How do farmers reconcile themselves to the volumes of animals they send to slaughter over the course of their lifetimes?

[Empanadas]

Hi, this is something I’ve always wondered. However, I was watching that Netflix series about Prince Charles and the Duchy of Cornwall and there was a farmer showing a whole barn of cattle he has obviously reared from birth, but quite blithely saying, “oh they'll all be off next week.”

AIBU to think being a cattle / sheep / chicken farmer takes a certain type of person and to wonder how they deal with their conscience in this depressing business?

My grandad had a smallholding... raised a few meat animals on it, and slaughtered the chickens himself. He raised them as chicks, treated them if poorly, then snapped their necks a few months later. He also had a few chickens that were pets and had names.
I think people who look after meat animals compartmentalise.

@Scrowy

Are the slaughterhouse vets supervising the slaughters 24/7?

It's the workers doing the actual slaughter of the animals who commit the abuse. Its predictable that they become desensitised to what they are doing and the fact these are living sentient beings they are killing. When you're operating a constabt conveyerbelt of death I can imagine its easy to get irritated with the creatures in the process who can get skittish etc.

Not to mention you have to have an extreme lack of empathy in the first place to have a job like that.

Anyone who reckons those slaughterhouses aren't manned by majority people like that is in serious denial.

And to answer pp questions......yes better that the farm animals don't exist than continue to be bred for this modern day industry. Driving down of the price of meat has seriously fucked it all up and its a disgrace.

[quote Femme99]@AnyOldPrion - It is mostly meat eaters and that’s my experience, they are goady towards vegetarians and vegans, post pictures of bacon, saying they couldn’t care less about the animal dying, telling vegans to go and eat some lettuce, or hug a tree etc.
The reality is, their guilty conscience kicks in and they fight that by becoming hostile and turning it around on the opposite team.[/quote]
And who started the argument? Were they hoiking up their judgypants like the OP here?

I’ve not seen a thread started by a meat eater criticising vegetarians or vegans, though I accept they might exist.

I’ll say it again, when people are faced with criticism from people who obviously feel morally superior, of course they fight back.

How would you feel if faced with a thread started by an extremist Christian, who went from saying they didn’t understand how anyone could be happy without God in their lives to telling you you’re a raging sinner who’s going to burn in hell for not sharing their belief? Do you meekly say they’re probably right and join them? Or do you roll your eyes and possibly tell them they’re an idiot?

I don't know any farmers who find it depressing. Most of them take pride in what they produce; animal husbandry is very skilled work. (the proof of this is the popularity of livestock shows).
I don't think artists or writers or bakers or builders feel sad when they sell the work that's taken so much effort and attention. There's a real sense of achievement in doing highly skilled work that fetches a good price and is appreciated and enjoyed by the customer.

I commend the farmers on here who care and look after their animals, but living in rural Wales sandwiched between 2 farms, i can tell you my neighbours are complete and utter bastards to not only their livestock, but the wildlife around here.
What i have witnessed with my own eyes would make your hair curl, so yes there are decent respectful farmers, but believe me not all are.
It is because of what i've seen that i no longer eat meat, it makes me sick to the stomach.

@Temp023

Does anyone know a pleasant, friendly vegan? Don’t think I’ve ever met one worth giving the time of day to.

Yes. I know two, one of whom is my sister, the other a good friend. Both respect my choice to eat meat.

*Do we say all care homes are bad because if the abuses that have been filmed in those?

Do we say all hospitals are cruel because of well publicised events where patients have been harmed?*

LOL at the gall to compare abuse in care homes and hospitals which you know, are there to care for people, to slaughterhouses which are there to kill. Like the people that work in slaughterhouses have the same empathy for the animals they're killing on a mass production line as a nurse does for her patient.
Hahahahhahaha.

This lab grown meat:

1. In the hands of food multinationals: do we really want a small handful of enormous corporations controlling our diet?
2. Will use up lots of land, covering it in buildings with zero space for wildlife.
3. With unknown consequences for human health - this is being plugged by food multinationals, well known for producing packaged stuff that is just ace for our well-being...oh, wait...

Something like 60-70% of the world's farmland is only suitable for livestock: it's too dry, steep, rocky, wet, cold etc for crops. Do we just stop using it to upcycle stuff we can't eat into nutrient-dense foods while the human population is still expanding?

But I think some people on here have valid points. The journey the human race took to get to where it is doesn't have to be the future journey. And it has nothing to with luxury beliefs. If people with 'luxury beliefs' were scoffed at the human race would never have progressed.

I totally agree with what you are saying here, and agree that to move forward we are going to have to change the way we eat, including reducing the amount of meat that we eat.

But the 'luxury belief' I was referring to is the idea that it is inherently wrong for humans to eat animals or ever use them for their own gain, and that that is 'exploitation'. This belief can only be held by people who are lucky enough to have easy access to such a wide range of food that they can cut out animal products entirely and still get a balance diet. And then talk about how animals are equal to humans and should be treated as such.

That's it though isn't it @AnyOldPrion, respect.

Acknowledging that either choice is equally valid. Not banging on about how you should be educated into their way of thinking.

I know one vegan who is lovely. She doesn't give a shit what other people eat. I'd say that was relatively uncommon for vegans as they seem to be unable to lay off the evangelising.

I know far more vegetarians and they're on the whole not preachy at all.

@Jellykat seriously report them!!! No ifs or buts!!!

Surely that land can be used to grow crops and feed even more humans.
@Lemming20 Do pop up here to Wales and tell the hill farmers how they can get a viable crop out of mountainside.

Whenever I hear phrases like "why can't they just...", I know that the remainder of the sentence will be ill-informed drivel.

@Norked

Anyone who reckons those slaughterhouses aren't manned by majority people like that is in serious denial.

How many slaughterhouses have you been in, and how many of the staff have you talked to? I’m guessing none.

Many of the people working in slaughterhouses are foreign nationals because you don’t necessarily have to have a great grasp of the local language to get by as the job is mostly physical.

Those who carry out the slaughtering are relatively well paid as it’s both skilled and not particularly popular. It’s not a job for the squeamish, but I suspect most people don’t choose it directly, but start out on the line processing the meat and progress to a better paid job.

Of course you can’t wander round being permanently distressed, but the idea everyone in the place is some kind of psycho is very unfair. I have another friend who was a drug addict and prostitute, but turned her life round when she got pregnant. There weren’t many jobs open to her, but she got one in the slaughterhouse because sometimes there are people who can’t afford to be fussy about what job they do.

Really, there are people on this thread who seem to have very inhumane ideas. There are unpleasant people in every industry. I suspect there are at least as many sick people attracted to nursing, care homes or social work so they can gain access to victims as there are in abattoirs, and these generalisations from people who have swallowed the animal rights activists propaganda is very tedious.

The traditional livestock industry is bad for the environment, consumes too much water, takes up too much land
@MozambiqueHere The traditional livestock industry has managed to sustainably coexist with nature for thousands of years. It's the modern intensive methods which cause issues.

Here in Wales we are not short of water, nor of land not suitable for other purposes. Traditionally grazing ruminants actually helps the environment. Keeping pasture in the rotation improves the soil, and sequesters carbon. Purely arable farms are reliant on bringing in vast amounts of fertiliser (rarely organic).

My dad was a dairy farmer- my best memory of him is of him talking to his “girls”. I always am fond of cows and will talk away to them, be respectful when you cross that field with them in.I eat a lot of responsibly sourced meat and lots of vegetables. I would never go vegan as my dad would turn in his grave. There have been some unkind comments about farmers- you have no idea. They are normally very stoical people who just get on with it, but they do. But the majority of them care about their animals.

If these animals weren't raised for food, they wouldn't exist...

Do people really think there would be a lovely countryside full of cows and sheep to look at if people didn't want to eat them or use their products be it dairy, wool or leather?

Who'd pay for their food, ensure they're healthy, deal with their bodies when they die??

Good animal welfare is the key, eat less meat or better quality maybe, there's certainly no moral case for factory farming.

@Empanadas

I mean there was a time when people would have been up in arms about the prospect of banning fur farms in the U.K. But that happened. Those who would have been fur farmers had to do something else and a good thing too.

Is it that much of a stretch to think that cattle farming, if not wound down completely, could be significantly reduced in the future?

I also don’t understand why cat food is produced in chicken, beef or lamb varieties. No doubt this is because it’s cheap due to overproduction? What cat eats a cow in the wild fgs?

Filleting mice is just too hard on the eyes…

@Empanadas

Do people genuinely not think the world would be a better place without beef farming? Even if we could eradicate that it would be a start.

Nope.

Sure, I'd love to see intensive methods ended in favour of traditional, sustainable farming. That goes for arable crops too. But the world would not suddenly be fixed by taking beef off of the menu.

Do you know how cows produce milk @Empanadas ? If you want milk, you have to have babies.

@Clymene

Christ vegans are fucking tedious

Christ (some) meat eaters are fucking lacking in compassion

Giving us all nutritious food is someone how bad?

In my opinion it’s the meat eaters who insult vegetarians and vegans. Most of them become hostile when their dietary choices are questioned

Ermm...then mind your own business and stop questioning. Problem solved

[quote kikisparks]@derxa are you saying I should start farming those plants? I’ll have to decline as I have a full time job and zero experience or skills to do so but thankfully others do, the vegan society has a grow green project and some farmers are looking at trialling different plant crops and seeing whether they can feasibly and sustainably be scaled.[/quote]
I too have a full time job and bugger all experience and skills. Even so; I grew peas, leeks and sprouts in my back garden last year. This year my pea plants were decimated by slugs and snails (dealing with them demonstrates how even arable agriculture involves death); however my leeks are doing well and I'll have my first crops of soft fruits this year.

Even if you live in a flat, you can use window boxes for some crops while strawberry plants will grow in hanging baskets.