Aibu? crazy? loopy? or not?

[Imcrazyapparently]

It's a husband one.

Dh has form for being overly (in my opinion) secretive and defensive over his phone. He had a biometrically protected browser app that was designed to look like something else on his phone that I found out about in Oct 2019. He downloaded it on new years day 2019 so took me ten months to notice anything weird and even then only found it because I was looking to redownload an app our 3yo had deleted on the ipad and it was in the list on the ipad app store of apps on devices. He says he wasn't doing anything wrong. I think it's a weird thing to do if you aren't. I don't look through his phone.

Today, we were sat on the sofa watching England. My 3yo asked for my phone to watch bing while I was looking for a replacement parasol, I gave it to her. I then turned to my dh and said can I borrow yours please. It had been face down on the cushion in front of him, he hadn't touched it for a minute and was watching the match. He said no. I asked why. He said because I'm using it. He picked it up and starts aimlessly scrolling through, while still watching the TV. Literally eyes on TV, thumb scrolling. I said you aren't using it if you're watching the match. I said I'm just here, you can see what I'm doing on it. But still refused.

He then storms off upstairs and says ill watch the match up there. So I was really annoyed at this point and turned the power off upstairs at the fuse box. He comes back down and says that I'm crazy. That's really loopy and bizarre behaviour and I'm acting mental (I was annoyed but still calm). I said you were using your phone so you don't need the TV. He said again that I'm crazy.
Childish yes but I don't think it's bizarre behaviour.

I asked him why he was being so defensive and he is basically implying that this is all my head,he isn't acting suspiciously and its all on me. He said the laptop is on the stairs use that.

It's completely turned from a simple request to borrow something and use it right next to him into a massive argument.

What do you think? Would you find his behaviour suspicious? I'll add if he asked for my phone I'd hand it over no questions asked and wouldn't feel uncomfortable about it.

FWIW, I don't think you are crazy, OP.

It's use could be innocent and he has decided to prioritise his privacy by instantly deleting the app/browser over reassuring you.

I'd expect he'l also think you are crazy if you ask loudly 'is that app he deleted the one paedophiles use or is it the one that people who pay sex workers use?' when his family or friends are in earshot.

He should be proud and own his ICT browser selection and be happy to explain why his first reaction was to delete it which is usually the reaction of an entirely innocent man being hounded by a crazy wife and who doesn't want Google to track his surfing and has never heard of DuckDuckGo.

Good luck.

@Imcrazyapparently

Porn doesn't bother me, he knows that so don't think he'd go through all that trouble. I don't know what to think. The obvious explanation is some kind of affair or sex chat etc. But, as naive as this sounds, I just don't think it is.

Do images of child sexual abuse? Because with a biometrically protected browser, absolute phone secrecy and gaslighting, I'd be concerned that he's hiding something illegal.

@blankspace101 what a nasty, bizarre comment.

I'd be very suspicious too op. Me and DH often use each others phones if we need to. We have locked screens but know each others pasawords.

Has he cheated before?

@Veterinari I've considered every possible explanation inc this one. He wasn't abused as a child and has no other risk factors. If I even for a millisecond suspected this I'd be gone and on the phone to the police.

Thanks @Blankspace101. Really helpful

What was the biometrically protected browser app for? I'd Google that. His answer is unconvincing.

Something is going on. He's not even bright enough to think up a good reason why you can't use his phone, but gas lights you (you're crazy) and strops off upstairs (to stop you asking any more) then pretends everything's ok (to shut you up, stop you asking more).

'Because' is not a good enough reason.

I'd sit down and talk to him - tell him how suspicious his behaviour is, ask what he's hiding. And be prepared for it to be something you won't like.

Can you live with him, not trusting him?

Just for a slightly different take; I would absolutely hate anyone going on my phone. No-one gets to borrow it. I share everything else. Jewellery, clothes etc with my daughters. I’ve nothing to hide. But I read some silly stuff sometimes, do quizzes, play odd games, send weird messages to my best friend that no-one else would understand. And would feel really exposed if any of my family used my phone. I’ve never put a browser app on it though. So I see that marks your DH’s situation as different.

Given you say you are pretty sure it’s not an affair and you have debt, could it be gambling he’s into?

In any event me not lending my phone is a joke in our family. The important difference is no-one is upset by it. You are upset. And your DH should acknowledge that and have a proper conversation.

Yeah sounds very shifty to me.

What's the biometric private app thingy?

Does he gamble? My OH has (or had) a gambling problem which makes him glued to the phone.

Especially when football is on!

He has stopped now but I will know if he's back on it because he would be keeping that phone very close by. Picking it up every minute and making sure I can't see the screen

[quote Imcrazyapparently]@Veterinari I've considered every possible explanation inc this one. He wasn't abused as a child and has no other risk factors. If I even for a millisecond suspected this I'd be gone and on the phone to the police.

Thanks @Blankspace101. Really helpful[/quote]
you're extremely naive if you think there need to be 'risk' factors for accessing illegal images. Listen to the podcast 'hunting warhead' paedophiles hide in plain sight and do not necessarily fit a 'checklist' of risk factors.

Why do you think he needs a biometrically protected browser, absolute phone privacy and to gaslight you, his partner if he's not up to something shifty and possibly illegal.

You need a frank conversation where he hands over his phone and gives you transparent access or to leave the relationship.

As it is I suspect you'll bury your head in the sand

[quote Imcrazyapparently]@Veterinari I've considered every possible explanation inc this one. He wasn't abused as a child and has no other risk factors. If I even for a millisecond suspected this I'd be gone and on the phone to the police.

Thanks @Blankspace101. Really helpful[/quote]
If only all sex abusers were so easy to profile wtf? Not implying that he is but your reasons for dismissing it are questionable.

I disagree with Plan which isn’t surprising as I normally do.

Yes, my phone is private, in that I’d be upset if DH used it to snoop through my MN posts or my emails or my texts or whatever.

On the other hand, I trust him not to do that if he asks to borrow it for whatever reason. He’ll use it and hand it back.

I think he’s acting shifty as fuck and I’d be very unhappy about it. But it would be a huge change in attitude for my husband so not the only thing giving me red flags.

Weird he wouldn't even let you use it sat next him IMO He's worried of a message or notification of something he doesn't want you to see coming through.
Partners being secretive with their devices can absolutely be a problem if you suspect there is a reason behind it, and he's definitely acting odd. My and my DH have nothing to hide from each other if he wanted to use my phone while one of our kids was using ours it'd be fine with me no questions asked & vice versa.

@Imcrazyapparently

Need support indecent images www.mumsnet.com/Talk/_chat/3616058-Need-support-indecent-images

Just an example of how commonplace such issues are.
I'm not saying that's what it is - it could be gambling, or a particular sexual link or something else entirely

But whatever it is he's hiding it and emotionally abusing you in order to do so

That's not good

I've tried to find the app but can't seem to as I don't have an iPhone. What was worse was the app wasn't like duck duck go where its clearly an app that is installed on the phone and has a recognisable logo. The one he had was greyed out with three dots underneath so if anyone had seen it on his phone it would just look like an app that had been partially downloaded and stopped. Totally innocuous. It was only seeing it on a downloaded list on the ipad that made me think it was intentionally deceptive looking.

Good suggestion but not gambling. Everything else is fully shared, money, kids, home so I'd notice gambling. He has a football team he's part of but he's so active taking photos on social media when he's there I don't doubt he is where he says he is. Apart from that he goes to work and comes home. I really hope he just feels like you do @LadyMacbethWasMisunderstood but hasn't articulated it.

Good suggestion but not gambling. Everything else is fully shared, money, kids, home so I'd notice gambling.

OP I really don't want to be blunt here but your niaveity is quite alarming.

It absolutely could be both accessing indecent images or gambling even if you think for definite it isn't.

I know someone whose partner racked up 40 thousand pounds worth of debt depute having joint accounts.

I think the people who are being either dismissive or hateful to the OP, have never been in this situation. My experience was before mobile phones and laptops, but you just know that the behaviour is 'off' in some way, I was very happy in my marriage, but suddenly, i realised that something was wrong, and my husband was not focussing on our familiy's welfare. Turning off the wifi might seem bizzare, but a sort of panic sets in, and you need to make the other person notice, and listen to you.

I'm not trying to minimise or imply that child sex offenders are easy to spot. I said I had already considered this and like I said he doesn't give any indication that he would do that.

My reasons, apart from what I mentioned above are that he is useless with our kids, doesn't seek out anytime alone with them, doesn't do nappies very often, never does a bath, he could easily manage a kids football team but chose to work with adults, his general reaction to anything like this on the news is disgust.

Definitely up to something. Whether, porn child porn, sex chat, online dating and/or an affair is anybody's guess. But making you out to be crazy is emotionally abusive. My ex was having an affair and went out of his way to hide it, with password protected photo galleries etc, very shifty with phone etc. Whenever I raised anything with him he's make me out to be crazy and paranoid. It's their best defense. I'm now in a wonderful trusting relationship and it's completely different. Be careful. I'd get your own finances in order so you can separate if you want to.

Just here to say that it's DEFFO suspicious (Which I think everyone has agreed with) and you are an absolute HERO for shutting off the electrics 😂

@Imcrazyapparently

I'm not trying to minimise or imply that child sex offenders are easy to spot. I said I had already considered this and like I said he doesn't give any indication that he would do that.

My reasons, apart from what I mentioned above are that he is useless with our kids, doesn't seek out anytime alone with them, doesn't do nappies very often, never does a bath, he could easily manage a kids football team but chose to work with adults, his general reaction to anything like this on the news is disgust.

You could easily argue that he's trying very hard not to put himself in a risky situation with children - to the extent that he avoids parenting his own.

Many paedophiles are aware that it is a perversion and do not necessarily want to act upon their urges (at least at first) because they know the consequences are severe. The best way of doing that is to avoid any situation where he might be tempted in real life, and to only 'allow' his secret desires to be acted out online. That would fit very much with the behaviours you describe.

Again I'm not saying that it's the case but it seems bizarre that you think your 'psychoanalysis' is some kind of protection against him being engaged in shifty or illicit compulsions

100% dodgy

@Imcrazyapparently

I'm not trying to minimise or imply that child sex offenders are easy to spot. I said I had already considered this and like I said he doesn't give any indication that he would do that.

My reasons, apart from what I mentioned above are that he is useless with our kids, doesn't seek out anytime alone with them, doesn't do nappies very often, never does a bath, he could easily manage a kids football team but chose to work with adults, his general reaction to anything like this on the news is disgust.

Really? I'm sure that describes many sex offenders and paedophiles, and just to clarify, they don't give off any indication either.