To think the proposed NI increases for social care are unfair?

[shouldbeworkingmore]

I recognise that social care needs funding but think that this proposal unfairly targets the younger generations. Plus we already have income taxes by stealth as the thresh holds have been frozen & wage stagnation is likely to continue for the next decade.

@BrendaBubbles

then an extra 5% on Corporations Tax on our profits

6% no? It's going up from 19% to 25% except for the tiniest firms/one person bands. Or to look at it another way, a 31.5% increase in the absolute amount you'll pay.

Corporation tax was 26% in 2011. It was reduced at the same time as austerity decimated public services. I bet you weren’t complaining during the last decade @BrendaBubbles. The government, like the Lord, gives and takes away.

Boris was asked by Sky News about further tax rises and wouldn’t deny there wouldn’t be any.

@BrendaBubbles

then an extra 5% on Corporations Tax on our profits

6% no? It's going up from 19% to 25% except for the tiniest firms/one person bands. Or to look at it another way, a 31.5% increase in the absolute amount you'll pay.

Wow I thought it was 20% - tbh I try not to look at the taxes we pay. Just read an article suggesting that good bosses should give their staff increases to offset the NI rise otherwise they will experience true hardship....so add on another 1.25% to that list! Payroll is looking more appealing by the minute or retirement.

@Parker231

I can’t find up to date information but the last survey I saw showed that less than 10% of the working population continued in work after state retirement age and the majority who do, are in part time and lower paid roles. Putting National Insurance on post retirement salaries isn’t going to be a huge source of revenue for government?

Plenty of pensioners pay income tax on occupational pensions - some of which are very generous. Others, certainly, are probably shite - and those people will be paying less or no income tax on that pension income.

Which is why it would be fairer to have this on income tax to capture all forms of income, rather than just employment incomes.

Which is why it would be fairer to have this on income tax to capture all forms of income, rather than just employment incomes. Had he added the tax to incomes - apparently they would have needed a 2% income tax increase - but they only need to get a 1.25% on NI because they would get Employers to pay 1.25% too.

Employer NICs are so sneaky. It’s money that is clearly part of the payroll budget but that employees don’t get. It’s basically a stealth 13% tax on every employee (over the starting point).

@BrendaBubbles

then an extra 5% on Corporations Tax on our profits

6% no? It's going up from 19% to 25% except for the tiniest firms/one person bands. Or to look at it another way, a 31.5% increase in the absolute amount you'll pay.

Unless you are Amazon, Starbucks etc of course - then you just don't bother to pay ti.

A tax rather than NI rise would have been fairer but it would alienate the ultra rich who pay income tax (sometimes) but can dodge NI.

The wealth of UK billionaires is up by £106,500,000,000 in the pandemic. But instead of making them pay more, the Tories are raising NI which hits low paid and young workers the hardest. Social care should be funded with a wealth tax, not a tax on the working class.

@DynamoKev

A tax rather than NI rise would have been fairer but it would alienate the ultra rich who pay income tax (sometimes) but can dodge NI.

Not true there's a limit on Employee NI Contributions Earn £184 to £967 a week (£797 to £4,189 a month) -12% Over £967 a week (£4,189 a month) -2% So the super rich (employees)get hit at 2% whilst income tax rarely has a limit. Depends what you call super rich and I'm not opening that can of worms. Employers pay 13.8% NI on everything above £170 a week - no limit. I do think all these taxes - Income, VAT, Council, NI, Capital Gains, Dividends are stealth to an extent - hard to understand and easy to leave one group penalised unfairly.(and I'm not talking about the rich!)

news.sky.com/story/pmqs-starmer-says-johnsons-national-insurance-hike-for-social-care-reform-will-see-care-workers-receive-tax-rise-but-no-pay-increase-12402081

So much for reforming social care - the key workers are now going to be worse off at a time when they are needed more than ever.

@Parker231

news.sky.com/story/pmqs-starmer-says-johnsons-national-insurance-hike-for-social-care-reform-will-see-care-workers-receive-tax-rise-but-no-pay-increase-12402081

So much for reforming social care - the key workers are now going to be worse off at a time when they are needed more than ever.

Oh good, so I'll get less take home pay each month, and get to see it go into my employers pocket, while I work my arse off, in shit conditions, not getting sick pay if I am ill, having my 'free' uniform thrown at me as a 'perk', to ensure that they can maintain or increase their profits.

Sounds fair, my job is a 'vocation' after all, don't even know why I expect to be paid anything!

@Puzzledandpissedoff

Trouble with only targeted extras is the admin cost of working out who qualifies. Better just to raise taxes on higher incomes, and yes, we personally would pay more if they did that

@Blossomtoes

think the public fell hook line and sinker for the atriums and shiny new hospitals and fudged waiting list targets, and it's only becoming apparent as years pass and people need the NHS that it's not fit for purpose

The waiting lists weren’t fudged. The stats are freely available. The improvement in the first decade of this century was massive, to say otherwise is Tory propaganda. The deterioration has happened in the last ten years, thanks to austerity.

The "fudging" was that the NHS basically ignored you if a deadline was missed. It no longer mattered whether you were languishing in A&E for 10 hours rather than 4 hours or whether your urgent cancer referral was 2 months rather than 2 weeks. That's where the "fudging" was. The problem was the cliff edge targets. There was no urgency for those who missed a target.

The "fudging" was that the NHS basically ignored you if a deadline was missed. It no longer mattered whether you were languishing in A&E for 10 hours rather than 4 hours or whether your urgent cancer referral was 2 months rather than 2 weeks. That's where the "fudging" was. The problem was the cliff edge targets. There was no urgency for those who missed a target. Completely agree with this - being stuck in A&E after a climbing frame landed on my foot - the nurse explained that now I had passed the 4 hour threshold (with two kids under 4 by my side), I would drop off the list - he then proceeded to show me my X-ray and ask me if I thought my foot was broken!!! Targets can cause all sorts of unintended consequences - they need to be used very carefully - you only have to look at the mess they have created in schools - league tables have lead to some very poor behaviour by schools.

That may have been true in some parts of the NHS. In the trust I worked for targets were taken very seriously. The entire workforce bust a gut to meet them otherwise there was public shaming when the league tables were published. I remember calling a colleague in 2011 to point out I was about to reach 18 weeks for my gallbladder removal. My surgery was scheduled for the following week.

What has happened to money raised by the increase in Council Tax last year earmarked for social care?
Also who is in charge of administering the millions raised for the NHS by Captain Tom?

Yes, captain Tom , his charity single , the publicity he got raised millions. Where did that all go ?

I was only thinking about all those millions this morning and wondering where the money went.

Yes, it went quiet about Captain Tom after he died and I've not heard any more about where the money actually ended up.
I know people will say it was a ' drop in the ocean ' but many people did contribute to this or downloaded the single etc
Would be nice to know where it was distributed?

The money raised by Captain Tom wasn’t for the NHS but for NHS charities.

There's plenty online about where the money has gone.

Charitable Money raised for NHS cannot be used for day to day running of the NHS. It has to be for a specific item or in Tom's case, for NHS charities together which provide funding for "extras" for patients, families and staff.