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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To ask if you’ve noticed this? Race-related.

227 replies

OffRampHilton · 23/06/2021 23:03

I grew up (not UK) in an area that was entirely populated by white people but that’s changed since I was a child (I’m 40) and I’ve moved away to live in a big city so my friends and colleagues now are very racially diverse. I know couples of all races/ethnicity from same-race/ethnicity to every mix you can think of.

Over the past couple of years, I’ve been really happy to see more diversity on tv, especially in terms of race. I grew up seeing nothing but white people on tv shows, unless it was a programme specifically about black or Asian families. I remember the fact that Coronation St was introducing their first non-white family was covered in the newspaper. The default was white people unless non-white people had a specific “reason” to be there- and that reason was pretty much always race-related.

I’m noticing lots more diversity, especially on ads. However, I still don’t see a lot of black or Asian families. I see mixed families where one parent (normally the mother, for some reason), is white, then a black parent (usually a dad) and two mixed children (normally a boy and a girl!). Great, it certainly represents a lot of families, but there seems to be a lack of depiction of families that are entirely black or entirely Asian or entirely anything other than white.

From paying attention to a few ad breaks tonight, I saw the following, in order of most common-

White families.
Mixed-race families.

I didn’t see many wholly non-white families.

Has anyone else noticed this?

Also, if I’ve used any clumsy wording in this, please don’t jump on me, but educate me instead.

OP posts:
nevernotstruggling · 24/06/2021 23:26

There's loads of examples of this. Isn't Kpop a massive industry and bts etc sell millions of records but there's only a cursory nod to them now and then on the radio.

motogogo · 24/06/2021 23:28

Adverts and tv isn't always representative eg why (unless it's for a stairlift or over 50's life cover) is everyone young? Actually in the U.K. the population is 86% white (figure to be updated with the census) so you could argue most media is not representative of the proportions ... however as it varies around the country (very few non white in my town, 50% were I lived before!) it's trickier still.

Personally when I watch ads I couldn't care less their ethnicity, it's the product

Quaggars · 24/06/2021 23:36

I mean look at what happened when Sainsbury's ran a Xmas advert last year featuring an all-black family, they got a torrent of racist abuse online
Sadly there are a lot of racist people out there and I think actually it's getting worse all the time.

Completely agree with this.
The social media comments and reaction online was absolutely vile.
Come to think of it, there really aren't any programmes out there with whole black families (if there is I'm not aware of any mainstream ones) and there really should be.

Quaggars · 24/06/2021 23:42

@dreamingbohemian
But I certainly don't want to be lectured every time I see an ad, I would rather be told about the quality and features of the product, that's it

Not exactly sure how seeing a black family instead of a white family in an advert is lecturing you?
Confused

PicsInRed · 24/06/2021 23:44

@Notaschoolday

How do you feel about the Tesco lady?

What the fuck you on about? Do you mean from an advert? I have no feelings about someone from Tesco.

Are you in the UK?
Notaschoolday · 24/06/2021 23:53

I’m in England yes. I don’t know what you’re getting at? I mentioned the over representation of one ethnic minority as many other posters have.

StillWaters77 · 24/06/2021 23:54

@Backhills

I knew that would come PottedPalm and of course some (many) black families have achieved professional careers and a middle class life, but knowing what we know about the disadvantages black people have, this is not the reality for the majority and even where it is, culturally their lifestyles are often quite different.
Hmm....in what way?
ResIpsaLoquiturInterAlia · 25/06/2021 00:25

Possibly because of political over correctness as to not offend (even if unintentional) hyper sensitivity of some? Hence demographics that literally tick every possible inclusiveness box for the sake of non reflective real life environments where most tend to mix amongst their own tribe whether in appearance or lifestyle choices and not discriminatory by default.

stayathomer · 25/06/2021 00:35

Am white and I find myself getting more and more pissed off at the fact that there's still such a disconnect now on tv, not on ads, but look at big budget action films- where are all the black leads? Look at marvel, dc? Then you look at all the big shows of years past- friends, satc, buffy, new girl, big bang theory, how I met your mother ... it just drives me nuts. Also (white) people feel the need to mention Idris Elba on just about every show as someone they like, it just comes off pathetic to me.

Graphista · 25/06/2021 00:50

I'm white but my circle are a mix of various races and religions and cultures largely I think because we moved around a lot (dad was army) so we lived in many different areas of the Uk and also because the army used to be (not sure if it still is as a lot has changed culturally both within and outside the army) seen by some immigrants as a good career plus tied housing came with so if they were looking at a long time on a civilian housing list or otherwise struggling to find a home (at least partly due to racism) it was a relatively quick way to get a home for their families so quite a few of the families we met through being army ourselves were not white and/or were from other countries initially, also of course a fair number of army personnel meet people when serving overseas and marry them and they (usually women) would then come to the Uk as a result of that.

I was raised in the 70's/80's when there was a lot of really offensive overt racism occurring, not saying it doesn't now but it's gradually very gradually becoming less common/overt.

I remember friends of mine being really happy to see people of their race/nationality on tv in any guise!

I also remember it being a "big deal" when a non white character/family was cast in a soap or other popular drama.

One friend of mine was chuffed to bits when carol and Alan were on Eastenders as it was the first time she had seen parents of the same race/heritage as hers on screen.

Where her parents were a little critical of the storyline was that they didn't think it realistic that none of the couples black friends/family were ever critical of him being in an interracial relationship, as that had not been their experience at all.

She was constantly having her heritage/her fathers paternity questioned because she had naturally blonde hair.

There are still a lot of racists out there though sadly, brexit rather brought a lot out I ended up unfriending people on facebook, people I'd known for years and never seen a hint before one of whom was in the same friendship group as me and my mixed race friend for 4 years at school!

Shocking the way the racists have come out in response to the ads mentioned and also the diversity BLM routine

because Adam and Eve were white.

This always cracks me up. As if! If they did exist as all people in the bible they would of course have been Arab, North African or however that race would have been described at the time and would definitely have been dark skinned with dark curly hair. To be perfectly honest if Jesus didn't look like everyone else in that locale at that time it would have been a damn sight easier for Herod to find him wouldn't it?

It is good to see more and more black people in ads and as actors, presenters etc, much more unlikely to see Asian people represented.

I have another friend who works in TV in a behind the scenes job though and he says it's still very very white in that side of things especially at the higher levels - directors, producers etc

I've not watched soaps for years now as they bore me I'd seen the same storylines so many times (I know they appeal to many just not to me)

But it's not just soaps it's all programming, very rare that a drama or sitcom will have a non white character or characters as the lead/s - why? There's no good reason for this

And on the odd occasion there are, somehow their race has to be part of the storyline.

I can think of many excellent shows where other actors of other races would have worked just as well.

Casting directors and programme makers really need to step up here.

@WTFisNext who creates the imagery though? If it's companies in business to do so as a customer your company can surely say to them they need to include more diverse imagery? Vote with your rather large corporate wallet?

A few mentioning that certain demographics are culturally discouraged from entering the performing arts - that has to at least partly be due to how they're used to their race/nationality being depicted (eg all Arabs are terrorists nonsense) and so it's down to writers and makers to create parts and roles for non white performers that aren't stereotypes (and I include so called "positive" stereotypes in this).

There are some actors and performers that refuse to take parts where it's a stereotyped role denigrating their race/nationality which is admirable but we also need for such parts to not be the norm

Even better, wait until they find out he was an Aramaic-speaking Palestinian Jew. I would love to be a fly on the wall for that.

I actually remember my dad saying something very similar to a dinner guest who turned out to be a right twat! This was around the time Madonna's like a prayer came out and he was outraged at even the suggestion that Jesus wasn't white European! Let alone might have been black! My dad somehow managed to not completely lose it until the guy left (he was never invited again) and then went into full on rant! It was quite something.

@mustlovegin I'm hoping that's sarcasm!

@AnyaDoesntLikeBunnies so true re gay couples representation

@Baggingarea name and shame I say!

Extremely rare to see disabled people represented, rarer still to have characters with a mental illness that isn't the main focus for almost all their storylines! Even rarer to see disabled or mentally ill people represented as functioning and contributing members of society.

I'd also like to see greater variation in body size and shape, ludicrous that it's still the case to be a successful actress or model you generally usually need to be very slim. I'm not talking fat positive necessarily I'm talking normal healthy bmi bodies

TheBullfinch · 25/06/2021 08:30

I've noticed this too - there's a whole load of Reddit threads dedicated to it too.

I can see why it's happening but agree that there's a lack of representation of Asian people on TV for some reason. Women's clothing websites are full of Chinese women though.

It must be difficult to include everyone.

I know people who wont buy from a brand if it has ethnic representation in its adverts though (I work with them so cant just stop interacting with them sadly).

TheBullfinch · 25/06/2021 08:34

@Graphista yes I agree, it'd be great to see more average weight people represented in the media. You wouldnt know that the majority of people are overweight, judging by TV.

Smallkeys · 25/06/2021 08:40

@Dogmum40 that’s pretty much it advertisers are cramming in as many diverse people as they can which is why I think they do the one white family member and other ethnicity for the other. It’s extremely difficult image banks are very American I recently tried to get photos for a client and it was difficult in a limited space as they wanted to include everyone it’s impossible. Also finding more Uk looking images was also tricky. Not to mention they also wanted male and female , young and old basically everybody ...

OldTinHat · 25/06/2021 08:45

I would be interested to know how many white families are portrayed in advertising/soaps in asian and black countries.

ShagMeRiggins · 25/06/2021 08:45

@Overdueanamechange

Very early in the thread you described the adverts that were being shown in real time as you watched telly. One of them was:

A chocolate advert voiced over by a black lady.

How did you know the voiceover artist was a black lady?

ancientgran · 25/06/2021 08:46

Anyone old enough to remember an episode of Star Trek causing a bit of a sensation as Kirk and Uhura kiss. No problem with him kissing aliens from who knows what planet but kissing a black woman was decidedly risky.

Moonmelodies · 25/06/2021 09:10

If people are going to suspend logic and believe the Adam & Eve story, they may as well believe they were white too.

BlackeyedSusan · 25/06/2021 09:13

The Christmas ad debacle springs to mind. Maybe that is why? pandering to the racists

ForgedInFire · 25/06/2021 09:16

I haven't read the full thread so sorry if this has been mentioned. I've noticed on TV, particularly on adverts, they rarely feature dark skin black women. It's usually a mixed race woman or very light skin woman and she always has the same hairstyle- wearing her hair down and curly and usually lighter hair as well. I'm not black myself but I've been seeing a lot of conversations about colourism and it has really made me think. I don't really see the same thing happening with men.

LateAtTate · 25/06/2021 10:18

Advertising in the end is image, not talent based. For every ad there are loads of suitable people so whom they choose is very much a question of image.

The only way to make a completely fair, colour blind choice is to pick their names out of a hat.

Dogmum40 · 25/06/2021 11:35

[quote Smallkeys]@Dogmum40 that’s pretty much it advertisers are cramming in as many diverse people as they can which is why I think they do the one white family member and other ethnicity for the other. It’s extremely difficult image banks are very American I recently tried to get photos for a client and it was difficult in a limited space as they wanted to include everyone it’s impossible. Also finding more Uk looking images was also tricky. Not to mention they also wanted male and female , young and old basically everybody ...[/quote]
Yeah I can see it being a massive headache for you and feel sorry that so many people aren’t happy with how you do your job.

We have so many race variations in the UK I wouldn’t want your job at all, you will always upset someone and now well as race you now have the gender issue and so many variations besides just men and women! It must be an absolute nightmare for you and as I said I really don’t envy your job, just reading this thread there are so many people that are unhappy, I can’t imagine how many complaints you get from the whole of the UK!

Myself and my family don’t really care who are in adverts as we buy the product and not the actor but it’s probably because Hong Kong asians are never in them so we’ve never really thought about the wider implications, we just go and buy what we think we need when we see the adverts 🤣

LateAtTate · 25/06/2021 12:24

@Dogmum40 I don’t really care who’s in ads either but it’s more about opportunity for diverse actors... because apparently if ‘nobody cares’ the default is white.
On another note I love the casting of Umbrella Academg I didn’t even realise one of the actresses was Indian until mentioned 😂 in fact the diverse background of characters wasn’t really obvious cuz they were just well actors to me

mustlovegin · 25/06/2021 12:27

It’s extremely difficult image banks are very American I recently tried to get photos for a client and it was difficult in a limited space as they wanted to include everyone it’s impossible. Also finding more Uk looking images was also tricky

These are multi-billion pound companies with massive advertising expense. They are not a corner shop. Are we suggesting they are relying on image banks and can't spend a few bucks to have a bloke with a camera take pictures in the UK (or any relevant market they want to target) to make sure everyone is proportionately represented? It's bonkers and highly implausible

PicsInRed · 25/06/2021 12:31

@Notaschoolday

I’m in England yes. I don’t know what you’re getting at? I mentioned the over representation of one ethnic minority as many other posters have.
Everyone in England, indeed the entire UK knows about the Tesco lady, it was a high profile ad campaign marred by racist rantings.
TruelyonelastSchlep · 25/06/2021 12:32

@AlfonsoTheMango

Wait till that person finds out Jesus was Middle Eastern!

Even better, wait until they find out he was an Aramaic-speaking Palestinian Jew. I would love to be a fly on the wall for that.

You have your historical timelines a bit mixed up.

Palestinian only came into common use as a name for the area 100 years after his death following the Bar Kokhba Revolt against the Roman Empire.

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