Is what I said really out of order?

[sparklingwater1]

Hi all looking for some advice if I’ve acted out of line here. Happy to be told I am and apologise to the parties involved or stand my ground if necessary. Will give all background I think is relevant and happy to give more if asked. Long one…

So me and exDH split up 6 years ago when I was pregnant with DS2. My mum and Dad have been a rock for me and have helped me out with the kids loads. I have 2 children aged 8 and 5. ExDH is a bit Disney dad, sees the kids once every 2 weeks and they have fun. My mum and dad take the kids overnight once a week. My mum also watches the children while I’m at work, I pay her for it, similar to that of a childminder so not a small amount.

I was in a long term relationship for the past 4 years and split up 5 months ago…very amicable split no issues at all. Since the split my mum has been round my house lots she gives the place a quick clean, puts a wash on and potters around the garden all while I’m at work. She says it’s to “earn her keep” as the children are in school 9-3 referring to the money I’m paying to her.

Lately though it’s getting a bit much, she’s rearranging my cupboards, I put a dress that I had lost buttons on in the bin and I found it washed and hung up (she seen it in a bag of rubbish and thought it was a mistake it was there 🤷🏻‍♀️)all while I’m at work. If I open a bottle of wine she’ll make comments like “oh have a drink last night did we?” etc.

Dad as well has been round in the shed, in the loft “checking things out” all while I’m at work.

I came down the other morning with the kids (summer holidays here) and she’s out the back painting the fence because “she had left over paint to use.” Absolutely fine by me but again I just wished she had asked because I don’t actually like the colour but she had started at 6:30am when we were all still in bed.

She popped in and I made her toast and tea and was tidying up putting paperwork away and yes the cupboard I keep all that in is the cupboard all the “stuff” goes in. She said “we will get a day and go through that” and then she’s telling me all the stuff she wants to do to my garden and dad is coming “to take my shed down” apparently…it’s old yes but it does a job and I can’t afford a new one. When I said it’s fine just to leave it, she said “no you don’t need to be here we’ll just suit ourselves” I told her I didn’t want her or my dad here when I wasn’t, they wouldn’t do it to my brothers house and I certainly wouldn’t do it to theirs so why should they have free reign at my place? Well that’s it…I’m stubborn, ungrateful and expect people to do things for me etc.

I’ve said that I don’t think there’s anything unreasonable in saying please don’t come round my house/ garden etc when I’m not here. Apparently I’m accusing them of spying on me. I don’t always say “thank you mum” every single day if she’s put a wash on for me but I take her out at least once a month for afternoon tea or for a lunch etc and I always make a point of saying it’s a thanks for what she does to help me. Bearing in mind she tells me she does this because of the money I pay her, I’ve never asked or expected her to do anything and I know she’s helping and do appreciate it.

So today has ended up in a massive row and I don’t know if I am being unreasonable in saying what I said or if I’m quite right and they’re being overbearing. I have apologised to her as she got upset and I never intended to upset her but I’ve said that I don’t think there’s anything wrong in what I said?!

Happy for different perspectives, all I can see is my own point of view. Thank you in advance.

And before anyone says...yes she puts everything through the proper channels and I don't pay her enough that she gets taxed etc but she does declare that she gets paid for childcare.

So, it sounds like the situation has changed most dramatically after your ex left, and you and the D.C. are adjusting to new ways.

It’s things like it being easier for everyone to have your mum come to you in the morning, that blurs the line. Your mum lives 5 mins from school. How can it be better for her to come to you for 7.45am? It’s probably easier for you and the dc - but this is the consequence of divorce, and having a Disney dad. The decision to marry, have children with and then divorce/separate from your ex are all parts of YOUR life. Not your mum’s. Your mum is facilitating your life when it should be your ex co-parenting equally. She will be well aware of this. She knows she is fulfilling a role that your ex should be filling, that your dad fulfilled. That you’ve let her do this is what’s giving her the idea that you need her, that she is helping you, that you want her to make your life easier.

So, she’s doing more to make your life easier. She’s being your mum. I’m sure you’d do the same for your D.C.

So when it comes to talking to her about this, it’s important not to be a grown-up-petulant-child, only talking about your need for space and boundaries. You need to recognise the space she’s filling in your life, and show true appreciation for her wanting to be all the things your ex would have been if you’d not separated/divorced. As a grandparent she always well want to be extra “there” for her grandkids post-divorce/separation.

It’s tricky, splitting up a family with young children almost always is. Everyone needs to find their feet.

Dear God, you're a saint, op. This would do my head in!

Maybe your mum is subconsciously preparing for the time when her child-minding services aren't required. Having been so closely involved in all your lives maybe she's spied a future looming chasm (in her mind) and extended her 'duties' so her usefulness continues. (I haven't worded this well.)

Take the keys off them and get a padlock for your gate to keep them out.

Why are they so invested in your property, its really wierd.

Actually the lady who cared for our DC from when they were babies, continued to take care of the house when the DC no longer needed her. Covid put an end of her working for us - but the DC are late 20's and she is now 80+! Try not to get yourself into that situation OP.

I think it’s fine to say you don’t like her sorting your cupboards and planning your garden. I’d feel a bit like the donkey doing all the grunt work while someone me one else got to be there for drop offs and pick ups and enjoy arranging my property.. Just tell her you like the childcare but not the housekeeping (if that’s the case). If she needs to do something else to justify her wage, think of something you would find helpful. If there isn’t anything either she will have to suck up you subbing them or you will need to pay her less.

From a financial point of view you need to pay for services you need not give away your family wealth to support your parents if they can manage without.

@ARoseDowntown

I completely take your point (well most of it).

My mum and I each stay a 5 min walk from the school but about 15 from each other...think right angled triangle...school is the right angle...me at one side, mum at the other and the longer side to walk to each other....the roads and pavements make that a weird set up. So really it is 6 and half a dozen where the boys go in the morning. I can't really think why the arrangement was to come here it just seemed to happen and yes it is easier for me as I'm not rushing out the door and forcing breakfast down their neck to get them to my mums for 7:30 when I can now get them ready more leisurely and the mornings are less of a rush but you're 100% right it is for my benefit and makes my mornings less stressful.

Again I completely agree that I would do the same to help them in any way I could but I can't imagine myself letting myself into their house when they're not their and doing things without their permission. It has been a drastic change and I need to work out if the change is in me or her. Maybe there's something I've missed with her that all of a sudden she's wanting to keep busy or maybe she's noticed things in me that I haven't that she feels the need to suddenly do more to "help".

Disney dad does the minimum he can do as does his parents they never see them and again that I suppose has influenced my decision to do a lot more with my parents and the DC as I don't want them to have a phantom relationship like what they do with their other grandparents if that makes sense.

You've raised a lot of good points though and I take on board what you say. Thanks for your opinion, I hope you can see at least part of mine and where I'm coming from.

You’ve invited them into your life too much. If you’re almost paying childminder rates, get a childminder and keep them out of your house.

She sounds lovely, I wish she was my mum. Lucky you to have people who care about you so much.

Rearranging the cupboards would be the red line for me. No way.......

@dyslek

She sounds lovely, I wish she was my mum. Lucky you to have people who care about you so much.

She only sounds lovely because you don't have to deal with her.

BTW, she doesn't do it because she cares for the OP. It's about control. They're doing what they want, not what the OP wants.

Its not out of order to say that and having help comes with a higher price than mere money.
You need re do the rules. Spell out what the childcare payment covers and what it doesn't cover. (unannounced visits at 6.30 am for eg)
If you can do this gently but firmly, it might work.

Take the keys off them and get a padlock for your gate to keep them out.

This kind of comment blows my mind. Take their keys and padlock them out? Honestly, whatever happened to kindness and honest conversations between people who love one another.

OP, your parents sound absolutely brilliant, but it's clearl they've overstepped a boundary. It sounds like what's happened is the boundary has got blurred along the lines, probably little bit by little bit, and I'm sure they're upset to think that their care has been taken as intrusive, same as you're upset to feel judged by them.

To me it sounds like a loving, gentle conversation all round is needed, to establish boundaries. I know that's not the MN way and you should probably go NC with the 'abusive/controlling' bastards though!

Good luck. You all sound like great people who have just got into a tangle.

No you're not being unreasonable to want some privacy and boundaries in your own home. I'm sure your parents are just trying to be helpful but yeah, it's a bit too much

My first reaction was, would your mom come by my house and tidy up? My second was, this reminds me of my husband's unilateral domestic "tidying." Since your mother is your mother, and she works for you, and needs to feel appreciated, I would be sensitive in restoring your boundaries. There's a good book out now, called, Set Boundaries, Find Peace, by Nedra Tawab. There's a reason it sold a million copies right out of the gate.

My late mum did my before & after school care & like yours did the odd bit of ironing, would put the DC’s swimming/gym things in the wash etc. She had keys obviously but would only ever use them if we weren’t here as she instinctively knew the boundaries. I think you just need to recalibrate boundaries with your DP.

Your situation reminds me of mine a bit & we all mutually benefited from the relationship. Don’t go in all guns blazing, your suggestion of a gentle chat when the children aren’t around is good. A mutually beneficial arrangement such as yours doesn’t need to be blown asunder as some people are advocating. They need to know you value and appreciate them but they need to understand that you are entitled to privacy. You might not like your shed dismantled or the fence painted lime green just because they do.

I fully agree with you continuing the occasional treats/trips out it really demonstrates you appreciate them and don’t just want your mum for childcare. I’m sure a gentle and kind conversation will fix this. 💐

I agree with the rest of the suggestions but the thing that would tick me off the most is looking out in to the garden and seeing a fence that was painted a colour I didn't want. I'd have to change that.
Best of luck with the rest of it though.

I could have written this post myself! My parents are exactly the same, they look after my children 2 afternoons a week and they seem to think it their right/duty to rearrange items, move things etc and what's worse is that I'm married. It drives my husband batshit crazy.

But if you say anything then you are ungrateful, selfish, lazy etc etc. It's such a fine line to tread when you have parents like this.

My advice is stick to your guns, now that you've had the argument, reinforce what you do and what you don't want.

Good luck xx

I was quite often in my parents house while they weren’t there. It was always presented as a house for all of us. I would definitely have done the washing up etc, that kind of thing. I hope my dds always feel that my home is their home too.
I don’t have my parents any more but if i did I wouldn’t mind most of this, as it seems so caring, although I would have minded about the fence colour !
I think your Mum perhaps feels a bit guilty about getting paid by you and so is making sure she does as much as possible to help you.

Have you got my in / laws parents?

Lockdown has been a godsend as have been able to reinforce some boundaries. I'm a 45 yo woman, married, I don't need my elderly in laws changing my ducking beds.

We sucked it up before because of childcare, even though they were paid, it was good for the kids and them but it was seriously overbearing and undermining.

YANBU. I would hate that.

I would be having a screaming fucking fit if someone was forcing themselves into my life this much. Change the locks! Nuts!

Does your mum depend on the money you pay her? Maybe she is worried that you will decide you no longer need her on call all the time and will find after school care instead. Could she be finding other ways to help, and roping your dad in, so that you keep her “on the payroll” obviously even this is the case boundaries have been severely crossed.

I couldn't bear this.
You're an adult, and you deserve your privacy, and to make your own decisions about what colour your fence is painted, and when.

You simply have to tell her that though you love her and are hugely grateful to have such a loving and helpful family, you need to make your own choices. Would she really appreciate you going through her own dirty knickers and organising her wardrobe? Would she really be happy to come home to find you randomly painting her fence?

Tell them that you love that they help, but you need to be consulted first. Your bedroom is off-limits and they only go to your house when you're in, you're awake, or it's otherwise planned.