Questions for white people: what is the problem with "taking the knee"

[Flayn]

1. What is the problem with taking the knee
2. How would you prefer athletes protest racism

I am a regular poster, under a changed name and speak 2nd language English - I know the passive aggressiveness some posters adopt for this topic.

The players took the knee and still got racist abuse. There have been serious campaigns over racism in football and there have been definite improvements to when I was younger. If taking the knee highlights,racism, fine. It might give some people cause to think, but those are not the people who are booing. Racists are not going to examine their consciences and amend behaviour by the footballers doing so. Only people interested in changing themselves, can; those who don't want to, won't.

Because:
A. It’s a subservient pose
B. It has links (yes I know not solely) with a vile Marxist movement
C. It just seems yet another diversity thing to do that in reality doesn’t affect my day to day existence. There’s a lot of causes we are supposed to be allies of I tend to concentrate on ones that impact me, quite frankly I could spend every second of every day attending this that or the other adorned with various ribbons and lanyards.
D. Connected to C I’m fed up with the hypocrisy and self fulfilling prophecies and victim hood attached to many such causes. I’m fed up of seeing people destroying statues of someone who did something hundreds of years ago whilst wearing clothes made by children in sweat shops etc.
E. I’m fed up of being bullied into what I should think. I know racism is abhorrent but don’t tell me how I should express that thought

I agree that politics shouldn't be in sport. But being against racism shouldn't have anything to do with politics. It should just be about being a human being. So taking the knee in sport is fine with me.

@GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing
There’s something very powerful about using what usually a gesture of submission to highlight - and object to - people being subjugated.

I agree. They also didn’t do it during the National Anthem, they did it after. I thought they looked splendid and was really pleased that Italy did the same.

As for it being ‘Too American’, that’s ridiculous. We have many influences from the US, some good others not so much, just as we are also influenced by other countries’ cultures and vice versa.

Oh yes, white and 60+ here, and sadly my knees would no longer be up to it.

@FightingtheFoo - theft, murder and rape - crimes often black men are suspected, convicted for.

I am not sure.

I'm white and I support it.

Is kneeling not considered a sign of submission in some cultures then? You are literally making yourself smaller and lower than other people.

I mean, both Christians and Muslims kneel as a mark of subservience (and both sometimes also lie down), and combined Christians and Muslims are most of the world population.

I’m white and I have no problem with athletes or anyone else protesting peacefully against racism however they see fit. I would never boo or criticise players for taking the knee. I’m also a lifelong football fan and a season ticket holder at a Championship club.

Many people go to watch football for escapism and enjoyment, or to socialise with like minded friends and object to what they see as the ‘politicisation’ of football. They do not consider themselves as racists so they object to what they see as being preached at about a political issue in an environment where they have paid to be entertained.

Others see ‘taking the knee’ as a gesture of subservience and therefore not one they wish to associate with.

So, the team ‘takes the knee’ for 10 seconds, are they less racist when they get back up?

I know racism is abhorrent but don’t tell me how I should express that thought

Has anyone told you to take the knee? I've never been asked to, and nor do I know anyone who has.
We're talking about a sport-related campaign gesture in this country. And particularly in a game where racism among fans is a real problem, and clubs and football authorities are working hard to change that.

I'm white and approve athletes going down on one knee.

Is the gesture not a re-enactment of the awful abuse given out by those American policemen? Where the man gasped "I can't breathe". Taking the knee seems to me to be rather gruesome if that is the case, and so for that reason I don't like seeing it. Much as I don't like seeing Jesus' body on a cross in a church.

Everything @Ihatefish said.

It's virtue signalling bullshit.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2021/jul/02/just-one-solitary-idiot-shouting-abuse-at-me-at-a-footie-match-i-call-that-progress

The team is making it clear that the racists who wear their shirts and chant their names have nothing to do with them. It’s a powerful statement.

I totally agree with making a stand against racism.

But taking the knee seems a very subservient gesture in British culture.

And honestly, it seems to create more division.

@Changethetoner

Is the gesture not a re-enactment of the awful abuse given out by those American policemen? Where the man gasped "I can't breathe". Taking the knee seems to me to be rather gruesome if that is the case, and so for that reason I don't like seeing it. Much as I don't like seeing Jesus' body on a cross in a church.

No, it isn't. It's already been explained further up the thread.

Toner, that is what I thought, but apparently it isn’t. People have explained it is to do with showing respect for the armed forces while protesting racism.

I want to re-phrase that :

Others see ‘taking the knee’ as a gesture of subservience or weakness and therefore not one they want their club or its players who they see as representatives of their town or their community to participate in.

A very strange phrase to a mature white female.
Kneeling - whether on 1 or both knees - indicates subservience to ones "betters". I don't have any "betters" so would never kneel or kowtow to anyone.

I wrote that before I Googled it, & am still puzzled why anyone would show subservience on a sports ground.

1. I have no issue whatsoever with athletes taking the knee
2. I wish I knew. There is no place for racism in sport, nor any other facet of life. It appals me, and whenever I see it on social media I report it.

i am white and proud of the footballers for taking the knee. Racism needs to be stamped out.

I kneel before my God.
I won't purposely kneel before or for anyone else unless they have a gun to my head.

I just think it's a meaningless but easy thing for people to do & I actually hadn't got a clue why people were going on about it.

It comes across to me as one of those "look at me here virtue signalling aren't I so clever & on trend" things that happen from time to time but means absolutely nothing with any depth or longevity.

I had to google what it was for apart from attention seeking & I still think it's stupid.

I think if you want to protest racism then do it, don't posture about it & call it done.

Give it a few months & the posts will start coming out about how x took the knee but look at these hateful comments/actions etc... they did afterwards.

It originates from Luther King, believe. No problem with it at all. I’ve never been anywhere that’s its been done, but happy to support an entirely harmless pro-equality gesture.

Far better a knee than a bullet. I don’t support the shooting of people nor the suffocation of people based on their ethnicity.

please don't generalize - I do not know what goes on in others head about taking the knee
I was brought up as a RC genuflecting is normal to my upbringing & as a sign of respect - so no issue -