Scotland to trial 4-day working week

[MyBadHabitsLeadToYou]

With no consequential pay reduction.

I couldn’t find a thread on this. Apologies if I have missed one.

I’m not sure what to make of this. I already work a four-day week (so that my four year old isn’t in full time nursery) and it’s a nice balance. But sometimes a bit stressful because my workload is heavy so it’s one less day in which to get things done. However, soooo many people are so overworked and stressed and it would be good for mental health etc.

But I’m not entirely clear on how this will work in practice e.g small private businesses. Twitter views are very mixed. How will it benefit retail staff etc, will it only benefit the office workers…

Just wondering what the consensus is.

Neither my DH or I have had the type of job where there are hours of pointless meetings and admin tasks.
As Scots, we grew up with an incredible work ethic handed down from our parents and grandparents who held education in the highest regard.
Presenteeism is pointless and if folk can genuinely be as productive in 4 days as opposed to 5, I guess that’s all great.

But the mood music from the Scottish Govt always seems to be focused on free stuff = good.
You want to work fewer hours for the same pay? Let’s look into making that happen.
All with the backdrop of a fragile economy post pandemic and the ambition for Scotland to be Independent in the next 3-5 years.

The Scottish Govt has not proved itself to have the breadth or depth of talent to manage the economy, In fact there is a long list of failures eg CalMac ferries and Prestwick airport.
There seems to be little or no understanding of how business works.

It would be far more honest and realistic for the SG to inform all their supporters that if they want a thriving, independent Scotland, they better get prepared to work like hell, get entrepreneurial and forget about the free stuff.

No - it’s untrue that it would save money. Cutting support staff isn’t a money saving idea, it’s a poor management one.

It was proposed in several different local authorities

In Scotland?

@Pumperthepumper

It was proposed in several different local authorities

In Scotland?

Yes. Don't think it got through in any of them.

It was all to do with a massive black hole in local authority finances and massive cut backs were needed. Education is a soft target for that.

And although that proposal didn't go through due to backlash, the school budgets were squeezed hard anyway, just in a different way. Being on parent council really opened my eyes as to how squeezed the budgets were and the very real
Impacts that had on staffing.

Will this be all occupations, including emergency services? I'd like to know how this is going to work with the NHS backlog. Are people going to be paid for the day they don't work? I thought we had a Pandemic to pay for. Where is the SNP magic money tree? How are all these things going to be paid for? Genuine questions here as I really do not understand how we, as a country, can pay for all this.

I just don’t know why the SNP keep coming out with all of these financially unworkable ideas and free stuff. It just makes them look even more economically inept than they actually are.

Yes the idea is that you get paid for your day off Gothichouse40, and as to how Scotland will pay for this, I imagine they’ll trot out the ‘levers of power’ nonsense…

The Scottish Govt has not proved itself to have the breadth or depth of talent to manage the economy, In fact there is a long list of failures eg CalMac ferries and Prestwick airport.
There seems to be little or no understanding of how business works.

Good points. During the last run up, when people kept saying "what are you going to do without the oil?"

I was waiting and waiting for them to fill me with a confidence inspiring vision of Scotland: the powerhouse behind the green revolution.

We have 25% of the total capacity for the entire European continent. How is this not a no-brainer to someone smarter than the average mumsnetter?

Wind turbines built on the Clyde. Silicon glen driving electronics manufacturing. Transport and repairs in Rosyth. Heavy manufacturing in Aberdeen. R&D happening in Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen, Dundee etc.

I could have got behind that, I think. Land of Milk and Honey for sure but at least it's showing a bit of ambition.

Instead we have a renewable construction and green manufacturing jobs crisis. 1,700 employed compared to the 28,000 new jobs promised.

Slow hand clap.

Being on parent council really opened my eyes as to how squeezed the budgets were and the very real Impacts that had on staffing.

As I said, I’m very surprised they were so candid with you about cutting support staff. Any sniff of that around here and people riot.

@Pumperthepumper

Being on parent council really opened my eyes as to how squeezed the budgets were and the very real Impacts that had on staffing.

As I said, I’m very surprised they were so candid with you about cutting support staff. Any sniff of that around here and people riot.

They had little option really. Massive cuts were needed. Can assure you people weren't happy.

It pretty much happened anyway but by the back door.

So your children now have fewer support staff? How are they meeting ratios? How are they providing art/language/PE?

@Pumperthepumper

So your children now have fewer support staff? How are they meeting ratios? How are they providing art/language/PE?

Mine are now at high school but pe generally was done by their class teacher. Art was a visiting teacher but much less frequently. Non contact time provided by other teachers/depute/headteacher. Music the same as art, much less frequently than it was previously.

Thanks Whycan. Im honestly struggling as to how this is all going to work. I had watched the FM the other day and she spoke about billions for this and that, yet I thought we owed billions. As you can gather economics is not my strong point. Why does it seem the way FM speaks, we lìve in a very wealthy country, yet why don't I see this wealth in my own community?

Scotland spends money in a way that makes it seem wealthy (free ipads / bikes for kids, free bus passes, prescriptions, tuition fees) abd yet neglects really basic things like mental healthcare (CAMHS waiting lists are over 18 months in Edinburgh), roads, closing libraries and leisure centres.

They could also do with working out out how we can live without the Barnett formula, how we can fund projects to design / build and implement green energy generation in Scotland.

The U.K. is in masses of debt and Scotland owns its share of that. We are currently protected by the Bank of England being able to borrow money at a low interest rate due to its historical standing as a reliable borrower. Independence would be a disaster. The SNP does all it can to make it seem like we are a rich country to cover up what a disaster independence would be and get you to vote for it.

@Whycangirlsbesonasty

Scotland spends money in a way that makes it seem wealthy (free ipads / bikes for kids, free bus passes, prescriptions, tuition fees) abd yet neglects really basic things like mental healthcare (CAMHS waiting lists are over 18 months in Edinburgh), roads, closing libraries and leisure centres.

They could also do with working out out how we can live without the Barnett formula, how we can fund projects to design / build and implement green energy generation in Scotland.

The U.K. is in masses of debt and Scotland owns its share of that. We are currently protected by the Bank of England being able to borrow money at a low interest rate due to its historical standing as a reliable borrower. Independence would be a disaster. The SNP does all it can to make it seem like we are a rich country to cover up what a disaster independence would be and get you to vote for it.

Well, arguably free prescriptions, bus passes and education is fairly basic to a civilised society.

Scotland is always going to be more socialist than England.

Arguably. And we’re not talking education but university education. If they charged tuition fees and ploughed the money into regaining the ground that schools have lost over the past few years we might be getting somewhere.

@Whycangirlsbesonasty

Arguably. And we’re not talking education but university education. If they charged tuition fees and ploughed the money into regaining the ground that schools have lost over the past few years we might be getting somewhere.

You disagree that free university education is fairly basic for a civilised society?

I just think - looking at the utterly dire situation that Scottish finances are in - that we cannot afford such largess. I would much rather kids didn’t have to wait 18 months for CAMHS appointments. That is truly disgusting. Why should someone working in a low paid job pay taxes for middle class parents to send their kids to uni free? Tuition fees are a loan that students in the rest of the UK pay back when their earnings are high enough. I have no problem with that whatsoever!

@Whycangirlsbesonasty

I just think - looking at the utterly dire situation that Scottish finances are in - that we cannot afford such largess. I would much rather kids didn’t have to wait 18 months for CAMHS appointments. That is truly disgusting. Why should someone working in a low paid job pay taxes for middle class parents to send their kids to uni free? Tuition fees are a loan that students in the rest of the UK pay back when their earnings are high enough. I have no problem with that whatsoever!

So your solution to readdress the balance is to stop paying tuition fees?

What do you think that will do to the attainment gap? Do you think that will make a fairer society, or a more divided one?

Actually the introduction of tuition fees in England narrowed the attainment gap, the opposite of what was expected to happen:

ifs.org.uk/bns/bn133.pdf

[quote Whycangirlsbesonasty]Actually the introduction of tuition fees in England narrowed the attainment gap, the opposite of what was expected to happen:

ifs.org.uk/bns/bn133.pdf[/quote]
That’s not what the report says.

The attainment gap was narrowed following the introduction of tuition fees thought wasn’t it, whereas in Scotland it remains wide according to audit Scotland earlier this year.

@Whycangirlsbesonasty

The attainment gap was narrowed following the introduction of tuition fees thought wasn’t it, whereas in Scotland it remains wide according to audit Scotland earlier this year.

Not because of tuition fees though. Did you you read that report?

I did thanks. You say above that you thought the introduction of tuition fees would have a harmful effect on the attainment gap. This was not found to be the case in England, for a variety of reasons. Perhaps if Scotland introduced tuition fees they might have more money to address the wide attainment gap?

@Whycangirlsbesonasty

I did thanks. You say above that you thought the introduction of tuition fees would have a harmful effect on the attainment gap. This was not found to be the case in England, for a variety of reasons. Perhaps if Scotland introduced tuition fees they might have more money to address the wide attainment gap?

Well it’s unlikely they would unless they also introduced all the other policies surrounding it. Which would cost, wait for it: money.

Prescriptions then! Will we charge for those now?