Friends don’t believe in vaccinations or calpol

[Campingcarryon]

I have some friends who are new parents and have declared that their child won’t be having any childhood vaccinations and that they also don’t believe in giving kids calpol or other medicines either.

Honestly, I didn’t know what to say when they said that to me- I haven’t come accross people who were anti calpol before 🤦‍♀️

Aibu to think it’s quite irresponsible if your child is ill not to get their temp down with calpol and that you are risking things getting a lot worse, especially with really small babies that get ill and deteriorate really fast. Let alone the whole anti vax position.

Honestly, I am still really baffled by their position to be honest. I think it’s really weird and irresponsible not to want your child to feel well 🤪

@Cheeseplantboots you can get sugar free paracetamol and ibuprofen suspensions for babies and children.

So do you suffer through pain and not take a couple of paracetamol?? I've definitely bought more than 5 packs of it for myself over the last 20 years, it's a common analgesic that all Medical professionals recommend as first line. It might be full of sugar and colouring but you're only giving what 10mls at the most in bigger children?? It's hardly going to rot their insides!

@Cheeseplantboots - I have to disagree. Parents choosing for their babies, who are completely dependent on them for everything, to be left in pain and vulnerable to very serious but preventable diseases are not good parents. They are gambling with their babies' health and potentially their lives. I cannot respect anti-vaxxer parenting. If babies' under developed immune systems were perfectly able to fight off these dreadful diseases themselves there wouldn't be a need for a national vaccination program. People don't respect how dangerous these diseases are because they've not seen the devastation they can cause. The vaccines were developed in response to the number of babies and children who died or faced terrible disabilities due to these diseases.
You don't get extra mummy points for only having five calpol syringes in your cutlery drawer in your 30 years of parenting.

As far as Calpol is concerned, we were pretty sparing about using it and tried to use supermarket own-brand ones. Ours normally went out of date before we used them up. Our DDs had all their vaccinations because I'm not an idiot and their health was robust enough that they could be part of the herd immunity for others less fortunate.

I have a relative who adopted her DS at around 11 months old. He had had all his vaccinations up to that point. "D"Rel refused to give DS any more. At 6 DS was having minor routine surgery and caught measles. He was very very ill. Has "D"Rel changed her stance? Course not. After all, she's a naturopath... I do wonder whether SS should get back in the DS life, but he's now a teen.

During the pandemic, she bombarded me with crap about vaccines and 5G and all that bollocks. All the pseudo-science articles were from woo sites or publications, none has any basis in science. "D"Rel's scientific knowledge is limited to CSE (pre-GCSE) Biology. I've asked for peer-reviewed papers so I can make up my mind, but funnily enough, they aren't ever available. Another closer relative has also gone down this path so I've blocked both of them. Life's too short to deal with dickheads.

"I have 4 kids 30 down to 14. I’ve probably bought 4 or 5 bottles of paracetamol in all that time. Calpol is full of colouring and sugar."

You are lucky that your children have not been in much pain. Mine has had many persistent ear infections where he has needed round the clock pain relief for weeks. You can buy it colour and sugar free.

This thread is everything wrong in the world! All these hysterical snowflakes shouting about child abuse and ridiculous things. Let me say this very clearly:

THERE IS NO FREE LUNCH!

Yes, we have advances in modern science, yes vaccines can be very effective and advisable (although not always 100% risk free) but my main point is on the Calpol:

Testosterone levels are falling in the male human population: www.forbes.com/sites/neilhowe/2017/10/02/youre-not-the-man-your-father-was/?sh=7d3aeaff8b7f

Nobody can definitively say why but there is plenty of research showing links to painkillers:

drmagaziner.com/aging-men/painkillers-cause-low-testosterone-levels/

Our boys cried through teething and very occasionally when it got really bad we gave them calpol. To just start using it at the drop of a hat is insane. Stop expecting hassle free parenting and stop making excuses that your children ever being in pain is unacceptable because it isn't in fact it is a vital part of growing up. The real reason you are giving painkillers is for an easy life for yourselves...

Who is suggesting giving calpol at the drop of a hat?

You did with your 30 years of calpol comment.

@Mtbdadder
Stop expecting hassle free parenting and stop making excuses that your children ever being in pain is unacceptable because it isn't in fact it is a vital part of growing up. The real reason you are giving painkillers is for an easy life for yourselves

Did you also send your children up chimneys and down the mines to toughen them up? Absolutely awful, awful thinking that children being in pain is a vital part of life.

I think it's that the first few posts on the thread included comments about changing their minds about Calpol when presented with a snotty one year old or the first time their baby gets a fever, or that it's irresponsible not to give Calpol for a minor illness in order to prevent it from turning into a serious illness. Calpol isn't intended to be used as a preventative measure, to treat a snotty nosed cold or to treat a fever without accompanying signs of pain or distress, so plenty of parents who are happy to give Calpol to reduce pain in the event of an ear infection were probably feeling lumped in with anti-vaxxers for leaving the Calpol until after checking to see if the baby was ok with extra fluid, skin to skin, saline up the snotty nose, and raising the head of the cot. I have to admit that I was feeling a bit criticised for only giving medicine for pain relief purposes.

@Mtbdadder

You did with your 30 years of calpol comment.

Ha ha! Reaching, much?!

@Soontobe60 so by your reasoning children should never be in pain? Your position appears to be that it is essential to strive for a pain free existence for them at all times? In my opinion it isn't and so therefore of course they need to learn how to manage pain and discomfort, personally I would much rather they experience that learning process whilst being comforted by a primary caregiver.

What is going to happen when they grow up and you are not there to shovel painkillers down their throat?

Your analogy to chimney sweeps is both bizarre and irrelevant.

@Waspsarearseholes not reaching at all it is what you said

@Mtbdadder actually there’s no need to be in pain if pain relief is available. There’s no glory in suffering pain, and I’ve always found martyrs to be very tedious personally.

26 years as a nurse and despite seeing suffering that you can’t imagine in my work, I still never denied my kids some paracetamol if they had any pain or were just under the weather. But I’m not scared of medications because I understand them and know what is safe and what isn’t.

I love calpol. They will too

We don't really give calpol, partly because my kids hate it so much that giving it to them feels like assault and they usually vomit it back up anyway but also I don't really think it's essential a lot of the time. Like adult paracetamol I think it's a bit overused.

[quote Mtbdadder]@Waspsarearseholes not reaching at all it is what you said[/quote]
Could you quote where I said I reach for calpol at the drop of a hat, please?

@Melassa

We didn’t really do paracetamol here either, as with PPs mine just breastfed more. I did have paracetamol suppositories in, which I must have used max twice, when fever was approaching 39 overnight, but during the day she just breastfed. Also we had a paediatrician who was a fan of letting a fever run if under 38.5° and under and no history of convulsions.

On the whole we tend not to use a lot of over the counter medicines in our house as many are pointless and nothing more than a marketing ploy and the others that do work aren’t entirely free of side effects. We do use pain relief for things like headaches but only if nothing else works.

We did do vaccinations though.

You avoided pain relief for your child and just shoved them on your boob????

Why do so many mothers assume breast milk is some kind all-encompassing magic liquid that cures anything and everything?! Breast milk is amazing I grant you, but it doesn't remove pain! Poor child

Are they. Christian Scientists by any chance OP?

It is actually very effective as as a painkiller in newborn babies, although there's less evidence that it actually suppresses pain in older babies, just calms them down. Like the pp, my babies certainly responded better to breastfeeding than to Calpol for most illnesses in their first year or so. Breastfeeding - stopped crying, relaxed, eventually fell asleep. Calpol - screamed and cried and flailed around all over the place in a very distressed way, spat out most of the medicine, sometimes vomited.

Wtf are Christian Scientists @StoneofDestiny

[quote Mtbdadder]@Soontobe60 so by your reasoning children should never be in pain? Your position appears to be that it is essential to strive for a pain free existence for them at all times? In my opinion it isn't and so therefore of course they need to learn how to manage pain and discomfort, personally I would much rather they experience that learning process whilst being comforted by a primary caregiver.

What is going to happen when they grow up and you are not there to shovel painkillers down their throat?

Your analogy to chimney sweeps is both bizarre and irrelevant.[/quote]
And you are an uncaring adult.
Experiencing pain as a child is not a ‘learning process’. Why planet are you on that you think it is? Bizarre.

Thanks @MissyB1 for your medical perspective and agreed there is no glory in suffering pain.

You say that pain relief is "safe" hence you use it. I also use it but as sparingly as possible. Because as I pointed out above there is evidence that they have side effects, I've also had one friend addicted to painkillers, he developed lots of thyroid problems (no idea if thyroid was related but large quantities of painkillers are dangerous for your liver and kidneys).

Medical best practice on antibiotics has changed through the years as wider knowledge of impacts of overuse are better understood. So medical practice obviously evolves. I am not a professional but I think painkillers will be similarly evaluated in future, especially in very young children/infants. Any thoughts from yourself? Is it a possibility?

@Soontobe60 firstly you dont know me and I'm actually very empathetic. Secondly you've not engaged any of my questions...

@tootingbeclido

Sorry. .But I have no time for idiots like this.

Exactly this.