Where will the refugees coming to the UK live?

[Meeklynamechanged]

In no way a goady thread, I fully support helping the people fleeing such horrid circumstances, but genuine question.. where will they live? Where do we put people?

Where I live we have people waiting 10 years for a council property. Most areas around the UK have a huge deficit in available housing that doesn't meet demand.

With so many families stuck in overcrowded hostels and B&B's, families of 5 in 1 bed flats, I can't see where all of the required the housing will come from?

I’m not calling the West of evil intent here, though I think the invasion was a mistake - and it was a mistake for the very reason we’re seeing right now. Reasons that may predicted would bare out.

A huge, huge cost in human life for a decade of some progress in some areas which may well be undone in the next decade.

Re people sitting on housing lists - this is a far more complex problem than just ticking off a list. Some of those people have come from extremely difficult circumstances, have not had the chance to learn about managing money, paperwork, or have other challenges in their lives and need support to successfully hold onto a Council tenancy. This has been a new initiative for some Scottish Councils - house people, and then wrap the support round them to make sure they thrive. I think it makes sense It's, and it'll be interesting how it pans out. It's a far more complicated equation than x people on the list, y number of houses.
A PP said something earlier about Persimmon, etc. not building affordable houses. Again, this is been tried out in Scotland, and large planning applications going through Councils can hang on them building a proportion of houses for social or affordable private rent, and them making an investment into local services such as school places. It just takes the political will to see that through.
Our Council (in Scotland) employed permanent members of staff in housing and education to support refugees last year, and have the skills to support people again should it come to it. And no, we're not on an remote island with no Wi-Fi

The US are paying Uganda to host them

Very interesting

@LoislovesStewie

Homelessness is not a problem relating to housing stock Actually, yes it is; many people who become homeless are already on housing registers, often living in poor accommodation with little security of tenure. More stock means that they stand a greater chance of being housed and not becoming homeless. The homeless legislation was brought in to deal with situations which were out of the ordinary, if you like, but today it's expected to deal with people who should never have become homeless in the first place. When I was a homeless officer, I dealt with many people who had been waiting to be housed, and eventually they inevitably became homeless because they had simply run out of time, so families who had been given notice and then a possession order, people who had been asked to leave by friends etc. They should have been housed.

Fair enough - my perspective seems to be outdated. Let me put it a little differently. The fact that we have so much vacant housing, and housing stock available outside London, doesn't seem to resolve homelessness. Adding to council stock in order to settle refugees, and dispersing them to areas with less demand, doesn't seem to affect resources for those currently homeless. Different budgets.

why are there so many destitute and homeless people in the UK then

Not because of lack of housing stock. because there isn't a lack of housing per se. There are empty houses, houses that are underutilised (eg one person living in a four bedroom house) and lots of people with holiday homes. Sort out those three issues (along with poor protections for tenants) and there won't be (m)any homeless and there will be plenty of room for refugees and we won't have to concrete over any more of the countryside, either.

So far, about 1,200 Afghans have been evacuated to the United States and that number is set to rise to 3,500 in the coming weeks

Wow, I'm really amazed by their generosity, really...

@SoupDragon

"Homelessness is not a problem relating to housing stock."
"The number of people in inadequate "temporary" accommodation is."

It isn't in Liverpool. We've never had housing issues. We have a good stock of three bedroom houses. The problem is that because of the bedroom tax the HAs etc can't allocate anyone a house who will be subject to BT. Likewise people topped up on in-work benefits, which is a large percentage, can't take private rents either. So government policies have created housing issues in the North. I've always said that housing benefit policies should be regional.

Sensitive topic. I have members of my family waiting for housing and immigrants have been housed before them.
There is also a shortage of flats for pensioners for the same reason..
We are "City of refuge" and the people who have lived here and paid their taxes are now waiting a lot longer

@YetAnotherSpartacus

Where will we put all of the British babies who are being born?

Which British babies? Where did ‘we’ put your babies when they were born?

@chaosrabbitland I don't want to slap a label on you but I think you're falling into the trap of punching down rather than up.

Public services are underfunded, benefits are too low, social housing is scarce and poor quality because the people who donate to political parties don't want to pay more tax to fund these things.

The press is full of stories trying to get us to blame asylum seekers and immigrants for our own systems being underfunded. If corporations and rich individuals stopped parking all their funds in dodgy offshore havens and using any get-out they can to avoid paying tax, we could fund these things.

If we had zero immigrants, problems with the NHS, housing etc would still exist because someone has made a political calculation that people will vote for that and the donors will lap it up.

@mustlovegin, the US have already taken 2.5 million over the years. I know from my Nigerian (and other African) friends that it's easier to get into the US. Or it was pre Trump.
I don't know were people are getting figures from, the US is set to receive 20'000 this year.

Exactly! Most virtue signallers and “holier than thou” posters aren’t from highly populated areas with not enough schools, GP surgeries, poor transport and roads etc. Schools also have very high EAL intakes and not enough interpreters. The North West share of the overall UK asylum population is 21.4%. That’s a very high population. Why aren’t asylum seekers evenly spread out to Southern counties or other UK countries?

I'll tell you why, because the people you mention are also nimbys.

We need more housing!!!! Just not in my area.
We need solar and wind farms!!!!!! But not in my area.

So yeah they'll be wailing about how we should re-home all these refugees but they won't want to fucking see them.
Dick heads.

@CustomerRelations, we can't deny that population growth makes life harder for those down the ladder. Personally I'd up asylum seekers and cut back on immigration. Process them more efficiently and get them into work/education etc.

Which British babies?

The point being that if there is a housing crisis then it applies more generally. Seems like lots of excuses for racism here.

You can't kick people out of council or HA housing because they are now earning more or whatever reason, and then move Afghan families in!! Resentment would build VERY quickly at the minimum

And yet folk suggest that private home owners "should" give up their space too - or doesn't their resentment count? Also this "moral obligation" many insist we owe to the Afghans - does that only apply if you own property?

On brighter news, going by the number of posters who are all in favour of inviting folk into their homes, there won't be a problem housing the Afghans at all

"I'd also ask, if people are willing to give up their second bedroom to refugees, how about giving it up to people on the wait lists for housing?"

Somebody on the council waiting list isn't necessarily homeless.

@DazzlePaintedBattlePants

SharonasCorona Great. Well done you. How do we figure out which refugees will turn out like you and which ones will still be tribally entrenched and refusing to let their girls access higher education and choose whether to get married or not, let alone engage with radical groups because they’ve spent 20 years living in a country where a significant proportion of residents are hostile to them? You can’t - and if the country is going to take that risk the the country needs an honest discussion about the risks and potential benefits.

And isn’t it funny how most of the refugees are able young men with no caring responsibilities? My condition would be women and children only. Men can stay behind and sort their own shit out.

I don't know of any families that don't send their daughters to school. My young female relatives aspire to be lawyers and doctors.

You are conflating the Taliban with ordinary Afghans.

See this link for 5 simple reasons why more male refugees make it to Europe:

www.globalcitizen.org/en/content/five-explanations-to-why-the-majority-of-refugees/

As the UK is going to take in refugees from Afghanistan, they will presumably have a system to decide who they take.

Great. Well done you.

What's the need for this sneery comment?

"Homelessness is not a problem relating to housing stock*
Actually, yes it is; many people who become homeless are already on housing registers, often living in poor accommodation with little security of tenure. More stock means that they stand a greater chance of being housed and not becoming homeless. The homeless legislation was brought in to deal with situations which were out of the ordinary, if you like, but today it's expected to deal with people who should never have become homeless in the first place. When I was a homeless officer, I dealt with many people who had been waiting to be housed, and eventually they inevitably became homeless because they had simply run out of time, so families who had been given notice and then a possession order, people who had been asked to leave by friends etc. They should have been housed."

But obviously the main problem is that these people don't have money otherwise they would just rent privately. The problem is poverty, not lack of housing.

@ferretface

Meanwhile London is stuffed full of expensive, empty investment properties which contributes to the domestic housing shortage. We should stop courting billionaires and tax exiles and build houses for normal people to live in.

I think any property in London which is not inhabited for more than, IDK, two years, should be punitively taxed to high, high heaven.

@YetAnotherSpartacus

Where will we put all of the British babies who are being born?

Not that many really, below replacement level

@igelkott2021

why are there so many destitute and homeless people in the UK then

Not because of lack of housing stock. because there isn't a lack of housing per se. There are empty houses, houses that are underutilised (eg one person living in a four bedroom house) and lots of people with holiday homes. Sort out those three issues (along with poor protections for tenants) and there won't be (m)any homeless and there will be plenty of room for refugees and we won't have to concrete over any more of the countryside, either.

Exactly this.

Also just to note: there's already lots of Afghan people in the UK. Some have citizenship. Some are stuck in Home Office limbo, unable to work, unable to practice their professions, reliant on charity, shuffled around the country (which means taking their kids out of school, and breaking any community ties they've built up) - and then we wonder why they need mental health help, charity help, etc etc. Support them to become just ordinary neighbours of ours, and everyone will benefit.

[quote Ponoka7]@SoupDragon

"Homelessness is not a problem relating to housing stock."
"The number of people in inadequate "temporary" accommodation is."

It isn't in Liverpool. We've never had housing issues. We have a good stock of three bedroom houses. The problem is that because of the bedroom tax the HAs etc can't allocate anyone a house who will be subject to BT. Likewise people topped up on in-work benefits, which is a large percentage, can't take private rents either. So government policies have created housing issues in the North. I've always said that housing benefit policies should be regional.[/quote]
Hasn't the policy changed? Private landlords have to consider people on housing benefit now.

So now people are suggesting that ' second home owners' should give up their places to the homeless or a to a refugee?
I think hell will freeze over first before that would happen ( i only have one small home for four by the way!)
Some people on here do live in a parallel universe.

@the80sweregreat

Not everyone contributes though do they? Many end up on benefits even if they can work. For every person who is now in a high flying job there are many others living on the state . This money has to come from somewhere too and post a pandemic with zillions of pounds in debt already it'll be the young who will pick up the shortfalls :( Plus there won't be a proper discussion about any of this as anyone expressing concerns are shut down as being racist or bigots when we can already see things falling apart as it is. Read any thread about our young people trying to access mental health support in schools and it's always ' lack of funds ' , which will be found to help others ; no wonder people are angry, yet we are called names if we ask questions about how it'll all be funded or where they will all live etc .

It is not true to say these concerns are 'shut down'. On MN perhaps. But the wider UK political trend is to turning away from politically elite socialists. The Labour party as we understood it is now finished in the UK. Any party that successfully takes on the Conservatives will be positioned further right than we could imagine.