hour shifts, not by choice, but if we get a long late job, that's home time fucked.
We get shouted out, screamed at, assaulted. We often walk in to volatile environments, hostility from patients and families and frankly who can blame them when they've waited many hours for an ambulance?
(Which makes it worse when said hostile people fucking walk on/walk off)

I've had a long day, can you tell?

I wonder how much of the ambulance services is side-lined for MH care that could be dealt with if services existed.

Plus the police. Our officers spend hours and hours and hours sitting with MH patients that they have had to detain under emergency police powers. We have to wait fir beds to be available - which can take 24 hours - all the while taking 2 officers off emergency response duties. I might start an early shift with 4 officers out of 12 committed with this sort of situation

The system is fucked

When you vote Tory, this is what you're voting for. It's been years of under funding and cuts.

They want the NHS to get so bad they can sell it off to their rich mates and all retire happily on the proceeds. They don't care about who dies in the meantime. And you're a fool if you think they do.