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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The house buying process just sucks any joy there is out of buying a new home.

102 replies

flashbac · 29/08/2021 09:50

Yes I know renting can be dire and buying a house in this crazy market is increasingly becoming like something for the privileged but can I just have a moan about how flipping joy-sucking the bloody English process is?
I want a pack I can view that has a survey report, the land registry stuff, the epc, the search reports and any other relevant documents relating to the property and its condition, before I make an offer. Is that too much to ask for?

OP posts:
madnessitellyou · 29/08/2021 11:31

YANBU. I'd quite like to move. We've got a lot of equity in our house and we'd like to move, have a smaller mortgage and be done with said mortgage in 5 years. It would be entirely possible. However, the very thought of going through the process means it won't be happening. Last time we moved, the chain got bigger by the day. When we started, our vendors were going somewhere chain free and our buyers were first time buyers. Allegedly. By the time we exchanged we were link four in a chain of eight. On the day we moved we handed in our keys to the estate agent only to spend the next four hours sitting outside our new house with all our possessions waiting for completion.

I would say though that our solicitors were excellent. The problem were elsewhere in our ever expanding chain.

SweetPetrichor · 29/08/2021 11:31

This makes me so glad to be in Scotland! I just got the keys to my house on Friday, which was 6 weeks + 2 days after making the offer.
I had access to the home report, etc before making an offer. In the intervening weeks it was just the process of concluding missives.
Gazumping is pretty much non-existent in Scotland because it is a disciplinary offence for a solicitor.
It is so simple compared to England!

alwayscrashinginthesamecar1 · 29/08/2021 11:34

The English system is ridiculous. I'm in Australia and we offered on a house on December 6th, and moved in at the start of Feb. We would have been in two weeks earlier if it wasn't for Xmas , and we went on holiday the day after making the offer, which delayed us another week. I've seen people build houses quicker here than buying and selling in England!

monogoo · 29/08/2021 11:34

When I was a FTB I was gazumped twice, it was heartbreaking.

Cabbagewhites · 29/08/2021 11:39

I agree @flashbac it makes no sense whatsoever.

Somebody has to be gaining from this ridiculous system for it to still be in existence.

Who could that be? (genuine question)

Grinch48 · 29/08/2021 12:16

Oh god I’m dreading this
I’m going to be selling my parents house as they have both passed away so once probate is finished I will be able to sell it .
I was actually thinking of paying for a survey so that I could offer to potential buyers to make things easier as there is bound to be stuff that needs doing

Can I actually do this

It’s an old house so would be sold as a doer upper
But it has a new boiler and GCH so that’s something

DynamoKev · 29/08/2021 12:33

@flashbac

I wish people voting yabu would say why. The current system is torturous! In which other world would you verbally agree to purchase something, start forking out money and getting excited about it and then something crops up so your hopes are dashed?
I bet they are all lawyers Grin
DynamoKev · 29/08/2021 12:34

@Cabbagewhites

I agree *@flashbac* it makes no sense whatsoever.

Somebody has to be gaining from this ridiculous system for it to still be in existence.

Who could that be? (genuine question)

Lawyers
monogoo · 29/08/2021 12:36

Also why are EA generally so crap?

ThreeLittleDots · 29/08/2021 12:39

It's crap, but made better we've found by using a particular broker who sells online conveyancing services. If her clients drop the ball she gets involved and on we proceed.

DynamoKev · 29/08/2021 12:41

@alwayscrashinginthesamecar1

The English system is ridiculous. I'm in Australia and we offered on a house on December 6th, and moved in at the start of Feb. We would have been in two weeks earlier if it wasn't for Xmas , and we went on holiday the day after making the offer, which delayed us another week. I've seen people build houses quicker here than buying and selling in England!
^This. In Aus (IIRC) everything is on the land registry and there's a standard contract of sale, so you don't need a lawyer. If you sign but you can't get finance, you are allowed to cancel without penalty and no-one has really lost out because they haven't spent thousands on lawyers. It was incredibly frustrating for me having to listen to my lawyer telling me about all the naughty clauses the seller had tried to put in our contract and how brilliantly he'd reworded them. For fuck's sake, it's buying a house, not the merger of a fucking international bank. I know he was obliged to look after my interests and I am grateful but it's an utterly ridiculous system.
ThreeLittleDots · 29/08/2021 12:41

Plus actually many homeowners could take a lot more early responsibility by getting their ID sorted and all paperwork together before waiting to be asked for it

the80sweregreat · 29/08/2021 12:41

People who have had inherited money via parents homes are having a long process trying to sell them as probate can take a while and then the whole selling side of it takes forever too it seems. I know a few people who are having problems with this. My dh and I had parents who remained council tenants , so we just had house clearance to do which was bad enough to sort and clear.
I think that the whole system should be looked into : it's sad it takes so long and can cost loads, then go wrong.
It's never a loss for the lawyers is it ?

DynamoKev · 29/08/2021 12:42

@monogoo

Also why are EA generally so crap?
Like lawyers (and lenders) - all shite so no incentive to improve.
DynamoKev · 29/08/2021 12:43

Why do lawyers always quote prices plus VAT too?
Is there anyone buying a house who doesn't pay VAT?

VestaTilley · 29/08/2021 12:44

@amiadillo the last labour government wanted to bring it what you suggested and they were eaten alive by estate agents, the press and the Tories, so it was dropped.

DynamoKev · 29/08/2021 12:44

If lawyers were interested in reforming it, it'd have been done already.

WhenwillSleephappen · 29/08/2021 12:46

@Trillogy101

I used to be an estate agent, a long time ago, so knew how awful the process was but I started trying to sell last year and I can honestly say it's been the worst year of my life! If it's not for the spectacularly awful solicitors, buyers changing their minds at the last minute and sellers suddenly deciding they want and extra £10,000 a week before exchange of contracts, it's the idiotic estate agents who lie through through their back teeth constantly. We've completed on our sale and gone into rented now for a break before we buy again..... my mental health is pieces 😢
I’m glad you’ve also mentioned the lying estate agents - I don’t know why they do it! Our estate agent said our buyers weren’t in a rush. Turned out they were so ultimately it fell through. Would’ve been easier to know the truth from the start and we would have never chosen that buyer!

I really hope things get better for you.

WhenwillSleephappen · 29/08/2021 12:47

@flashbac

Yes I know renting can be dire and buying a house in this crazy market is increasingly becoming like something for the privileged but can I just have a moan about how flipping joy-sucking the bloody English process is? I want a pack I can view that has a survey report, the land registry stuff, the epc, the search reports and any other relevant documents relating to the property and its condition, before I make an offer. Is that too much to ask for?
All those things would be so helpful! Totally agree they should be paid for by the seller and ready to give to the buyer.
the80sweregreat · 29/08/2021 13:00

I haven't read the whole thread, but why was the sellers report thing dropped? I can recall a friend selling up in 2010 ( or about that time ) and they had to have everything done in a folder before they could sell : this was in England.
She moaned that it was expensive and a bit of work they had to do , but they moved fairly quickly compared to today's moving horrors.
Then that idea was scrapped I believe ?
It seemed to work ok for them?
With most people having the internet now , surely some thing like this would be preferable?
You can find deeds to a house online etc.

Tataru · 29/08/2021 13:09

It's awful. I'm in Scotland but we sold DH's mum's house in Devon recently and I was gobsmacked at the process. I don't know how anyone who actually is living in their home does it because we had about six different dates that changed with only a few days notice. I don't know how you organise anything when it can seemingly fall apart or be delayed at the 11th hour!

Every house I've bought and sold in Scotland has been straightforward and we have a concrete date really early in the process.

the80sweregreat · 29/08/2021 13:14

I hate the VAT thing too! Had a quote to cut back a tree and it was ' 100 , plus vat ' he knows we pay vat etc as we have had this tree done by them twice before and we are not in the ' we don't pay VAT ' category of people !! Whoever they are!
Estate agents have always been rubbish : they are only on the side of making money and most can't lie straight in bed.

Marni83 · 29/08/2021 13:15

That would be very expensive
And the cost would fall on you to pick up

Tataru · 29/08/2021 13:26

It's provided in Scotland. Sellers pay for a home report and EPC which any prospective buyer can look at. You can usually just see them online when you are looking at houses. The home report contains information on the condition of the home interior and structure and a valuation. It's just part of selling your home here.

flashbac · 29/08/2021 13:27

@Eggsley

I agree that the conveyancing process needs a complete overhaul in England and Wales. I'm a conveyancing solicitor - I like to think I'm one of the good ones, but there are plenty that aren't. The system itself is extremely frustrating for us too.

The difficulty with Home Information Packs is that the searches go out of date - most lenders want searches that are no more than 6 months old at completion. Unless you sell your house within days of it going on the market then by the time you have gone through the whole process, the searches are likely to be out of date. The issue with them the first time round was that they didn't really consult solicitors on what would have been most helpful.

Similarly with copies of the title and property forms - the expectation is that they are all dated within 6 months - if they aren't and something significant has changed then it can take forever to establish this. Surveys can only be relied on by the person who instructs the surveyor. So if you see a survey prepared for the seller, and you rely on it but it's missing something major, you won't have any comeback on the surveyor. So it makes sense as a buyer to have your own carried out.

Until mortgage lenders change their requirements, unfortunately solicitors (who generally act for the lender as well as the buyer) have to make sure that all of the lenders requirements are satisfied which slows things down. There is a huge difference in how lenders respond to things - some respond by email the same day, or within a day or two. Some take weeks and will only fax or post correspondence. Most at the moment are still blaming Covid for everything, it can take hours to get through on the phone.

Then you get the solicitors who aren't willing to engage, collaborate or try to progress the matter. It's frustrating when they don't answer emails or you can only ever get through to their voicemail.

As a very rough guide, freehold transactions take around 8-10 weeks from receipt of contract papers to exchange, leasehold I'd say 10-12 weeks. Most are taking longer at the moment due to the sheer volume of work because of the SDLT holiday.

I would also say that at the moment most conveyancers are burnt out. The volume of work over the last 18 months has been insane and most that I know have been working 12-14 hour days, weekends etc. to try to meet expectations. We are all desperate for it to be 1st October. We are exhausted, fed up of clients and agents having unrealistic expectations, and just doing our best.

The other thing worth bearing in mind is cost. If you are only paying £500 for conveyancing fees, you won't be getting someone qualified dealing with your matter. Think how many files they will need to have to make any money. The more files they have, the less time they have for each client and the slower the process will be. I wouldn't expect conveyancing fees for a freehold purchase to be less than around £1,100 plus VAT and disbursements.

I find that the clients who want to know everything about everything are the ones whose transactions take the longest because I have to duplicate work and explain every minor detail to them. I don't have time to respond to every email immediately. If I've had an email, I'll get to it but don't need a phonecall chasing it up within an hour. If I'm reviewing a new build property or a leasehold one, it would take me 2-3 hours uninterrupted, depending on complexity. If I'm interrupted every 5 minutes, it can take days. I've been reviewing a leasehold transaction for 3 days, because the phone doesn't stop ringing and then I have to stop and deal with exchanges, completions, random enquiries, colleague enquiries, estate agents, mortgage brokers, clients, opposing solicitors, clients again, estate agents from elsewhere in the chain who can't get a response from the solicitors they are meant to be dealing with. Plus clients who drop into reception with documents but want 5 minutes to discuss their matter with me. Of course I don't mind taking the time to speak to them (or anyone who calls, as there is nothing more frustrating than not being able to speak to someone!) but it slows the process down enormously.

This is a helpful explanation however they manage to overcome all these problems in other countries.
OP posts: