Dressage

[BathshebaKnickerStickers]

Now, I’ve never done dressage. My knowledge of it comes from being a very horsey girls and reading all those pony books.

BUT dressage hasn’t always been dancing to music has it…? It was always just “collected trot from H to M” type of thing (and pretty dull but very technical)…

I’m watching it on BBC1 and the horse was prancing around to a medley of Phil Collins songs…!!!

AIBU to think that dressage didn’t used to be like that…

[quote BathshebaKnickerStickers]@SmokeyDevil

I guess that I feel there is more of a circus element to it rather than it being a very technical discipline of incredible riding and control[/quote]
I'm confused. What's wrong with music? Music is really technical and takes talented people to compose and perform. It's not like love island was playing on the big screen

@Tal45

I thought dressage was often to music. I'm not keen on dressage, it looks really unnatural to me when they prance sideways etc. Much worse and horse related that I recently read on the BBC though was what happens to racing horses, thousands sent off to slaughter and then being killed cruelly in one of the biggest abattoirs in the uk, many of them young thoroughbreds from Ireland. I think horses in dressage and the Olympics will be treated much better than those for racing which are just seen as a money making tool and discarded when they're not up to it or are no longer able.

Just to point out that the issue there is the abbatoir which was hideous. Lots of the horses shown were not thoroughbreds or racehorses. The retraining of racehorses movement has been a huge success in this country (I have one myself). They most certainly do not all get shipped off to the UK to be shot in front of other horses. Animal Aid doesn't believe in horses being ridden at all, not sure what they expect to happen to all the expensive field ornaments if they got their way!

as this is a horsey thread, this is interesting thesoulofahorse.com/blog/houston-mounted-police-patrol-barefoot-bitless/

So are we also going to discuss how cruel showjumping is, because there might be a few rogue yards who still do rapping?

Well I'm not sure I agree with horses being used in the police at all anymore, not since people have no respect for them and throw things at them.

I'm not a bitless or barefoot fan personally but if it works for some then great.

@Bryonyshcmyony

Well I'm not sure I agree with horses being used in the police at all anymore, not since people have no respect for them and throw things at them.

I'm not a bitless or barefoot fan personally but if it works for some then great.

What about dogs being used in the police?

Never really thought about it. I'm talking about horses.

@Stickytreacle

I dislike seeing horses obviously uncomfortable, I'd prefer to see dressage performed without crank nosebands and a simple snaffle bit rather than a double and the rider not requiring spurs. I know there will be responses of these things being needed for 'refinement', but I'm happier seeing a well schooled happy horse, that doesn't have the incredible strains some of the dressage movements ask for. Plus I hate seeing warmbloods with tiny feet that nearly always cause problems down the line. Then it leads on to novice riders trying to emulate dressage by bypassing the hours of schooling needed, whacking draw reins on the horse and forcing an outline.😩

This is my take on it too, same for showing, that past a certain level a double bridle is 'needed', and bit less isn't allowed (I think that's still true?) (Though bit less bridles can be harsh too). Surely if it's about training and harmony (which should take years) then the less equipment you need the better? Because it shows true synchronicity between horse and rider. True horsemanship imo are the ones who ride with a rope around the neck and guide the horse using body, seat and voice - there's a lady who jumps her horse and I think I've seen her do XC with just a rope round the neck which I think is for her balance so she doesn't move around too much and upset the horse's balance. That's true harmony between horse and human. Can't see her being welcomed at the Olympics though! And obviously you're only seeing an edited version. Now I'm not saying I can do it because I can't, I haven't ridden now in years anyway.

As for the music, I used to ride to music all the time and the horses used to adjust their pace to the rythmn naturally, unless excessively loud or you're galloping flat out to a fast tune excessively (but the music isn't the issue there!) it's not a welfare issue imo.
When my horse lost his companion suddenly I left a radio playing for 'company' in the background, the same you might with a dog.

Many of the movements in dressage are natural movements that horses perform by themselves in the field, shortening and lengthening of strides happens naturally as they negotiate ground and obstacles, just like us, pirouettes are commonly termed as 'spinning' when it's the result of a horse eating wheelie bin for example rather than a rider request, my horse used to do a foot perfect turn on the forehand to squeeze himself into spaces he shouldn't really fit (though not a dressage move, a basis for lateral work) and would piaffe behind the field gate at tea time as I walked towards the field, they are natural movements that horses are taught to do on cue rather than as a reaction.

Ultimately, if half a ton of muscle doesn't want to do something, it won't.

I ride with spurs for refinement. I can ride without them and do so if hacking but if I'm schooling then she has buttons effectively and my heel/leg isn't precise enough to always get the right spot! I only use roller ball ones though and you have to be pretty still in your leg to use them
No double though, I can school up to medium in a snaffle so no need for it on her. And often ride bareback in a head collar to the field!

YANBU. Making a horse listening to Phil Collins is cruel.

Mine prefers Sisters of Mercy but unfortunately there are rules about freestyle music.

Thanks, FEI.

Any time you get animals involved with sports and prizes, there's inevitably some abuse I think.

I'm not sure I agree with horses being used in the police at all anymore, not since people have no respect for them and throw things at them.

Had a friend in the police and she said that in crowd situations they were a great help because:
a. A mounted police officer is high up and has a good view of the crowd so can spot potential trouble.
B. A horse is big and bloody intimidating so useful for moving on potential trouble makers

I just watched a bit and thought what on earth is dressage all about and what exactly do the riders do. I'm sure there is skill involved but honestly I can't see the point of it, it's hardly a sport ??

I sort of feel like the horse should get the medal rather than the rider….

@Babyroobs it's really hard to watch if you're not into it I think. Basically the horse and rider have to do specific movements in a specific pace at a specific marker so as a really easy example, enter in trot down the centre line

The difficulty is basically making it look as easy and as effortless as possible, it should be fluent and horse and rider as one, as if they are dancing I guess!

The work to train the horses to do the movements from the riders command is insane. Years and years of training, it's a perfectionist sport. Plus the riders have to be incredibly fit with core strength

@Comtesse that's the tricky bit! It's a partnership, not all horses and riders work well together. But you couldn't put someone who didn't have a clue on one of the horses and them win a medal

I thought it was wonderful, those are the most camp ponies I’ve ever seen, and I especially loved the little twee fencing and flowers everywhere, as well as the diamanté headbands they wear.

I did wonder about the poor horses travelling all over though.

This is a test example so you can see how it's marked and it shows the movements
The arena has letters, so the movement is usually done at a letter or between them
(the higher the percentage score, the better)
The point is to make it look like you're doing nothing when you're using your hands, seat, weight, core, legs... most dressage riders have incredible stomach muscles!

@Babyroobs

I just watched a bit and thought what on earth is dressage all about and what exactly do the riders do. I'm sure there is skill involved but honestly I can't see the point of it, it's hardly a sport ??

Not just a huge amount of skill, but also enormous core strength, fantastic balance, ability to make extremely subtle movements and weight shifts while sitting on an animal that is itself moving powerfully. Serious riders cross-train, e.g. by biking or running, pilates, yoga, strength training, to build up the strength and fitness required to sustain a 10-minute Grand Prix dressage test. The horses likewise have to be very fit and strong, and highly trained and balanced to be able to respond to the rider's subtle instructions.

Basically, modern competitive dressage began as a way of demonstrating the level of training (French: "dressage") of cavalry horses and riders. For a long time, only cavalry officers could compete in the Olympics! All of the movements are natural to the horse, in that horses can be seen doing versions of them in the field. However, to do them with a rider, in a choreographed test, requires a huge amount of training. Ideally, a well-trained horse with a well-trained rider can go in any direction, at any pace/speed, at any moment: a dressage test is used to demonstrate this ability.

Fundamentally, dressage (in whatever style) should be the foundation for everything...not at GP level, of course, but in the sense that the horse and rider are trained to communicate, and the horse learns how to balance and carry a rider in a healthy way.

Dressage displays to music have been around for hundreds of years. The idea of using them for the individual final at the Olympics is newer: I think it was done for audience appeal? While I like watching a good Kür, I'm not that keen on it being the Olympic final. It seems gimmicky.

[quote NotMyCat]@Babyroobs it's really hard to watch if you're not into it I think. Basically the horse and rider have to do specific movements in a specific pace at a specific marker so as a really easy example, enter in trot down the centre line

The difficulty is basically making it look as easy and as effortless as possible, it should be fluent and horse and rider as one, as if they are dancing I guess!

The work to train the horses to do the movements from the riders command is insane. Years and years of training, it's a perfectionist sport. Plus the riders have to be incredibly fit with core strength [/quote]
Thanks for explaining. It makes you wonder if the horses enjoy it though ? I suppose it's the same with anything, they may not enjoy it but get no choice.

Some thrive off work, my old horse did. She got grumpier and more trouble when not working and would do stuff like dressage movements in the field or break the fencing
I mean if a horse really really doesn't want to do something, you can't make them It's like a half ton stubborn toddler

Believe me, I've had plenty of horses that refuse to do dressage, or merely tolerate it!

@BathshebaKnickerStickers

Ah see I hate dog dancing too.

Dog dancing makes both the dog and the human look ridiculous imo.

I kind of like dressage, as someone who's never managed to get a horse to do anything more taxing than speed up, slow down and stop I am in awe of the control they have. And Charlotte Dujardin's new horse is pretty.

But I hate that the thought that abuse is involved (I stopped going to the races 20-odd years ago because of the abuse). I had no idea.

I know nothing about dressage but it's fascinating to watch. I also get hooked on 3-day eventing and marvel at how one horse can excel at such totally different disciplines - brilliant!
Well I'm not sure I agree with horses being used in the police at all anymore, not since people have no respect for them and throw things at them.
Well I'm not sure I agree with people being used in the police at all anymore for the same reasons.