Do we need to split this or do I need to get my shit together?

[dustyflipflop]

I am prepared to be told either.
I'm pretty shit at housekeeping and fairly messy so maybe it's just the fact that I'm so unorganised that I can't keep on top of things.

DH works Mon-Fri usually 8-5.30/6pm, non manual job, sometimes requiring nights away and generally always open to a phone call even on an evening and usually finishing bits of paperwork whilst on the sofa on a night.
I work PT 3 days a week fitting around school hours, it's a flexible role and I can pretty much pick and choose my hours as long as I hit the deadlines. This means I work school hours on the 3 days my youngest is at nursery and then evenings and also in between when I can fit an hour in or so to keep on top of stuff sometimes more sometimes less. I do all the school runs and drop offs for obvious reasons.
2 days a week my youngest is at home with me and on one of them we do an activity together.
We are all (4 of us including primary aged dc1) at home on weekends.

Considering I am at home with dc2 for 2 days in the week not counting the 3 hours for the activity on one of the days is it safe to assume I should do absolutely everything to do with the house?
If so then why can't I crack it?

I do all the cooking, laundry, cleaning, washing up and shopping. DH cooks on weekends and will tend to do the dishes then too but apart from that doesn't do anything else past the occasional bit of gardening and taking the bins out.

We had a chat today about the house being a tip, the majority of it is. DH said he can't do it due to working hours and that I should not be picking and choosing what bits I feel like doing that day but should do a schedule and stick to it as I might find it easier.
I don't think he's wrong but I still feel kind of resentful, he gets to just think about work whilst I feel like I'm juggling.
I've never seen him set the washing machine or clean a toilet, never folded DCs clothes or put them away. If he shops he leaves in the kitchen for me to put away as the cupboards are a mess and he says he never knows where stuff can fit.

He does work extremely hard and in a quite pressured role, mine is much more laid back and PT but then I'm juggling school runs, clubs, housework, laundry, shopping. He really does try to do clubs with eldest whenever he can and any extra curricular activities if possible as he doesn't see them much Mon-Fri.

How can I make this work? Do I need to get my backside in gear and organise everything? Is there anything I could expect him to do or should I just work on how I schedule it in?

All opinions welcome.

DH said he can't do it due to working hours and that I should not be picking and choosing what bits I feel like doing that day but should do a schedule and stick to it as I might find it easier.

You said he works 8-6, with a bit extra in the evening. So that presumably leaves him with at least 3-4 hours free every night and weekends free (obviously unless he is away with work).

You work all the hours your dc is nursery and some extra in evenings. You have 1.5 days when you are at home with the youngest. My memories of pre-school kids is that it's really difficult to get much in the way of housework done while they're up and at it.

As you are catching up on work in the evenings, it seems to me that he has more free time than you that could be allocated to housework.

Maybe figure out what's doable while you are at home with the kids. Making dinner, putting a wash on, maybe sorting a bit of laundry sounds reasonable. Then divide the rest. Your dh sounds like he has decided housework is all your responsibility. You need to disabuse him of that notion.

Make a schedule with him

Get him to sign up to a fair share or offer him divorce papers

Take no prisoners

Your house is a mess? There are many people who work (both parents) and they manage to keep a tidy house.

Are you looking to attribute blame for the untidy house?

I’m puzzled as to what the problem is and what the solution is that you’re looking for. What I can ascertain is you have a messy house. I assume messier than usual. Trying to attribute blame and enter a competition of who works more or have more time to tidy up is a complete waste of time and damaging to your relationship.

Do you two want cleaner house?

I never get when people ask “What did they do before?” Every bloke I’ve been out with as an adult used to either do it themselves or have a cleaner. It’s a damn sight easier shopping/cooking/cleaning for one as well.

A lot of people would also hire cleaners and do shopping on line. When I lived alone, I’d certainly have done this had I been able to afford it.

DH said... that I should... do a schedule and stick to it as I might find it easier.

Thank him for his wise counsel and ask him to show you what he means. Ask him to write you out a schedule and you'll be happy to follow it.

Otherwise, pretty much this, On the days hours you’re off then you should do it all. The days you’re both working/both off everything should be split equally.

As for divorce, if my husband threatened me with divorce, I’m of the personality to listen and start planning my way out. Ultimatums can be like a red rag to a bull for some people so be careful when you venture down that line because you could so do irreparable damage.

I am going to be harsh, sorry if you find it too much so.

What would he do if you suddenly dropped dead?

Let the filth build up until the house was riddled with mold, pestilence and structural problems till it fell down around his ears?

Starve to death quite quickly?

Let your child die of neglect?

No, he fucking would not.

He would find the time and energy.

He is a lazy bastard who sees it all as your job because it fucking suits him to.

Stop buying into his bullshit and tell him to pull his fucking finger out.

Seems a lot of drama to keep a home clean when many busy households across the nation manage to do so.

@Treacletoots

Ahh OP. The reason why women still get left with "women's work" in 2021 is because we let them.

You work part time because you NEED to pick up the kids. Perhaps if your DH realised they were his kids too and did some actual parenting then you wouldn't have to.

It seems quite obvious that he works to avoid parenting and household chores and sadly so far he's got away with it because you've enabled him.

DH and I have always worked full time. I made it very clear that I wouldn't be going part time to enable his career at the expense of my own and it works. We split both childcare, school drop offs and housework equally.

If I were you I'd tell him you're going back to work full time and therefore he needs to step up and split everything, and I mean EVERYTHING equally.

The shock of this might open his eyes to how much you actually do, and how little he does. I've no time for men who think their careers are so important that they suddenly forget how to parent/adult and that their wife is solely there as their maid /nanny.

It'd cost him a lot more if you divorced.

This.

OP, when you are home with a toddler, you are childminding. You are not the household skivvy.

But you do need a system that works and is fair. Why not, for example, get a weekly grocery delivery that arrives at a regular time on one of your days at home and you can make sure you put it away. You can also do a laundry load each day: stick it on before school and hang it out after school.

But the overall cleaning and tidying: that should be a joint effort - 15-20 minutes each night after DC are in bed, plus 1 hour each on Saturday mornings, blitzing the house: hoovering, dusting, mopping, cleaning bathroom etc.

Take turns to cook and keep it simple on nights you both work: filled pasta and pesto with salad or chicken and veg tray bake etc.

Could you hire a cleaner? Tell him you can’t do everything and you need to have an arrangement where you’re not falling out over housework. It would give you a bit more time and a more pleasant life.

Don’t underestimate the mental load or the exhaustion of a child that age at home two days a week (I assume - i have twins so don’t know what it’s like with one but I’m sure it’s still exhausting).

The issue is that there are things he’s never done. That will only build resentment. He has about the same non-working time you do - it’s not like you can leave a nursery age child alone while you go and scrub the loo (again slight assumption as my boys need constant supervision).

He needs to understand the volume of stuff you do. Make a list - including the things you may not think of (keeping track of clothes, replacing stuff that’s outgrown, getting uniform ready, making packed lunches, staying on top of term dates and stuff at school, hospital appointments, hair cuts etc). Then all the household stuff. Then ask him which jobs he wants.

I think that I’d look at the cause of most of the work - and eliminate as much of that as possible. It’s quite possible your DH is the cause of much of that!

Dishwasher is a must.
I’d add an extra job to your DH as really you don’t have that many hours ‘free’. Well almost zero. Parenting is not cleaning.
I’d give your DH the clothes washing and ask him to also clear up anything that he untidies etc.
Then I’d get shopping delivered.
That leaves you with still a lot of work - but again minimise it. Cook pasta one evening, then reheat it the next day with a different sauce.
Hoover only as much as you can.
Bathrooms keep on top of by doing it every day for 10 mins.
Kitchen again 10 mins a day.
All other tidying is really getting into good habits - my home is never untidy because we just don’t leave stuff around. My teenagers bedrooms is but he just flings around clothes every day! I leave that to him.
And on one day at the weekend (so your DH can look after the kids) do 30 mins in one room only.

Your dh is a dick.

When mine were little I had a baby, child under two and a four year old. DH worked at director level. Would leave the house at seven so that he could be back by half six. The minute he walked in he would start parenting. When we only had one he would take the baby and I would cook dinner. As more babies came along we would both get stuck in. He did more baths and stories as I would be feeding the youngest. Dinner would happen between us. I did most of the washing and shopping but he would do anything that needed doing. Funnily enough having a penis didn't stop him doing an evening shop and putting it away on folding the laundry and to find out where it went he used this amazing things called eyes.
Just because I was at home didn't mean everything in it was my responsibility and just because he went out to work didn't mean he couldn't do what needed doing in the home.

Just to answer a couple of bits and a little update.
Before we were together he was working absolutely ridiculous hours anywhere from 6-8 am until 10pm sometimes longer for various reasons. He was barely at home and had a cleaner once a week to clean the (barely lived in house), do the laundry, iron and put it all away.

To another PP at this moment in time we cannot afford a cleaner.

We just had a chat and he's happy to do whatever needs to be done as long as he can also spend a good chunk of time with DCs at the weekends since he barely sees them mon-fri.

I think we just need to come up with a proportionate split but I'm not sure what that is ATM.

That's alright, he can do his bit in the evening when the kids are in bed. If he deepcleaned the bathroom in the week it can just have a quick wipe at the weekend. If he washes up every night after dinner (assuming he can't cook?) then you can have some time to do admin, tidy a room or god forbid have a breather.

I'm usually home a little more than DH but everything is split 50/50. I look after the kids more and DH works more. My house goes to pot on the days we are both at work or if the kids are on holiday.

I have a daily/weekly/monthly cleaning lists and it's split equally and none of the tasks take longer than 30 minutes or I get bored and don't want to do it. Only stipulation is DH deals with the kitchen and I do the bathroom

OP, when you are home with a toddler, you are childminding. You are not the household skivvy

It's ridiculous to say that when a parent is with a child for the day they can't also do chores.

And 'skivvy' is a loaded word.

Keeping a home clean and tidy is not skivvying. It's carrying out basic tasks that everyone has to do unless they want to live in filth and chaos.

Make a list of what needs doing
daily
weekly
monthly

You can both keep on top of the bathroom by spraying the bath or shower each time it's used, swishing the basin clean every day, bleaching the loo overnight. That all takes 10 mins.

Sort the washing and put a load on when you get up so it's ready to peg out or whatever you do before one of you goes to work.

Make a menu for the week and get an online delivery.

Batch cook and freeze a couple of meals each week so you always have something in the freezer- casseroles, curries, soups, etc.

At weekend, take a room each and vacuum and dust, tidy up.

And as your kids get older, rope them in and show them how to do it!

Is your house full of unused clutter and shit everywhere .

I'd laugh in his face op, he needs to get stuck in.

For context i don't work, dp does (we have a newborn and 12 year old). Dp does all the cooking, hoovering, ironing and gardening. I do the laundry and washing up.

You shouldn't be doing it all. More than him, yes, but not it all. I'd be inclined to break it down into units to help discuss it and agree what's fair.

Eg there are 7 days in a week for both of you, so there are 14 days worth in total every week.
He works 5 of his days. So only has a few hours in the evening on those days plus 2 free days at the weekend.
You work 3 days and do childcare for 2 days. You have the same number of hours free in the evenings as he does (shunning you work full days) plus the same 2 weekend days.

So the difference is anything you can fit in while doing childcare. This is likely to be a lot of the less time consuming tasks (putting a wash on, loading and unloading the dishwasher you definitely need to buy, ordering click and collect shopping) the rest you need to divide between you.

@bubblebath62636

I'd laugh in his face op, he needs to get stuck in.

For context i don't work, dp does (we have a newborn and 12 year old). Dp does all the cooking, hoovering, ironing and gardening. I do the laundry and washing up.

Your poor DH

And he works full time too?

You need a cleaner and tidy upper. Fours a week spit into two hour sessions. It is NOT your responsibility to do all the housework.

Thank you for all the replies so far.

As I said in my OP I am naturally messy so it doesn't help.
However I guess one pp hit on the head the mental load.

Yes he needs to go to work, make sure his car is sorted for it, prep the night before for the day after.
And yes I work PT and in between as I say but I sort all the school runs, make sure DCs have clean uniforms for school, do laundry and all the other housework alongside scheduling appointments for us all and doing shopping most of the time or at least putting it away all the time.
As I did say I'm struggling with it and the house is a tip so I guess I'm not doing so great on that front but I think the resentment has been creeping in about the fact that none of those things ever even cross his mind.

Still not sure what a fair split would be though

I think a fair split is what both parties find reasonable and doable.

It seems that you do WAY more than is fair to me personally. Could you do a schedule as he suggested but assign him specific tasks to do I.e. 1 hour of ironing / laundry a night, all hoovering etc.

It sounds like you are really under pressure and I can certainly empathise with that!

All seems so dramatic. I did more house stuff as I was home with the kids while dh worked outside the home. When he was there he did what needed doing as did I. No split dramatic discussions. No issue if I was sat while he did stuff. Just make sure everything is done and tell him to stop being so pathetic. Even him saying he'll do more as long as he can spend time with the kids sounds like he is priming you to accept him not doing much more.