To not invite my sister to my wedding

[namechanged1090]

In my immediate family only my dad and I have a relationship with my sister. She literally cannot be in the same room as my mum and my 4 brothers intensely dislike her. Two of the 4 boys are so incredibly laid back I don’t think I have ever known them have a falling out with anyone. One is normal and the final one is absolutely precious, so anyone can fall out with him!

I am getting married and I don’t feel like I can invite her to my wedding. She will upset everyone by being there. My cousin had a christening just before covid and she mocked my 7 year old niece with a lazy eye, really horrible behaviour and not a one off. I just don’t think I can tolerate this on my big day. I would be on egg shells. Would I be terrible to not invite her? I don’t know how I will broach this with her, I was bridesmaid at her wedding she is going to be devastated.

@ExtraOnions

She says that it was just a small discrete comment and there is a lot that can be done for lazy eyes these days.

Well why shouldn't she go to that restaurant?

Do you ever tell her when you find her personal remarks uncomfortable?

Also, intensely laid back brothers don't intensely hate other people, do they? Are you sure they are really laid back, or is this just the personality the family myth has given them. Whilst making your sister the scapegoat.

[quote namechanged1090]@godmum56

I have seen lots of things over the years where she just says really spiteful things about people often in front of them which is wrong for the person and super uncomfortable to the person hearing about it.

A lot of times it is commenting on appearance or wealth. To think of one example I was at a family event and she started saying "god mum has got really fat" Another time talking about a mixed race child's nose... I honestly think she thinks she is funny but it is rude and unpleasant and people don't move on they get annoyed hold grudges or avoid contact.

To me one of the most annoying thing she does is turn up to events she has not been invited. I lived abroad for a while I organised a dinner with parents and one of my brothers and his wife. She turns up sits and the next table. For context I am 1 or 6 and they weren't all invited, too hard to schedule that so I just went with who I knew would be around. Another time I went on holiday to somewhere we used to go as a child... she arrives the exact same week.... [/quote]
then why do you need the approval of strangers?

[quote namechanged1090]@ExtraOnions

She says that it was just a small discrete comment and there is a lot that can be done for lazy eyes these days. [/quote]
…which is fine

If she said what your cousin said, and was being very loud about it, I take it other people heard and can corroborate (or not)

You said earlier, that she’s not said any horrible things for years, and that she has grown and matured - so when when were these things being said ?

TBH, both you and your family sound toxic … nobody forgives, nobody forgets, nobody moves on, everyone gossips.

So what if she booked the same restaurant, she clearly could make the meal, you just didn’t invite her. As for the holiday, did she even know you where going?

You just don’t want here there, as your brothers feelings are more important, and you are trying to retrofit your excuses. I can’t help but feel sorry for her. Just be honest “I don’t want you at my wedding, as other people are more important to me, and they are unable to move on from things said years ago without a grovelling apology”

@MrsBertBibby

Well my brother who has mixed race kids just couldn't handle the comments about his kids appearance and his wife was even more angry. What my sister thinks is funny they think it is racist. Personally I think it is very hard to shrug that off. Even though I don't think she is malicious I can see why it is racist.

It is like she doesn't have a filter. She says anything she wants and then expects people to be all friendly with her... then she gets annoyed with them and says more extreme things because she doesn't have normal impulse control

She’s sociopathic. There will be drama either way. So just don’t invite her and make sure none of your guests/your mum facilitate her being there.

@ExtraOnions

I didn't ask anyone collaborate the eye thing. It just gives a toxic story oxygen. That cousin would not know her well. Maybe she is a stirrer, I don't have any other evidence to support that she is but maybe she is.

The behaviour is consistent with things that have happened in the past. She comments about peoples appearance in a derogatory way for eg I have heard her once say x has the most lively hair. It is always thinks like x has a flat nose.....

Personally I would like to see her treated with a bit more forgiveness but I do understand you can't make comments people see as racist. When that is pointed out keep saying things that could be seen as racist. Seriously how hard is it to not talk about people's appearance!!! If you do upset people how hard is it to be humble and apologise? If you can't manage that you need to involve someone else to manage the communication.

Btw she did know I was going on holiday that week because the person who owns the house told her, she decided to go the same week... pay for accommodation and visit the people we know on the same days.

Of course she has the right to go the the restaurant any day she wants but it is odd behaviour, no?

I think that the real toxic person is your mother.

I'm your sister in my family. My mother and I clashed from an early age and she bullied me, put me down, dismissed me throughout my life. My brother was her favourite and if you ask him about me, I was rude, sulky, argumentative and couldn't be bothered with family. That view of me is shared by many other family members who worshipped my mother and the golden child.

My sister, however, remembers my childhood as something different. Instead of the sulky, argumentative child my brother saw, she saw the child who was scared to speak for fear of being shouted at. The child who was thrown across the room for daring to seek her mother's attention when she was ill and the teenager with crippling lack of self confidence who didn't even get a well done from her mother for getting into medical school (when my brother got a car when he scraped through his Alevels and got into an agricultural college).

My poor sister was the one in the middle of this. She ended up not speaking to any of us for a long time because she was sick of being stuck in the middle. It was only when she married thst she chose who in her family she wanted a relationship with - and that was my father and me. We are now a close threesome, ,y mother having died a few years ago (and no I didn't bother to see her before she died and no I didn't grieve) and none of us bother with my brother.

Same family, three siblings, three experiences.

[quote namechanged1090]@ExtraOnions

I didn't ask anyone collaborate the eye thing. It just gives a toxic story oxygen. That cousin would not know her well. Maybe she is a stirrer, I don't have any other evidence to support that she is but maybe she is.

The behaviour is consistent with things that have happened in the past. She comments about peoples appearance in a derogatory way for eg I have heard her once say x has the most lively hair. It is always thinks like x has a flat nose.....

Personally I would like to see her treated with a bit more forgiveness but I do understand you can't make comments people see as racist. When that is pointed out keep saying things that could be seen as racist. Seriously how hard is it to not talk about people's appearance!!! If you do upset people how hard is it to be humble and apologise? If you can't manage that you need to involve someone else to manage the communication.

Btw she did know I was going on holiday that week because the person who owns the house told her, she decided to go the same week... pay for accommodation and visit the people we know on the same days.

Of course she has the right to go the the restaurant any day she wants but it is odd behaviour, no? [/quote]
Ah right … so now she’s racist - funny how you keep upping the ante when anyone calls out your / your brothers toxic behaviour.

Even if you do take out who did what, you do know for a FACT that she will cause some upset on the day. Do you really want to look back on the day, or hear about it constantly from other people that she has done something?
I think the restaurant thing is just creepy, and intended to cause upset. Your dad is exactly right here. Having her there is going to be an issue, whichever way you look at it. I think it comes down to having your brothers there or her. You will have to choose.

It is pretty weird, OP, that you've finally got round to her alleged racism after footling around with long-ago car crashes and unexpected restaurant-crashing.

Also, did your brother actually hear what she is said to have said about his child? Or is it another comment reported at third or fourth hand?

Your mother seems to get off scott free here.

@Confused102

There are a lot of creepy things like that. It was one of the reasons I said at that point I needed less intensity but that made it worse. Again not knowing when to back off.

Haven’t RTFT but anyone who says that about a 7 yo - it’s a no from me - I’d cut them out.
Apart from that, from what you say, the rest of your relationship with your sister doesn’t sound too healthy tbh

A few posts ago you were saying how lovely she was. Now she's a creepy racist. Make your mind up!

None of this adds up, OP. I think you and your family should cut the cord and let the poor woman go. But you need her as your moral punch bag so you all feel like the good guys.

@MrsBertBibby

I don't actually think she meant to be racist but does that make it ok? I don't think so. I do think the mother of said child seen it as racist and was raging. After being told in no uncertain terms by my brother and dad she continues to comment on other things about appearance of said child... petrol to a fire for the parents.... surely she could just not do that?

I wouldn't invite someone who is incapable of going to an event without insulting people and making racist comments. She doesn't even apologise, so you can't blame them for not wanting much to do with her.

yeah drip feed info is always a bit of a warning sign

TBH none of your family sound delightful. I'd be inclined to leave your mother off the guest list too. At least that's fair - why invite her and not your sister if it's just the 2 of them who can't be civil in public? If you leave the pair of them out then it shows you are not willing to tolerate either of their pathetic behaviour. I'd say your sister has her own demons from her upbringing that you might not even understand.

As for suggesting mediation etc - it's really not your role to get involved. They are all adults and if any of them want to sort out the huge flaws in their respective relationships, then let them do it themselves. Maybe they are all quite happy to continue their lives without contact. We don't talk to SIL. No amount of coaxing Dh would make him do mediation or counselling to get back on track with her. Their relationship is over. It's been accepted in the wider family and quite frankly, it's nobody else's business. If anyone tried to involve themselves he'd be sure to tell them to F off.

She says schedule stuff invite everyone, don't take sides and let the sort it out themselves

I agree with your cousin, although on here mumsnet hates family’s for some reason so you’ll be told not to invite her.

I may not be following or understanding this correctly but how is a comment that a child has a lazy eye racist?

OP could your sister have autism. My partner has autism and literally has no filter, he says what he sees. To him he is stating what he sees as true. I've, that person has weird eyes, how do they see, that person's nose is big etc. He's not saying it to be hurtful, he's just describing what he sees

@MrsBertBibby

She is nice when it is her family or when I have met her friends she is a good friend, although itch they often end quickly. She gets good jobs but they end quickly too. She has been invoked in so many HR situations at work... like every single job.

Any situation she is remotely uncomfortable she is very unpredictable and not at all able to see others perspective they are wrong and she is right. So despite not being able to deal with confrontation she has a lot of it!

@HalzTangz

This has occurred to me before. Although with new people she is a social butterfly. So can be charming and rein it in. More she doesn't know how to stop. Her intensity can be unbearable and she just doesn't get that every healthy sibling relationship needs space.... she gets worse as of trying to annoy me but I know she isn't.... it is like there is some sort of social gap.

@HalzTangz

The lazy eye thing was only 2019. The nose comment was 20 years ago and that one was kind of relentless.... even when told the mother of the child seen it as a comment relating to her ethnic heritage

[quote namechanged1090]@HalzTangz

This has occurred to me before. Although with new people she is a social butterfly. So can be charming and rein it in. More she doesn't know how to stop. Her intensity can be unbearable and she just doesn't get that every healthy sibling relationship needs space.... she gets worse as of trying to annoy me but I know she isn't.... it is like there is some sort of social gap.[/quote]
My partner is the same, social with new people and to a degree able to rein things in more (this I believe is more to being taught what he can and can't say), However he still makes remarks on occassions (though this is mainly said to me directly rather than the person he is commenting about), I'd rather it be this way than a person being offended when he's not meaning that to be the outcome.
He also struggles to stay in one workplace for long because he struggles with the 'no filter' he has. He avoids HR though by leaving voluntarily to work elsewhere.