30 minutes to negotiate with the GP receptionist for a phone appointment

[Gakatsbsk]

Hi,

I am an nhs nurse, and so I realise this is not all GP receptionists but I have just spent 30 minutes speaking to a GP receptionist to try and negotiate a GP over the phone appointment.

It seemed to me like I was wading through excuse after excuse, in a hospital none of these excuses would wash.

The first excuse was that despite registering five weeks ago they didn’t have my medical records (I’ve moved between UK nations) and ‘there was no possible way’ to determine what previous medications I was on, my suggestion that they could be confirmed with me, the patient was of course completely ridiculous and I could be maliciously seeking meds (which are non opioid, non addictive and not remotely interesting to any one).

The second excuse was that I couldn’t have a GP appointment because I’d not had a GP appointment there yet and ✨ covid ✨. In secondary care we haven’t been able to use covid as a reason to not see any new patients, and of course how can I have had an appointment without having an appointment.

The third excuse was an altered replay of the first one, that doctor won’t be able to prepare for your consultation without your medical records. Doctors do this day in day out.

The fourth excuse was a lecture about how busy the nhs is, how covid is surging at our local hospital and how there’s so many covid patients in critical care. At this point I told her I work as a staff nurse in critical care at said hospital, and that this conversation was dragging on and could I please be given a GP appointment, or ANP appointment, or do I need to register elsewhere. At this point I was granted a phone appointment (anytime until 8pm so don’t go anywhere was the warning).

I do realise our colleagues in primary care are stretched, as we in secondary care are but this was ridiculous and it saddens me that vulnerable people probably miss out on health services because of attitudes like this. If I spoke to anyone on the phone in my job role the way she did, I’d end up facing disciplinary action if the other party complained.

Is it just me being completely unreasonable ?

Many thanks

Want to post to give a huge thanks to all the over worked GPs out there.

I understand the frustrations of the OP, but this is a registration problem.

Might I add that house building in our area has increased the population in our area by a modest estimation of 5,000. This puts added pressure on our PHC.

Despite this, I've used the PHC twice. Once given a place to go to for treatment of a blocked ear by my son - the doctor called me. The place she mentioned was specific to my son's extra needs and they were indeed brilliant.

Secondly they expedited my son's first vaccination shot. I contacted by email and got a call back the following day and his appointment was set up there and then.

We are in a world wide epidemic with cases of Covid rising exponentially. Covid cares not about freedom day.

Once again thank you GPs and all NHS workers. You've got us through this far. Keep going.

@placemats

Want to post to give a huge thanks to all the over worked GPs out there.

I understand the frustrations of the OP, but this is a registration problem.

Might I add that house building in our area has increased the population in our area by a modest estimation of 5,000. This puts added pressure on our PHC.

Despite this, I've used the PHC twice. Once given a place to go to for treatment of a blocked ear by my son - the doctor called me. The place she mentioned was specific to my son's extra needs and they were indeed brilliant.

Secondly they expedited my son's first vaccination shot. I contacted by email and got a call back the following day and his appointment was set up there and then.

We are in a world wide epidemic with cases of Covid rising exponentially. Covid cares not about freedom day.

Once again thank you GPs and all NHS workers. You've got us through this far. Keep going.

Thank you. The UK has lost 1,200 full-time equivalent GPs (net) in just the last 2 years, during which time the population has grown by getting on for a million, as well as ageing, so healthcare needs are going up. We are having to do more and more with less and less. The continual hate and criticism directed at GPs for the fact that they're aren't enough of us is almost unbearable. None of us went into medicine to offer patients poor care. General practice isn't the speciality you choose if you're driven by money (despite what the DM may tell you..) or glory. People become GPs or practice nurses because they like patients and want to give them excellent care. The fact that we often can't do that - because of lack of resources - is hard enough. The constant hate is tipping many of us over the edge.

@CommanderBurnham

Dentist here. We see most of our genuine emergencies within 24 hours, our regular patients (albeit long waiting times for routine appointments) and also anyone from 111 within 24 hours as well.

We are knackered and sick to the eyeballs with the extra protocols but we also know that little issues are best dealt with sooner before they become big issues as they have done during lockdown.

YANBU

Thank you to all you dentists and staff , i have received excellent care from my dentists during lockdown . I'm a vet nurse and my practice have worked our backsides off throughout ,the only thing we have not done is the odd house call . So i have little empathy when i hear of so many unacceptable experiences people have had with gp practices. Its a bit pathetic that over a year later so many gp practices haven't developed an efficient way to function .

Yanbu. Ours is the same - but I am impressed you managed to get the time down to 30mins! I expect this is the reason a and e gets swamped.

I have had similar at GP, booking nhs physios, dermatology dept, chemist.

It's driving me nutty and in end I have to interrupt and tell them that the covid excuses are wearing very thin.

I don't think it is hate against doctors.I wuld just like to pay a lot less take and opt out of the NHS as it is not treally there for when I need it.

Secondly we could not let anyone work part time in the NHS. We could also forbid anyone doing more than one job and no private work at all as is common in many other private sector jobs and those kinds of things perhaps. Also if you do not work for the NHS full time for 10 years after qualifying then you owe £x or whatever - basically try to ensure everyone works full time in it and does no other kinds of work.

My gp surgery has been excellent throughout with sensible telephone appointments, online consults and good support from the local pharmacy. Hospital telephone consults have been very good and I have had a few face to face consults and procedures, all very well organised.
I agree with pp that GPs should never have been doing the mass vaccination programme, it should have been delegated to the military and voluntary first aid services.
There is a poster on here whose husband has just died having been fobbed off by the gp for months. It is dreadful.
A friend's child ended up having emergency cardiac surgery via A&E after lots of fobbing off by the receptionist. Symptoms glaringly obvious and a family history of premature death from heart problems.
It is very hit and miss.

Yanbu

No this seems fairly standard.

I've only managed to achieve progression in my own healthcare needs by being persistent, reading a lot and making 'suggestions' (which have so far all been right), and generally being very on the ball and annoyingly polite but persuasive.

It bothers me that a lot of people are unable to do that for whatever reason and they're the ones that fall through the cracks.

If you're still connected to your previous surgery, I can recommend Pharmacy2U, they can approach it from wherever they are and it's posted to you, plus you can keep track of the progress. You may also be able to bypass the appointment system with your new GP with it because ✨covid✨ means they're a lot more forthcoming in dealing with you in the most hands off manner they can get away with.

I have no complaints with my actual GP, or the practice nurse, they’re both great, but the ridiculous rigmarole I had to go through over something that was eventually resolved with a 2 minute phone call.

Even my GP was somewhat perplexed by it - especially when he saw that we’d had to take DD to A&E.

3 months of trying to get medication for my child with no response to emails or e-consults and no answer to phone calls, is frustrating.

Receptionist refused me a telephone appointment within the time frame I requested (two weeks) and refused to accept that her refusal to do this meant that my benefits (my only income) would be suspended. The Practice Manager backed her. Luckily, I have savings, but it would have been the same if I did not.

I raised this with the senior partner two months ago and am still waiting for a response.

This surgery does not use eConsult, does not release an e mail address for patient use, has disabled the messaging facility and the facility to book appointments in Patient Access and no longer permits entry to the surgery. When I had to collect a blood test form, which took two weeks and five phone calls to achieve, it was pushed through the crack in the door!

Current wait for a telephone appointment is three weeks.

I was advised by my consultant to stick with this surgery as it is allegedly one of the better ones in the city. I cannot imagine what the rest are like.

Our GP surgery is like Fort Knox. Has been since pre covid. On hold for 30 minutes to speak to reception, then all the same day appointments have always gone (I am not sure they even exist tbh) and I will be offered a phone triage appointment in 2/3 weeks’ time. It is ridiculous and I am not surprised serious conditions are being missed and A&E are overwhelmed.

@Xenia - no one in the NHS to work part time? It would collapse as many people, as in other industries, chose to work part time. As regards to GP’s , a part time role is more hours per week than many class as a full time job.
Unfortunately there aren’t enough GP’s to go around. The population continues to increase but less doctors are going into GP work and many others are leaving ( not surprising if you read this thread). GP’s have too many patients per practice and there are plans to push more health care work onto them together with the booster programme for the Covid vaccinations. Wait times for appointments are going to increase significantly

I’ve been having an awful time with my GP surgery recently. I’m 30 weeks pregnant and need to have my whooping cough vaccine. I’ve been trying for weeks and weeks to get through to appointment line, sometimes calling over 200 times a day with no answer. Finally got through today and was told sorry they just have no appointments, she’s looking over a month into the future, there is nothing they can do, and can’t suggest another way to get the vaccine, tough luck

If you said no-one could work part-time for the NHS you would have no NHS. And if you said that consultants could not do private work as well, you would have many many fewer consultants. So also, basically no NHS.

I don't believe that most of the problems described with GPs surgeries (and experienced by me in England) are the fault of the individual GPs. Surely practice managment/IT/HR/funding arrangement issues play a large part?

@Xenia

I don't think it is hate against doctors.I wuld just like to pay a lot less take and opt out of the NHS as it is not treally there for when I need it.

Secondly we could not let anyone work part time in the NHS. We could also forbid anyone doing more than one job and no private work at all as is common in many other private sector jobs and those kinds of things perhaps. Also if you do not work for the NHS full time for 10 years after qualifying then you owe £x or whatever - basically try to ensure everyone works full time in it and does no other kinds of work.

This won't work. There's no basis that anyone working part time is detrimental, if anything two people 'sharing' full time hours enables more people to be employed, widening the pool of professionals etc, your suggestion is unfounded.

Secondly, doctors and consultants working for private companies alongside the NHS often comes with huge benefits to both situations. I don't think you've thought this through or actually considered the implications.

GP receptionists are also getting a lot of blame for "gate keeping". I think this is a huge problem and at the heart of it it's that gatekeeping is necessary because there are not enough GPs to meet demand.

That means receptionists are doing a rationing/triaging task that they aren't qualified for, and don't get trained or paid enough to take on. They must feel so unsafe just like nurses and doctors do. It's an awful situation and I don't doubt it makes them crazy, angry, suspicious, obstructive. They don't carry the can in the same way as HCPs with professional registration do, but they do bear the brunt of the onslaught and have very few tools at their disposal to deal with it.

A family member is a gp. A bloody good one who personally answers calls to reception some of the time. It is not enough and they are getting out. NHS losing talent that can't be replaced. Heartbreaking

Ridiculous. My friend was sent to A&E by his GP because they couldn't get him
Into a clinic for an urgent problem. Not the GP's fault at all. But it was completely inappropriate for him to be in A&E!

Thank you to all you dentists and staff , i have received excellent care from my dentists during lockdown

I'm glad you have, mine were shocking. They were unavailable for advice during the first lockdown and reopened a couple of months later than they could have done because they were 'decorating the surgery'. When they reopened I phoned as I had a problem with my tooth and was told there was nothing they could do, they weren't taking bookings and would phone me when they got to me on the list. That was August, I'm still waiting. In the meantime I saw a private dentist.

@Gakatsbsk

Thanks everyone for your reply, I have now reported this post as it has turned into GP bashing which was not my intention.

You’ve got no chance. MN love GP bashing.

This thread makes sorry and worrying reading. I have just had to complain to the practice manager about a catalogue of failings that I have experienced over the past few months.
I have only been with the practice for a couple of years and this is the first time I needed them. I am concerned that my experience could represent the new normal in NHS. I made it clear that I can evidence every aspect of my concerns and that I think the practice has become complacent 'We're very busy' and 'due to Covid' have become panaceas for failures. I have never complained about the NHS until now and I do not enjoy doing so but I felt that it was necessary.

The practice failed in several areas. I'll keep it brief; this is not an exhaustive account by any means.

After the usual receptionist dance, I managed to get a GP phone consultation scheduled about a long term condition Instead of getting the phone appointment with a doctor I got a dismissive call from a receptionist to say that ' a referral has been done, they will be in touch.' I was dismissed when I asked about the referral and cut off. There was no further information from the practice at all. I had no idea what, where or when. On trying the practice again I was told that it had been sent to the main local hospital and that I would hear 'from them'; dismissed again. After weeks without any news, I managed to find the relevant department who, needless to say, have had nothing whatsoever from the practice. The referral has not been made. The first request for an appointment was in May. I am not even on a months long waiting list.

Further is it now acceptable medical for the NHS surgery to substitute a 10 second call from a receptionist for a long-awaited phone consultation with a GP?

There are other issues with the failure to transmit prescriptions to the designated pharmacy. This is following several assurances (reception) that it had been sent etc.
Is it OK to make a patient go back and forth with reception more concerned to engage in a 'oh yes we did' game. Reception grudgingly agreed to get it rewritten and resent. I finally got the medication 6 days late and after endless calls (reception) and visits to the pharmacy.

This is not an exhaustive account but illustrates the change in attitude towards patients. Where is the care? Where is the attention to doing a job properly?

I think that there is a mindset that Covid has taken over. Anything else is just a nuisance to be batted away asap. I agree that receptionists seem to enjoy their new empowerment a bit too much in many cases. Patients can be treated with the same dismissive contempt as are the customers of energy providers. At least we can switch energy supplier.

Frighteningly we are sleep walking into a 2 tier system. The only alternative is to pay privately or routinely to experience what has been written about in this forum.
This is a betrayal of what the NHS stands for.

So far this practice has failed me 100%. I have no confidence that they can be trusted to do what they say they have done. To date I have to not received any explanation (covid/busy/sorry) excepted. The referral is still not made (I first sought one in May).

After making the complaint I was given another phone appointment with a G.P. I (as opposed to the earlier receptionist call) I have again asked for an explanation for these failings. I doubt I'll get anywhere.

The NHS is in trouble.

ANOTHER NHS bashing thread this week. Anyone would think it was part of a campaign.

@Tinpotspectator

ANOTHER NHS bashing thread this week. Anyone would think it was part of a campaign.

It's not "NHS bashing". It is people relating their very valid and concerning experiences. People who are worried about their health and worried about the response (or lack of) that they have received from primary care.

Everything in the garden is not rosy, and it is perfectly acceptable to acknowledge this, especially in such specific terms.

@FuzzyPuffling it is NHS bashing. Or more specifically GP bashing. It’s one thing to acknowledge that the system is broken and that the service is unable to meet the demands. It’s another thing to say that GPs have done nothing throughout the pandemic, and had an easy life, which is what many people on here are saying.
Every GP who posts on here says they’ve never worked so hard. Are they all lying?