to support extinction rebellion - more London action tomorrow

[54321nought]

I am not sure what, but I have seen their previous demonstrations, and support their cause.

We were given badges at one event, and travelled home on public transport wearing them, and received absolutely nothing but 100% support from other travellers, which was nice, as I expected some hostility, publicly wearing their badges while roads in London were closed by them

@Theythinkitsalloveritisnow

The way I see it, XR isn’t trying to win hearts and minds, it’s trying to shame the government for its inaction. Unfortunately, at the last election, we had 40%+ of the electorate voting for the party with by far the weakest commitments/policy on climate change. The problem here isn’t XR. It’s 30/40 million adults with fingers in ears and a government happy to do the same as long as they stay in power.

Sadly the Conservative Party post 2000 doesn’t lead in anything. All it really does, at least in an economic sense, is manage - specifically, manage the interests of big global capital in the context of the UK economy. You might as well ask my poodle to take the lead on climate change as soon as ask Boris Johnson.

[quote supermoonrising]@Theythinkitsalloveritisnow

The way I see it, XR isn’t trying to win hearts and minds, it’s trying to shame the government for its inaction. Unfortunately, at the last election, we had 40%+ of the electorate voting for the party with by far the weakest commitments/policy on climate change. The problem here isn’t XR. It’s 30/40 million adults with fingers in ears and a government happy to do the same as long as they stay in power.[/quote]
People don't only vote on environmental issues. My own vote will be cast for the party that protects women and has the best policies on disability, healthcare and education as these are pressing concerns.

This is exactly why the green party will never get in. They have no concrete policies beyond environmental and make no commitment to positive social change beyond virtue signalling.

@BelleOfTheProvince

but the reason this extreme group exists in the first place is because governments are putting Polling Numbers and Populist policy ahead of a sustainable future for the human race.

But xr actions are not changing this. If anything they turn people away from environmental issues so they are less likely to demand said changes needed.

Some changes er could work on that have less impact on the public could be:

Engage healthcare professionals and scientists with helping the UK turn their diet to a more sustainable model. This could include: helping the food industry make appropriate changes, switching farming bursaries to crops over livestock. Advertising and promotion of more sustainable foodstuffs on television and online. Ban on food production companies that have unsustainable pact on the environment from advertising at peak times.
Updating old buildings like schools so they are more energy efficient and can have access to different energy sources.

Updating public transport (there's a biofuel bus near me, not sure if this is widespread yet)

Why aren't they doing things like this?

Because those things are the j responsibility of local government, and government departments. That's the point of declaring a climate emergency, so that relevant departments make and implement these sorts of plans.

@Darker

That may be your experience Simon and obviously that’s very unpleasant but it isn’t what I’ve observed. I also live and work in London and have dropped into a few events in passing. There is often free food and recycling facilities on site. Obviously it’s harder to be litter free when very large numbers of people are there and the police are moving people on.

It's not at all hard to be litter free if you just TAKE YOUR BLOODY LITTER AWAY WITH YOU.

The lost so much support when they started blocking commuter’s trains. If you want people to use public transport, block cars not people taking the train to go to work 🙄

What I also don’t understand is why are they trying to annoy «regular people» and not corporations - which are the ones causing mass pollution! For ex give away coffee next to a Starbucks to anybody having a reusable cup.
Prevent frivolous corporate / govt event to happen.
This type of thing would target to root of the problem and maybe gain public support.

supermoonrising
There are lots of positives in my link;

Today’s investment complements £1.5 billion support to boost the uptake of electric vehicles

Also being announced today is £31.5 million for research into pioneering technologies to remove greenhouse gases from the atmosphere, and £22 million to research new kinds of air pollutants and minimise their effects on public health.

Europe ploughed more than £37billion (€43bn) of investment into new wind farm projects in 2020, led by the UK, according to analysis.

May I remind you why XR's spokeswoman said she left the group;

XR "peddle messages of doomsday gloom that alienate" and offer "little in the way of positive solutions"

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-54103163

Sorry, I should have been clearer.
Why aren't these concrete actions the target of protests? What's stopping them rocking up outside parliament armed with a concrete demand and a petition. At 10,000 signatures an action has to be debated by the government. If ex made one target each time they were protesting, rather than general 'causing havoc' then the very least would be the government had to keep considering positive actions and the public would be very aware of what was thrown out.
If they did this longer term then if the government were still seen to be not acting then they wouldn't have pissed off the public so much so might have the power to organise mass walk outs or protests within industry.

What xr do right now is not working. They need to change tack. It's much easier for the government to write them off as trouble makers when they impact the public negatively for no gain.

I thought the aim of Monday’s protest was to disrupt the City and financial sector? Which invests heavily in fossil fuels worldwide (and why it’s ridiculous to claim the UK causes only 1% of emissions ). Protesting outside parliament isn’t the point this time around.

Its ridiculous, counterproductive and stupid

So will normal people be impacted or not?

The problem is xr record is not great. They've been disruptive and counter productive in the past, I'm going by past efforts not future ones.

[quote supermoonrising]@Theythinkitsalloveritisnow

The way I see it, XR isn’t trying to win hearts and minds, it’s trying to shame the government for its inaction. Unfortunately, at the last election, we had 40%+ of the electorate voting for the party with by far the weakest commitments/policy on climate change. The problem here isn’t XR. It’s 30/40 million adults with fingers in ears and a government happy to do the same as long as they stay in power.[/quote]
Like it or not, our current government isn't going to be shamed into action.
The government isn't going to change any policy of the back of a niche, middle class bubble protest movement that often seems to be deliberately alienating the general public.
The government will change policy if they see the public supporting the aims.

So XR need the public on side and they need to take this into account when thinking of ways to protest.

@BelleOfTheProvince

To be honest of there were a proactive environmental group who were making real changes I'd join them. But that's definitely not xr. Whatever their aims, they are basically undermining their own cause at this point. Happy to look into alternative groups if anyone has any suggestions.

I just don't think dying your hair blue and covering yourself in glitter whilst stopping traffic helps the cause much and I've yet to be convinced otherwise.

Xr seem to be happy to demand change from others whilst doing very little themselves.

Has your local council declared a climate emergency? If they haven’t, join a group that is trying to achieve this, or else if they have declared a climate emergency, respond to the consultations. Some of them are very detailed and involve reading through a large number of practical actions that councils could take around energy use, housing, transport, employment, food, etc and giving your feedback about what you want to see happen. Have a look at this: www.devonclimateemergency.org.uk/category/public-call-for-evidence/

I’m involved in a local climate action group that does on the ground practical actions such as planting community edibles…we do lots of beneficial things for our town and the people are lovely, but… actions like these aren’t anywhere near enough and never will be unless governments get on board as well.

supermoonrising

Unfortunately, at the last election, we had 40%+ of the electorate voting for the party with by far the weakest commitments/policy on climate change. The problem here isn’t XR. It’s 30/40 million adults with fingers in ears and a government happy to do the same as long as they stay in power.

Is it really 40% of the electorate that were able to vote?
Or 40% of the electorate that actually voted?

Saturday is the Kill the Bill March London which is mentioned on the XR website. This is not led or organised by XR.

Kill the Bill protest on Saturday 21 August at 1pm in Parliament Square, London SW1P 3BD. Further information available at @killthe bill_offical on Instagram.

Monday starts off two weeks of protest in the City, though it starts in Trafalgar Square. The focus is “Stop all new fossil fuel investment immediately”.

extinctionrebellion.uk/next-uk-rebellion/

I agree, this Government will only act if they think they have to to retain power so what's needed is to win the public over.

Just watched a really interesting TED talk on the sweet spot in terms of climate worry (possibly linked on this thread) Too much doom and we go into despair or denial, too little and we don't change. We need a big open conversation about this is where we are, this is what we can genuinely do to fix it, here's how you can help and here's how we can help you to do it.

Darker

Aren't the focus of the "kill the bill" protests to stop the introduction of wider powers to the police during protests.

All of the bleating about 'i bet they put the heating on, I bet they drive a car' misses the entire point. 10 companies produce 71% of carbon emissions. We could all live like monks and it still wouldn't be enough, we need systemic change from government.

God this argument is so frustrating. If we "all lived like monks" then those 10(0) companies would go out of business. But it's easier to claim that you can't make a difference and so you'll just sit back and consume while shaking your sanctimonious head at government.

Yes, my council have declared a climate emergency. There are many positive changes that can be viewed in my city.
Xr had no involvement in their implementation.

We need a big open conversation about this is where we are, this is what we can genuinely do to fix it, here's how you can help and here's how we can help you to do it.**

Isn’t this what the climate assemblies and public / expert consultations that XR are calling for are aiming for?

XR = right cause, wrong approach.

They need re branding after the last protests and a few other uncomfortable truths about them. Let's see what tomorrow brings!

@FrippEnos

Darker

Aren't the focus of the "kill the bill" protests to stop the introduction of wider powers to the police during protests.

Yes. I went on one last year and there were representatives from lots of groups with an interest in this Bill.

@BelleOfTheProvince

Yes, my council have declared a climate emergency. There are many positive changes that can be viewed in my city. Xr had no involvement in their implementation.

So there are already ways that you can get involved locally to make a difference over and above making individual lifestyle changes. You have your answer. You could even retrain if you feel passionate enough about it. Retrofitting of existing buildings to make them more efficient is going to be a big source of employment in the future.

Fuck Extinction Rebellion.
And their privileged work-shy members.
And the disruption they cause.
And the mess they leave behind.
And the vandalism and destruction.
And their hate and harassment.

They don't represent the population.