Afghanistan

[Refreshpage]

More US troops killed today than over the last 4 years . Pulling put has cost more deaths of US troops than staying there.
Afghans now being slaughtered.
Massive fail from Biden following Trumps pull out.

Very, very 😔

At least Pen put his animals in the hold and wanted to put humans in the seats(but was blocked by Bidens last minute rule change)
America put their dogs on the seats
www.news.com.au/world/middle-east/afghanistan-us-military-dogs-reportedly-given-seats-on-evacuation-flights/news-story/3366a195b919bc463276157034f6d6fb

And I don’t blame Prn got his foul mouthed rant. If I had to leave 70 friends in Afghanistan after working so hard to get the visas and out of there only to have the rung pulled at the last minute I would be ranting too.

@Proudboomer - So what? Looks like there were loads of empty seats on that plane even if the dogs were in the cabin.

[quote anonymousobserver]@Proudboomer - So what? Looks like there were loads of empty seats on that plane even if the dogs were in the cabin.[/quote]
None apart from the fact that Pen is being attacked as some sort of antichrist to try to distract us from the real issues.

Plus there was plenty of empty seats on Pens plane and it was the fault of Bidens rule change and inflexibility that meant Afghan men women and children were not sitting on them

@chaosrabbitland. Twitter. Find and follow their twitter accounts.

I'm hoping someone has screen shots of the stuff Ben Wallace was posting whilst Farthing and NOWZAD were stuck outside the airport, because Wallace and Heappey appear to have deleted the lot.

There’s clearly been some use of media going around. I’m not particularly willing to judge or be distracted by arguments between those in the war zone or apparently trying to get people out of it, while the main point is that this mad scramble to evacuate should never have happened. It has major implications for everyone trusting in the US, and the U.K. as its loyal follower will be held to blame too. Good article about that on the BBC.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/58377984
“South Korea, Japan, Western Europe, and Britain are all wondering if the American commitment to them could evaporate as fast as the commitment to Afghanistan has.
Only four months ago, President Joe Biden sounded confident and reassuring”

[quote anonymousobserver]@Proudboomer - So what? Looks like there were loads of empty seats on that plane even if the dogs were in the cabin.[/quote]
It was a private charter. Nothing to do with the MOD. That's why nobody else was on it.

The US have carried out a drone strike on a vehicle containing a high volume of explosives, which was on its way to the airport in Kabul according to bbc news

“South Korea, Japan, Western Europe, and Britain are all wondering if the American commitment to them could evaporate as fast as the commitment to Afghanistan has.

The only "commitment" to those countries has been as a buffer between the US and the USSR, and now China. And anyone who thinks otherwise is a tad dim.

@Proudboomer
PF was told he and all his staff and their dependents could leave on a British MOD plane but not his animals. He could have ensured the safety of all his staff by doing this then returned to remove his animals by private charter flight.
Unfortunately extreme stress can make people make decisions and act in ways that don’t make sense. Also that threatening phone call shows how close to loosing perspective he was.

If it was Pen’s plan to remove his local Afghan staff to safety then he failed, a lot like the whole withdrawal debacle in general. I really don’t think saving dogs and cats make up for this however much you like animals. One animal worker/vet flown to safety could of saved hundreds of animal lives in the future.

Support the women and girls of Afghanistan 🖤

[quote KataclysmicStar]@Proudboomer
PF was told he and all his staff and their dependents could leave on a British MOD plane but not his animals. He could have ensured the safety of all his staff by doing this then returned to remove his animals by private charter flight.
Unfortunately extreme stress can make people make decisions and act in ways that don’t make sense. Also that threatening phone call shows how close to loosing perspective he was.

If it was Pen’s plan to remove his local Afghan staff to safety then he failed, a lot like the whole withdrawal debacle in general. I really don’t think saving dogs and cats make up for this however much you like animals. One animal worker/vet flown to safety could of saved hundreds of animal lives in the future.

Support the women and girls of Afghanistan 🖤[/quote]
That's not quite correct. Whilst Pen's team were waiting outside the airport (10+ hours) Wallace started tweeting, and making it clear that he was reneging on his previous tweets promising to facilitate their safe passage.

By the time they were allowed into the airport, a change in visa requirements 2 hours previously (whilst they were stuck outside the airport, knowing there was an "attack imminent" alert) meant that *none of the Afghans were allowed out. None of them.

Unless, of course, you know differently, and that nice Mr Wallace would have asked the Americans to let them and other Afghan people out anyway.

The reports emerging this morning would suggest that whatever your sources are telling you, it's not quite correct.

“They told us there was no one they could find that could actually fill that aircraft.

“In fact, they had more air capacity than they had people, which probably tells you an awful lot about the final days of the withdrawal from Afghanistan.”

He added that “all efforts were made to do what we could” but it was “not possible to find anyone”, with Mr Farthing loading the animals and leaving “on his own”.

www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/kabul-heathrow-airport-ben-wallace-afghanistan-taliban-b952875.html#r3z-addoor

If the UK govt were so concerned about getting people out, there's no reason why they couldn't have sent people on that plane.

Support the women and girls of Afghanistan. ?? Why just the women and girls? The UK govt has failed scores of people. Men, women and children. It's as simple as that. Their attempt to divert attention from their own negligence by smearing one man is contemptible.

@Doodlebug71

“ If the UK govt were so concerned about getting people out, there's no reason why they couldn't have sent people on that plane. ”

There’s at least one explanation in a part of the piece you didn’t C&P…

Mr Dyer said the staff were denied entry to the airport in Kabul on Thursday, with the Taliban they did not have the right paperwork.

[quote notimagain]@Doodlebug71

“ If the UK govt were so concerned about getting people out, there's no reason why they couldn't have sent people on that plane. ”

There’s at least one explanation in a part of the piece you didn’t C&P…

Mr Dyer said the staff were denied entry to the airport in Kabul on Thursday, with the Taliban they did not have the right paperwork.[/quote]
Pen's complaint is that Biden changed the rules on visas. I'd rather believe him than anyone suportting Wallace, given Wallace's history, and the tweets I saw from Wallace's account. Wallace proved his word is not to be trusted.

[quote notimagain]@Doodlebug71

“ If the UK govt were so concerned about getting people out, there's no reason why they couldn't have sent people on that plane. ”

There’s at least one explanation in a part of the piece you didn’t C&P…

Mr Dyer said the staff were denied entry to the airport in Kabul on Thursday, with the Taliban they did not have the right paperwork.[/quote]
BTW, @notimagain, where did that quote come from? Please paste the article, and cite the quote. I'm interested in the context of that.

@PickUpAPepper

There’s clearly been some use of media going around. I’m not particularly willing to judge or be distracted by arguments between those in the war zone or apparently trying to get people out of it, while the main point is that this mad scramble to evacuate should never have happened. It has major implications for everyone trusting in the US, and the U.K. as its loyal follower will be held to blame too. Good article about that on the BBC. www.bbc.co.uk/news/58377984 “South Korea, Japan, Western Europe, and Britain are all wondering if the American commitment to them could evaporate as fast as the commitment to Afghanistan has. Only four months ago, President Joe Biden sounded confident and reassuring”

It *has been a mad scramble, as opposed to the orderly queue that Wallace and others have implied. Images of people holding up passports and flags and being plucked out of crowds in no particular order should have made that clear. Apparently not. Too many people in here claiming otherwise.

I’m not particularly willing to judge or be distracted by arguments between those in the war zone or apparently trying to get people out of it,[...

Too late for that. Taleban already taking control, apparently: twitter.com/nabihbulos/status/1432457587576950788

The entire UK discussion on this has been made about one man and his dog. What a great way to help Boris and his band of nincompoops evade any scrutiny or responsibility.

It would appear that Karbul did not so much "fall" to the Taliban but was handed over by the US who were given the option of controlling Karbul until the evacuation had been completed.

www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/08/28/taliban-takeover-kabul/

In a hastily arranged in-person meeting, senior U.S. military leaders in Doha — including McKenzie, the commander of U.S. Central Command — spoke with Abdul Ghani Baradar, head of the Taliban’s political wing.

“We have a problem,” Baradar said, according to the U.S. official. “We have two options to deal with it: You [the United States military] take responsibility for securing Kabul or you have to allow us to do it.”

Throughout the day, Biden had remained resolute in his decision to withdraw all American troops from Afghanistan. The collapse of the Afghan government hadn’t changed his mind.

McKenzie, aware of those orders, told Baradar that the U.S. mission was only to evacuate American citizens, Afghan allies and others at risk. The United States, he told Baradar, needed the airport to do that.

On the spot, an understanding was reached, according to two other U.S. officials: The United States could have the airport until Aug. 31. But the Taliban would control the city.

@DGRossetti

The entire UK discussion on this has been made about one man and his dog. What a great way to help Boris and his band of nincompoops evade any scrutiny or responsibility.

This!

It drives me crazy how this government get away with really terrible policies, decisions, outcomes time and time again.

@DGRossetti

The entire UK discussion on this has been made about one man and his dog. What a great way to help Boris and his band of nincompoops evade any scrutiny or responsibility.

Yep, absolutely. Sadly a fair number of people seem to have fallen for it. But hopefully enough of us see through it. I think PF is being very deliberately scapegoated unfortunately

@DGRossetti

The entire UK discussion on this has been made about one man and his dog. What a great way to help Boris and his band of nincompoops evade any scrutiny or responsibility.

No, the entire discussion hasn’t been about one man and his dog, there’s been plenty of wider coverage in the likes of the Guardian but looking at this place….

And if the working theory is that this is being kept in the public eye simply to deflect from HMGs actions then I guess the theory must also be that HMG is pressurizing him to participate in phone-ins….

#justsayin'