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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

School where children must smile all the time, follow whistled commands and never glance out of the window

340 replies

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 03/07/2021 14:25

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/parents-slam-school-rules-always-24451911

Sounds horrific. I'd home educate a child rather than send them to a place like this. I can't help thinking one of the responses on Twitter I saw may be right - are they trying to drive out children with additional needs who might pull down the GCSE results? My daughter is an adult now but she would have been destroyed by an environment like this. She's very bright but on the autistic spectrum.


Parents have criticised strict new school rules which include "always smiling", never looking out the window and even asking permission to pick up a pen.

Natalie Teece, the newly-appointed headteacher at John Ferneley College in Melton Mowbray, Leicestershire, has drafted the guidelines ahead of the school reopening in September.

The new rules were delivered to parents in an e-booklet, along with three videos explaining the research and the reason behind them.

Ms Teece said that when 11 to 16-year-olds students return to class, they will be expected to "always smile" and learn to respond to a series of whistle commands given by staff.

They also must enter the classroom in single file, "never forget to say Sir or Miss", always sit up straight and must thank their teacher as they leave the classroom after a lesson.

Walking in a group of more than two people and looking out of windows in class are also banned.

Turning around "even if you hear a noise" is forbidden and pupils have to maintain eye contact with the teacher whenever they are talking, the rules say.

Kids have to wait to be told they may pick up a pen or ruler and if a teacher says hello to them they should make sure their reply is "upbeat".

.......

One rule about lining up said staff will be using whistles to direct kids, with five sounds meaning they must move to their line up area, and one indicating pupils should be silent.

Another about "tracking" the teacher said: "You don't pick up your pen or your ruler, or anything else, until your teacher gives you the signal.

"You never turn around - even if you hear a noise behind you. You don't look out of the window. You don't lose focus."

A rule on sitting up straight said: "You never slouch. Be sitting up straight you are demonstrating physical respect. [ ...] No exceptions. No excuses."

And another said: "You always smile. You are polite and welcoming. When you greet somebody you smile, when a teacher says hello to us in the corridor you reply with an upbeat 'Hello Miss!' or 'Morning Sir!' and you smile."

The guidelines inform students that they are "extremely fortunate to be in a school that is very popular" and must walk around the school only in single file or pairs.
*

OP posts:
TurquoiseDragon · 03/07/2021 15:36

The other secondary school in the town has strict rules on behaviour, but the rules are sensible, and followed. The kids are well turned out, behaviour is good, and the school has a great vibe.

John Ferneley is part of an academy trust, yes. My DC went to the other school.

pointythings · 03/07/2021 15:37

Well, it's the trend. We have an authoritarian government, so authoritarian schools will be viewed positively. I worry about the posters who think kids are so bad that they need military style discipline imposed on them. There is a middle ground, only people don't seem to want to find it.

roguetomato · 03/07/2021 15:38

Can this even be possible to enforce? Do parents actually send children knowing the rules?

FlyingBattie · 03/07/2021 15:40

@selflove

I suspect if posters here saw what an inner city secondary in a poor area is actually like, this school as an alternative wouldn't seem so bad.

These schools are being made to mimic the environment of the British Army. And I think if I lived in an area where my secondary school choices were

  1. this school - incredibly strict, harsh discipline but zero bullying as children have to remain silent in corridors and in lunch hall etc, and kids actually learn and pay attention in lessons Or
  2. other local inner city comps - zero learning going on due to disruptions, common for kids to bring knives in. Shit GCSE results.

I think I'd choose the former 🤷🏻‍♀️

There is a middle ground, you know. And I went to a shithole comp in a poor area. 95% of kids on FSM, the whole shebang. No knives, and a reasonable GCSE A-C percentage (of those who sat them- some kids did BTECs instead, or were working towards an apprenticeship at 16) All for discipline, definitely not for hiding emotions with stepford smiles.
Brefugee · 03/07/2021 15:40

that's going too far. Are the teachers always going to smile and make eye contact?

WHISTLE COMMANDS? what are they puppies?

3scape · 03/07/2021 15:42

You'd have to have a lot of hate for your kids. Very Big Brother. Make way for the thought police in your life.

Itsrainingatlast · 03/07/2021 15:43

It’s a behavioural approach known as ‘warm-strict’. As pp have said, in tough, inner city schools (that have mostly been totally shafted by the new funding formula) an approach like this can be transformative.
Fundamentally, the principle is that no student should have their learning disrupted by the behaviour of others; I’m sure many of those who have fallen for the sensationalist reporting here would be equally horrified if their little darlings had their learning disrupted by poor behaviour. If you don’t have the wherewithal to move to get your child into the ‘outstanding’ school down the road, what are you supposed to do?
I’ve seen an approach like this work. Transformed a previously failing school in a matter of weeks. Students actually like rules (and of course the journos don’t want you to know that many SEN students thrive).
I do agree with the inequality of ‘Sir’ and ‘Miss’ though. Full names only are better; Ms Itsraininglast.

Cowbells · 03/07/2021 15:44

How revolting. DS would have been bullied by staff for 'slouching' as he has scoliosis which looks like a constant slouch.

I hope she lasts five minutes.

NeverDropYourMoonCup · 03/07/2021 15:46

I'm glad I'm not staff there. The idea of forcing anybody to adopt a mask like grin whatever their physical or mental condition is obscene.

Whistled commands, I can't get as bothered by, as it has been effective in naval services for centuries, as the sounds carry and cut through other noise. As long as they are not used as a means of deliberately hurting the ears (memories of PE teachers there) and any students with ASD/Tinnitus/sensitivity are able to wear ear defenders/filters to block the nastiest overtones out.

Slouching - well, it wouldn't hurt to expect sitting up straight for most kids as it's better for the back, but there will be kids who literally cannot sit up straight - scoliosis, EDS, arthritis, spondylitis, diagnosed or not yet. Are those kids supposed to smile when telling you that theirs hurts? I have to go slightly side on towards speakers to not have everything drowned out on one side by Tinnitus, which means I'm slouching rather than perching.

But constant eye contact - fuck that. I absorb the majority of information whilst looking down and doodling because it means I can listen to the words, not get distracted by Tinnitus sounds, the movement, extraneous distractions like posters, paint colours, mess, etc. A large part of my job means getting information out of kids - the whole point of not maintaining direct eye contact is that they feel less threatened or put on the spot - most of the time, the disclosures come when they are sitting to the side and nobody is staring at them, demanding explanations.

Frankly, the one bit that could be useful - the whistled signals - is entirely outweighed by the shit ones. It's as though the head has read some books on Pack Theory and wants to establish teachers as alpha males by staring out the pups and making them wait to eat, when 94% of the time, you need to be more of a Horse Whisperer.

Classica · 03/07/2021 15:47

Burn that school down.

rantymcrantface66 · 03/07/2021 15:50

Is Melton Mowbray also a place name in North Korea? Wow, imagine dc with additional support needs. Those with sensory issues, adhd or tics. In fact no, any child. Again, wow!

igelkott2021 · 03/07/2021 15:52

Just read some of the comments on the Times version of this article. More than one person has alluded to the girls getting used to smiling so that they are ready for random blokes saying "smile love" .

But apparently it's fine for teachers to deny access to the toilet because "all" the kids try it on.

Panaesthesia · 03/07/2021 15:57

No toilet between lessons? And, I assume, during them. Pretty sure denying people toilet access would be against a law or two, but clearly they think those rules don't apply to them.

We had four pervert teachers in our high school. They'd lock the doors, make offers for what you had to do to ensure A grades at coursework. One was suspended. One left under a cloud. The other two got off scott free. Imagine trying to report abuse at this school.

rantymcrantface66 · 03/07/2021 15:57

Also to those saying about similar schools having good results over all - what happens when they leave and go in to the real world that isn't that structured. A bit like when people leave the army and can really struggle to adapt to civilian life without the routine and structure. Has anyone monitored what happens to these dc long term as adults outside that rigid setting?

user1745 · 03/07/2021 16:00

Oh I was wondering when this would be posted here! It's utterly ridiculous. I can see what they're trying to do: instil the idea of total unfaltering obedience in children that will eliminate any deviation from "proper" behaviour, but it won't work and it's inhumane. Children aren't obliged to smile all the time just because it looks pretty. They shouldn't be whistled at like dogs when they're perfectly able to understand verbal commands. As for not picking up a pen or glancing out of the window without permission, that would never be tolerated in the adult workplace so there's no reason our children should have to put up with it. In fact that kind of micromanagement that strips the individual of all personal control is actually linked to poor morale, mental health problems, stress and worse performance.

I give it 2 days once term starts before the teachers give up on it. I have to wonder if this headteacher has ever worked with children and young people before?

Chanjer · 03/07/2021 16:00

Turning around "even if you hear a noise" is forbidden

This is a very uncompetitive survival strategy

Marguerite2000 · 03/07/2021 16:03

The constant smiling is a bit much, but apart from that it sounds ok to me, as long as genuine medical needs (eg cowbell's son with scoliosis) are taken into account. It's just a standard zero tolerance approach which we could do with more of in our society, to be quite honest. The liberal individual approach isn't working, it just means shit behaviour is allowed to flourish.

Prokupatuscrakedatus · 03/07/2021 16:04

What are the behaviour rules for teachers?

toffeebutterpopcorn · 03/07/2021 16:05

I wonder if the head has ever actually had to teach a class of real kids.

Whoever has to write out detention/referral slips will get RSI.

BarbarianMum · 03/07/2021 16:08

I think a lot of parents have forgotten how miserable it is trying to learn in an atmosphere of constant low level disruption- or possibly they were the ones doing the disrupting and they didnt care. This wouldnt have been my first choice of learning environment as a teen but it's a hell of a lot better than a lot of what I had to put up with.

user1745 · 03/07/2021 16:08

@selflove

Found a link about the Michaela school which sounds v similar

amp.theguardian.com/education/2016/dec/30/no-excuses-inside-britains-strictest-school

If she's doing something that works, good for her I guess. It's not for every kid, but definitely seems to be good for some

I don't think this sounds similar at all. I think the Michaela school sounds very reasonable. Pupils are expected to walk through corridors single-file, clear up litter, bring required equipment to school etc. It's a tight ship but it's fair and reasonable.

This school is expecting children to always smile, never drop eye contact with teachers, resist instinctive reactions like looking in the direction of a noise, ask permission for the smallest actions like picking up a pen, which is just weird and unreasonable.

Kanaloa · 03/07/2021 16:10

Shocking. And as pps said there’s a lovely middle ground between getting stabbed at break and having to face forward with a smile plastered on as a bomb goes off behind you. I’d remove my child immediately. Forced cheerfulness on threat of punishment is worse than moodiness in my opinion.

Greenandcabbagelooking · 03/07/2021 16:16

I like my students to smile because I want them to be happy. However, no one sits and grins their way through maths, English and double PE. If they smile when I make a joke, when greeted, when a friend says something, that's good. If they weren't, I would check everything was ok, not dish out detentions.

Pottedpalm · 03/07/2021 16:16

Is the use of whistles for the playground? If so, that’s perfectly reasonable. Whistles are in use in many school playgrounds.
I would rather a class of teenagers attempting a smile than the sneers and glares that many adopt.
The no turning round is to combat the endless distraction by other students.
Ver few teachers would be talking to even an A level class for full hour/lesson; pupils would be engaged in other activities and they might stand a chance of understanding what they were to do if they had actually concentrated and listened.
Most of these rules seem pretty reasonable to me, and preferable to the laisser faire attitude of many parents.

VettiyaIruken · 03/07/2021 16:16

That is utterly ridiculous.

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