To feel uncomfortable with celebrity surrogacy?

[Username91]

After reading about Amber Herd having a baby girl via surrogate it just got me thinking about the amount of famous people who have children this way. I have nothing against surrogacy, it just seems to me that a lot of rich women choose to have children this way and I’m not convinced they ALL have problems carrying children themselves. I find it a bit disturbing and wondered if I’m alone in thinking this?

Once again I’d like to point out I’m not surrogacy bashing here. I just don’t think it should be something that is used by women with money as they don’t like the idea of carrying their own babies, of course it’s very different for women who struggle to conceive/carry themselves.

Maybe Amber Heard is on psychiatric medication that would be harmful to a baby? I'm not comfortable with surrogacy because of the trauma to the baby and potentially to the mother (i.e. the woman who actually carries the child), but it's one of many things I feel have ethical problems, from sweatshop workers to animal welfare. I don't know, it's just the world we live in I guess.
I have to say I don't envy any child having Amber Heard as a mother either.

I don’t see a problem with surrogacy in the U.K., it’s altruistic. So long as a woman isn’t forced to be a surrogate surely it’s down to them to do it if they want to? I knew of a surrogate who do it because they loved being pregnant, and wanted to help a friend/family. And she was a feminist!

This woman has two children of her own, nearly died with a life threatening haemorrhage that needed a spell in ICU with her fifth surrogate pregnancy and has carried on to have another two. (Nine births in total).

Personally I am shocked and appalled that IVF clinics would carry on using her like this. She delivered the sixth in December 2019 and the seventh was due in March 2021 meaning she must have been impregnated around six months after the previous one. How can that be healthy? I think she's had the seven over a period of about eight years.

The NHS has to pick up the pieces and deal with these high risk pregnancies while the private IVF clinic makes its money.

And what of her own children? She has prioritised breeding babies for strangers over the care and welfare of her own children who could have been orphaned. However much some women may love being pregnant and feel well, there's no way she can run around playing football with her son and daughter in the park. What life have those children had while she is busy meeting up with potential commissioning parents and going to fertility clinics and spending time in hospital?

I don't think loving being pregnant is a great reason to be a multiple surrogate mother - it's deeply selfish.

I love giving birth. This is my seventh surrogate baby’.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/a5a8dbd8-4ac5-11eb-81f9-1b786036a268?shareToken=cc100bd93dc1a3e12fab2d998e6355fbb_

Egg donation is about building better babies. There are height, weight, health, educational, and psychological requirements. Still, there are no guarantees. What is it like to carry a child not related to you?it’s not something I would want to be involved with, but money can buy everything in some places.
If artificial wombs can produce children, some women will opt for those. What would these baked children be like, when compared to a child grown under his mother’s heart?

@AwaAnBileYerHeid

None of our business. We have no way of knowing if these women do or don't have medical issues which affect them carrying children.

Much like any surrogacy - I'm not away to sit and pass judgement on how any woman chooses to live her life.

Using another woman as an incubator and commissioning babies to order is everyone's business.

Yes, she may be infertile but having babies is not a human right.

@thelegohooverer

Those who say they would do it for love if a sister or friend was infertile, would you be okay in the reverse situation asking them to take the risk for you? Or okay with them refusing to do it for you?

People forget how dangerous pregnancy and birth can be. And surrogate pregnancies are more high risk than normal pregnancies for various reasons. There have been at least four deaths of surrogate mothers in America that I have heard of, but the agencies tend to hush it up when it happens and there are non disclosure agreements so there may well be more. And who is counting the deaths of the poor women of Ukraine and other poor countries that rich westerners go to to obtain a bargain basement baby (I have heard Colombia is a new go to cheap destination)?

And for every death don't forget there will be women who had an extremely dangerous birth and whose health may have been impacted forever.

Personally I would be outraged if one of my daughters put the other at risk in this way. It might be a loving thing to do to offer to carry a baby for your sister but a loving sister will decline the offer. My daughters understand this.

https://www.cbc-network.org/2021/06/surrogacy-can-be-an-orphan-maker/

I follow a few “feel good” Instagram accounts and have noticed recently (particularly during pride month where the parents were gay men) a lot of them featuring surrogacy stories and showing the moment when, as far as I see it, the newborn baby (or babies, as it quite often seems to be twins) is taken away from its mother and handed over to complete strangers.

Because as far as the baby is concerned, the woman who carried and gave birth to it is it’s mother, whether or not the person actually intending to be it’s mother (or father) is the surrogate’s infertile sibling or Amber Heard. That person is a stranger to the baby.

Why is the parents need to be parents more important than the potential psychological impact that this separation immediately after birth can have on the children?

It’s not ok to take puppies away from their mothers immediately after birth. Why is ok to do it to babies?

@Ericaequites

Egg donation is about building better babies. There are height, weight, health, educational, and psychological requirements. Still, there are no guarantees. What is it like to carry a child not related to you?it’s not something I would want to be involved with, but money can buy everything in some places. If artificial wombs can produce children, some women will opt for those. What would these baked children be like, when compared to a child grown under his mother’s heart?

What a disgusting post.

@osbertthesyrianhamster

I know someone whose donated eggs resulted in, that she knows of, 3 lives births. She has 3 herself. All of them have autism, 2 will never live independently. They had different dads and she believes her father had autism and her mother as well.

Another utterly abhorrent post. You should be ashamed of yourself.

@phoenixrosehere

I feel uncomfortable telling women what they can and can’t do with their bodies and that includes surrogacy. We can agree that women are not incubators but if a woman makes the informed choice to be one for someone else who am I to tell her she can’t or to tell someone they have to have a baby using their own body or they’re not a mother or should have a baby.

But we tell women - and men - that they can't sell organs. We tell them they can't ingest certain drugs. We tell them they can't go around naked in public.

Bodily autonomy is not absolute. There are always restrictions, which differ from one society to the next. But no society believes that anyone can just do what they like 'with their body'.

Not to mention that surrogacy doesn't just involves adults making 'choices'. It involves the creation of an innocent baby, with the express intention of taking it away from its mother at birth. And yes, as far as the baby is concerned, the woman who carried them for 9 months and gave birth to them is their mother. They know nothing of 'parental orders' or 'surrogacy journeys'.

Separating newborn animals from their mothers is considered unethical. But it's OK for human babies, so long as the wealth adults who 'commissioned' them gets what they want?

And how many of these celebs actually raise the baby themselves?

I'm uncomfortable with elements of it definitely.

I don’t know why they don’t buy the babies when they’re a bit older. A newborn is tricky if you’ve a career to manage.

I’m surprised more of them don’t wait til the kid is toilet trained, or even better, in school.

@osbertthesyrianhamster

I know someone whose donated eggs resulted in, that she knows of, 3 lives births. She has 3 herself. All of them have autism, 2 will never live independently. They had different dads and she believes her father had autism and her mother as well.

And your point is - what exactly?

@womanity

I don’t know why they don’t buy the babies when they’re a bit older. A newborn is tricky if you’ve a career to manage.

I’m surprised more of them don’t wait til the kid is toilet trained, or even better, in school.

If you're extremely wealthy, I'd imagine having a newborn has as much effect on your career and life as you want it to...

YANBU - surrogacy is not in the best interests of the children created to supply adults wants, as well as reducing poor women to commercially available disposable vessels.

Removing a newborn from his or her mother (and to the baby the woman in who's womb they grow, who's heartbeat and voice they hear in the womb is their mother) is only appropriate where an existing foetus is at risk from their mother - where babies are removed from their mothers it should only be to make the best of a bad situation, where they already exist but are only safe if removed. Adoption at birth isn't acceptable in the UK because its recognised that there are long and short term negative consequences for the child. It is sometimes the least bad option for a baby already in existence, but creating a baby for removal is a human rights violation.

And your point is - what exactly?

Well, it's pretty clears yours is to be rude AF.

It was in response to Ericaqueties's post about egg donation not being a guarantee. I just forgot to quote it. That okay with you?

It's a statement of fact. She's a friend of mine. She donated before she had children herself.

I have a child with quite severe autism myself.

Carry on jumping all over me and looking for stuff that's not there in a statement of fact.

Another utterly abhorrent post. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Um, no, why should I be? It's a statement of fact. She worries about those people now. She had no idea and feels she carries a heritable form of the condition.

If you want to go around looking for defensiveness in posts where it isn't there, go ahead.

One area I find interesting is the idea that genetic material passes between the mother & foetus. Some scientists think this DNA can be good or bad for the mothers health even years later eg increasing or decreasing cancer risks. Definitely potential ethical concerns there for a surrogate.

Egg donation also has serious health consequences for the donor, sometimes (ovarian hyper stimulation syndrome being the most obvious risk). Its all massively exploitative and misogynistic, as well as reducing babies to commodities.

I just csnt understand why people would assume that she did this due to vanity and not that she was infertile. I just can't imagine the pain of being in the room at scans of someone else who is carrying your child and not getting to experience it all. It must be so hard and I can't see why anyone would choose that option unless they really saw it as a last resort.

I loved being pregnant, maybe that is why I just can't see why someone would volunteer to outsource it.

Well Kim Kardashian likely did it for vanity. I have bad pregnancies so can totally see why it would be preferable.

Surrogacy is a form of modern day slavery, which is evidenced by the fact that it's not the rich women being the surrogates, but the women with little to no income. In many countries paying for surrogacy is illegal and yet it still happens. Surrogates at the most earn less than a year's worth of minimum income, despite having their bodies occupied for someone else's use for three quarters of a year, not including time to recover afterwards.
I think the practice is abhorrent. If you are incapable or unwilling to carry your own child, it does NOT give you the right to burden another women with the risks of complications and permanent alterations to her body.
Nobody is entitled to having a child.

I feel sorry for the babies always now. It's like they are a commodity. Adopting a newborn when the mother can't look after it is obviously a wonderful thing to do. But in surrogacy a baby is purposely created to be separated from its biological mother. That doesn't seem right.

Especially when I think of breast feeding, the third trimester and the wanting to be held.

I thought the picture of Amber Heard and baby was strange, it looked like she had given birth to it, but she looked perfectly made up, hair and make up perfect, then I read it was a surrogate, seemed odd, like she was conveying she had given birth in the image, but look at me I still look great! Well no wonder!