Can you ask for dc to be taken into care?

[WitsEnd9]

Name changed for this..
Never thought in a million years I’d say this. I look at my youngest and can’t imagine ever feeling this way or saying this about him in 10 years. But we are where we are…

My oldest is 15, 16 next month. Things are really bad. They’re smoking cannabis and dabbling in other things. Out all hours. I’m reporting them missing to the police at least once a week. They’re involved in criminal activity which wasn’t necessarily through choice so the main priority from a safeguarding point of view is getting them away from those people, which seems to have happened.

But even taking them away from those people, which removes immediate risk, still leaves me with a child who is disrespectful and is making my life hell. I don’t know what else I can do, I can’t see it ever getting better. There’s moments, when we talk, where I can still see my child, we have really honest and frank conversations and I think I’ve gotten through to them but the pull of their social circle is too strong and once they’re out the door they don’t give a shit.

There’s lots of social services, police, school involvement.
But at what point am I allowed to say I can’t do this anymore?? I’m sick of not being able to go to bed, having to wait up in case they come home, or for the police to arrive once I’ve made a missing person report (which I have to do after a certain time). I’m sick of neighbours seeing the police here. Sick of worrying about the effect on my youngest. Worried about repercussions from the people she’s hanging around with effecting me or youngest or putting us in danger.
Fed up of not being able to make plans or do anything and everything revolving around their choices.
But most of all sick of feeling so powerless. I feel like if this was a relationship everyone would be screaming at me to leave, but because it’s my child I’m supposed to just put up with it yet the effects on my life and mental health are the same.

I’ve done everything in my power to help, constantly letting things go to try again, for their sake, because they need me and need help. But it’s just not sustainable.

[Stanlie]

I was a foster carer for older teens for many years. We looked after several children whose parents had asked for them to be accommodated, rather than children who were removed by social services. To be honest the threshold for social services to accept them was pretty high. They will do everything possible to keep the child with their family as the cost of foster care is staggeringly high to social services.

We had one child who did really well with us, properly turned it around and has made a great life for themselves, saw the error of their ways etc. The others? Well, they continued with the same behaviours, just under our roof to be honest. We have no powers to keep them under lock and key. We can take them to school, but they don't stay in school unless they want to and can abscond after school, so it's just the foster carer calling the police and scouring the streets til the early hours. One child who was involved in a gang was placed several hours away from their home town, but still managed to get back there every couple of days. I don't know the solution for such cases really

[Beancounter1]

@WitsEnd9

She actually begged me for the day out, but couldn’t keep to her end of the bargain with being home at a reasonable hour. She does actually want to. But is almost sabotaging herself.
But you are right, she is extremely selfish, she only cared about that becasue SHE wanted to go. She doesn’t care when I’m upset. She does think I’m controlling but I also have social workers breathing down my neck so have to keep doing the ‘right’ thing. It’s almost all about appearances. Inside I’m struggling but worry if I tell them that they’ll then worry about my ability to parent my youngest dc. Which they absolutely don’t, but I can’t help worrying.

Hi Witsend,
I've read all the threads now, and there seems to be a mix of opinions. I do hope you take away from this that there are lots of people here cheering you on and giving you sympathy and support and the benefit of experience, even if we can't make up your mind for you.

You don't have to "keep doing the right thing" just because you have "social workers breathing down your neck". Be polite to them, say the right things to get them to go away, then ignore them. They don't seem to be any help to you.

I second the advice to keep your DD rather than put her into care, but keep her as a kind of 'lodger', by which I mean not a child that you need to "parent". Don't try to teach her, control her, reward her, punish her, train her, help her, prevent her, motivate her, or anything. Stop it all.

Just be a friendly ear, show her friendship and love if she lets you, try to chat if she lets you (but don't push it). Otherwise concentrate on yourself and your other child.

Sending you a big hug.

[ufucoffee]

Her going into care might not be the best thing for her but it sounds like it would be the best thing for your youngest child. Your older child is making bad choices. Your youngest has no choice but to live in a home where everything revolves around the oldest. That's not fair.

[WitsEnd9]

@Genevie82 First missing episode was about 4 months ago and she was gone for 4 days. Previous to that we’d had lots of problems with her mental health and bad attitude but never drugs or staying out late or anything.

@Rainy365 Inreally didn’t want to use our day out as a punishment/consequence but I made it so clear if she didn’t come home we couldn’t go as it was somewhere we’d need to get up and leave early. She came home but then went back out knowing full well we wouldn’t go. She didn’t come home until 1am, waking me up to let her in. There was just no way I could take her out the following morning after sitting up worrying if she was even coming home. 3 days in a row. We’re going to try again next week if she can come home at a reasonable time, which she did today.

@Beancounter1 unfortunately I have to do what they say. I’m worried if I’m not seen to be able to effectively safeguard her, it could raise concerns about my ability to parent and safeguard my youngest in all this too. I need to work with them. They’ve actually been really nice although not very helpful. I also can’t let her have a key. I have no access to my phone at work and I just can’t cope with not knowing if she’s let her and her mates in and I’m not there and out of contact.

Thank you for all the supportive messages, and experiences. I think deep down I know I’ll keep trying. It’s just when I’m sitting here at 1am, exhausted waiting for the police, I think ‘I don’t want to do this anymore, I can’t’ and yes I’m that moment I do want her to be someone else’s problem.

I just want her back but I can’t see it happening anytime soon.

[Tabitha005]

I don't know whereabouts you are, OP, but if you're in the south east of the UK, this charity might be worth a chat with: ylf.org.uk/about-us/

Or this organisation if you're in London: www.family-action.org.uk/what-we-do/children-families/mentoring/friendshipworks/

With NHS services & resources so thin on the ground, help in the form of support from a charitable trust or foundation, or a charitably-funded project of some sort might be worth looking into.

I can't imagine the stress you must be under right now, but if you give me an idea of whereabouts you're based, I'll have a look and see what I can find that might be able to offer you and your daughter some support.

[Mistyplanet]

Dont give up. My niece effectively became homeless at age 16 and it went horribly wrong for her. Shes now 25 and has lost her mind due to drugs and will never live a normal life again (imo). Shes currently meant to be sectioned but she keeps escaping. Shes gone mad because of the drugs and has scars all over her body and has picked at her face and is practically disfigured. Its truly awful and sorry to talk about this but if you dont keep hold of your daughter you're letting her go to the wolves and awful people will prey upon her. She will end up in prostitution or in a mental institution if shes allowed to continue on a dangerous path. Do whatever you can now to intervene until its too late. Its not too late now. Think about something radical like moving or frightening her somehow about the direction her life is going in. My nieces mum has stepped up now and is trying to help but its probably too late. If you can put the effort in for the next 5 years you'll at least know you've done all you can. Seek help wherever you can.

[Peoniesandpeaches]

Have you tried the young persons drug team? I’ve tended to find the support better than with cahms for her age group and they give a lot more parental support. Social work are, understandably focused on safeguarding and therefore aren’t looking at how you cope/address it but this service could.

[OldTinHat]

I could have written this but DS1 was 17. Police and social services intervention introduced by me (single mum). With SS help, I drew up a 'contract' with expectations and if they weren't adhered to then he would be asked to leave the home on his 18th birthday. It worked. He dumped the drug dealer 'friends', got off the drugs altogether together with giving up smoking, got a full time job and is now a wonderful, loving, kindest son you could ever want. He lives with his DP who also stuck by him and who is such an amazing young lady, they have their own home and I could not be prouder.

Is this something you could do OP? SS will remove 16yr olds into a halfway house kind of place if you can't take anymore.

[HoollyWugger]

We had a service in our area called MST - Multi Systemic Therapy, sorted via our social worker. Bits of it felt like yet another parenting course by stealth, but it's supposed to work well with teens presenting like your DD. I am feeling a similar way about my younger adopted child; my heart goes out to you x

[Popsicle438]

Why not apply for a place at a state boarding school?

www.raa-school.co.uk/foundationers.asp

[Josette77]

How long ago did her dad abandon her? And do your kids have the same dad?

[Gubanc]

@Intherightplace

It's an awful situation for you to be in but 16yos in "care" see very little actual care. If they're not already in an established foster home when they turn 16 they likely end up in an independent living flat.

And that could be a very good solution for the child.

Op, I'm so sorry, such a shit situation.

[Antwerpen]

@ShinyGreenElephant

Agree with *@HollowTalk*. Or can you move? Move everything, far away from the kids who shes hanging around with and try and have a fresh start. It must be awful for you all

This

Hope you can get some advice Op

[HollowTalk]

This is where one of those boot camps would be absolutely invaluable.

[Leobynature]

My brother was like this. He would run away and get himself into all sorts of trouble hanging out with Undesirables. My mom was at her wits end worrying so she took the door off his bedroom and decided to follow him everywhere, she was by his side every single time he moved or she would go looking for him and hang out with him if he managed to get away. He stopped going out as it’s embarrassing having your mom there, gradually his attitude changed. It was a very strong intervention and wouldn’t work for everyone.

[Doubledoorsontogarden]

Move. Move away from the area. That’s all you can do, then care if it starts again

[Zen88]

Has anyone mentioned that she might be bipolar op? Sometimes treatment for depression can trigger a manic episode.

[BecauseMyRingBurnsSheila]

I know this will be incredibly hard to hear but if your DC is struggling to resist the lure of these associates when surrounded by a loving family, imagine how impossible it will be if they are away from home in a foster placement. Please believe me that social services will not do a better job than you of keeping your DC safe. You can ask for them to be accommodated under Section 20 where you retain parental responsibility but realistically your control over the situation will be significantly diminished. Love is the only thing that will get your DC through this.

[Summerfun54321]

Abandonment issues regarding her Dad and a loss of friendships during covid causing her to seek companionship from anywhere she can find it

That’s the reason you shouldn’t give up on her. If she has no where else to stay and no one else to turn to plus depression this isn’t going to end well. You shouldn’t even tell her you’re thinking about it or threaten it. You need to tell her you’ll be there for her no matter what shit she throws at you. So glad my parents didn’t give up on me when I was like your DD. Some in my friendship group without family support ended up dead, or in prison.

[DeadGood]

[quote WitsEnd9]@Millionnewnames the issue is, I can’t let her get on with it. I’ve been told by social services I have to call the police every time she isn’t home on time. So I can’t go to bed, can’t rest, as have to wait for the police.
I can’t give her a key because she can’t be trusted. She’d let herself in when I’m at work, not go to school, bring people to the house.
I’m genuinely worried she’s putting us in danger, or it could get to that stage. The social services involvement means I have to be actively trying to stop her.[/quote]
But what happens if you don’t report her, stay up for her?

[Tangledtresses]

Oh gawd I've bed there with my son ! It's bloody heart breaking but you are doing all you can

"I will talk it through with the social worker and see what the options are. But they are very insistent that I am doing a great job and she needs to be with me, and that me and grandparents are her biggest protective factor."

You ARE DOING YOUR BEST!

it's bloody tough but please keep going, it will get better I promise xx

[Beancounter1]

I do understand that you have to be seen to be cooperating with the social workers requirements, so that there is no question of your younger child being considered at risk.
But I believe there is a balance to be struck here. You should be going to bed, not staying up all night after phoning the police yet again - what does that achieve except getting you exhausted?
You need to look after yourself in order to look after your younger one.

I know it is so easy for me to sit here and type this, and I can hardly imagine the turmoil you are in. But you need to turn your mind away from your daughter (your mind, not your heart). Detach a bit. Back off. Let it be.
This is essential for your own mental health.
I wish you well.

[Yayayaya20]

My heart is absolutely breaking reading your posts OP.

My mum probably felt the same way about me when I was your daughters age but I was nowhere near as ‘bad’ as your daughter.

Please don’t give up on her. I know it’s so easy for me to say this when I’m not the one in your shoes but she’s your child, a child you helped to learn to walk, introduced all different foods to and spent time helping with homework and everything else that we mums do. Do not give up on 15 years and just accept that your daughter is not that girl anymore. She is worth more than that.

She has a 50/50 chance of either getting through this, outgrowing it and becoming a normal functioning adult or going the other way and ending up a drug addict/dealer whatever else and you know which is more likely if she ends up in care.

Can you take a month or two off of work and take her away somewhere? Not permanently but for long enough and far enough away that it just breaks this cycle a bit? I know you have a younger child but perhaps family could help?

From a personal point of view I hate myself for what I put my parents through as a teen (for me it was boys rather than drugs) but remembering that feeling of being shipped off to relatives yet again is just awful. Sorry to project onto you!

Also PLEASE have another look at symptoms of ADHD in teens. ADDitude Mag is a great resource.

Cheering you on OP and your daughter too

[unim]

I just want to say that, if care did turn out to be the best option for everyone, you and her grandparents would obviously still be really important in her life and a protective factor in a different way. It doesn't have to mean cutting off.

Have you heard of something called Therapeutic Parenting? It was developed for use by foster parents and adoptive parents, but anyone can use the techniques (I use them with my own children, who are my biological DC) and they can be transformative.

There is a wonderful Facebook group you can join: www.facebook.com/groups/282656625231161

[WitsEnd9]

@Zen88 Interesting but I don’t think so. She was depressed for years, overdoses, self harm. She started medication in January which gradually helped but soon after the depression lifted, all of this started. She takes her medication erratically now, and obviously is mixing with recreational drugs so doctors and therapists can’t monitor the effectiveness of medication or her condition. There was talk of ‘her real personality coming out now the depression has lifted’ and possible adhd but that was quickly ruled out. I don’t think this is her true personality.