I know DD is in the wrong, but should children have to put up with this?

[ObviousNameChage]

DD got in trouble at school. I have no issues with the consequences she got and we had a very stern chat at home. For background she's never in trouble and described as a shy,quiet ,polite child so this is not the norm for her.


What happened was that some of her classmates were laughing and making comment that their teacher smells really bad, has sweat stains,you get the gist. DD said "I know , it makes me feel sick". Teacher overheard this and obviously all of the girls are in trouble, got a bollocking from her and also the head . They have to write apology letters and will miss play next week. We also had a talk at home about making comments,hurting people's feelings ,what's acceptable and what isn't etc.

The issue is, the teacher does actually smell quite bad, especially now in the heat, so many bodies in a sunny classroom etc. It is slightly noticeable at pick up and I'm not even that close. DD really doesn't like it and the smell (smells do in general she even recoils from me and her dad if we're smelly) does bother her. I do believe she made an honest statement , but still hurtful and as such she needs to deal with the consequences.She can't avoid it as there's group work,reading ,having chats, teacher coming over for help and so on.

It's such an awkward and difficult situation and the poor teacher must be mortified. However, at some level I also feel for the kids that have to put up with is for several hours a day and have no choice or option to "escape" from it.

If I say anything to the school I'll sound like a dick myself, the teacher will probably feel even worse and I don't think anyone can really do anything about it. At the same time I don't think it's ok for the children to just shut up and put up with it.

[Bythemillpond]

When I had this at work I just went in one day raving about this new deodorant i found that works wonders. Obviously, entirely different relationship and dynamic, plus being a bit sweaty myself it didn't come across as "aimed" at colleague. She asked what it was,where to buy it from, she did and it worked for her too so problem solved

We had this years ago with a teenage boy at work.
We did the same thing about feeling hot and sweaty and discussing deodorants.
Nothing not a comment

Secret Santa and birthdays was deodorant and body wash type stuff from us. He opened one lot at Christmas and exclaimed, Anyone would think I smell.
Even the awkward silence after didn’t do anything to give him a clue.
The manager had a quiet word with him about hygiene and smells in the office where he assured him that he had a bath once per week.
In the end I left the company.
He was still stinking the office out when I left

[TatianaBis]

Dont tell your daughter that she had a point.

She did have a point though. The discussion should be about how the situation could have been dealt with better. Talk outside school premises, then tell parents and let them deal with the issue.

Children need to be able to speak about teachers, otherwise when they get a pervy one they will be too polite and too afraid of seeming ‘rude’ to complain.

[mam0918]

VainAbigail

because it is unacceptible, so she should recoil at people with physical issues like deformaties, dandruff, acne, weight issues or anything else that might make her 'uncomfortable'?

Other people bodies and their existance in the same space as you are NOT something you have any right to be uncomfortable over.

[ObviousNameChage]

@PlanDeRaccordement

I would hope the head teacher is already having conversation with teacher about over-sweatiness and perhaps going to GP about Botox injections or other treatments. The teacher doesn’t have to suffer.

I wouldn’t bring it up to head myself though.

I would explain to DD that is probably medical condition because some people do get over sweaty & smelly through no fault of their own even if their hygiene is quite good.

That's actually a good suggestion.

She's also mortified and worried now about her relationship with the teacher. She actually likes the teacher and have quite a good bond,can have a joke etc. and she's worried she ruined all that. She is not "sorry she got caught" she is upset because she made the teacher upset and cross and the head. That actually helped with the chat about hurting people's feelings and talking about them behind their backs.

I reassured her the teacher is a professional and a very nice lady, and as ling as she is genuinely sorry , one incident should not impact on the relationship they've built for a whole year. Hopefully.

[Bagamoyo1]

Years of reading MN has led me to be pretty sure that most people who smell do so due to lack of washing, rather than a medical condition (very rare). There are many threads on here about shower/bath frequency, and lots of posters happily say “I only wash once a week and I don’t smell”. Oh yes you do.

[DavidTheDog]

I'm another poster wondering how she'll cope with secondary school.

[me4real]

If I say anything to the school I'll sound like a dick myself, the teacher will probably feel even worse and I don't think anyone can really do anything about it.

@ObviousNameChage They can do something about it- personal hygeine. Even if they have to have a scrub half way through the day or reapply deodorant etc. A person can feel bad if they're told the fact that they aren't acting socially appropriately in some way, but they are not acting appropriately and they need to fix that, because others are effected.

Your DD actually did nothing wrong, she was just saying to her friend the fact that she found a smell unpleasant. She didn't mean the teacher to hear her and be hurt. The teacher should have inwardly taken their comment on board and fixed the problem the next day with reapplying deodorant or whatever's needed, rather than acting as if the children had done something wrong.

I would write to the head about the teacher's b.o. If they have had a parent complain, the head can talk to the teacher and the issue can be resolved as the person can practice better hygeine appropriate to the heat for them. Everyone has to do different things to keep themselves from smelling, but there's no excuse really, unless someone has the very rare Fish Odour Syndrome or something.

You could write anonymously if you like.

The children shouldn't have to sit in a room with a smell.

[TatianaBis]

@DavidTheDog

I'm another poster wondering how she'll cope with secondary school.

I’m wondering how some posters cope with real life.

If they’re launching knee jerk attacks on a 9 year old.

[ObviousNameChage]

@mam0918

You say its bad in the heat and she sweats a lot so its likely a medical condition like hyperhydrosis.

What the fuck do you expect to achieve by insulting her or complaining about her disability?

Her body issues are non of your business and no one exists for you and your kids comfort, try thinking of someone other than yourself and what they face everyday and be thankful of your privilage that you arent the one having to live 24/7 with the judgement of people like yourself for things completely out of your control.

Whoa , that's rather uncalled for.
I've not insulted anyone and I don't plan to complain about anything.

I admitted I fucked up. I admitted DD fucked up. However I don't think asking for opinions or further advice (since I've obviously fucked up to begin with) should justify you swearing at me and your aggressive language.

[InFiveMins]

I get where you're coming from OP, but honestly, your child won't be stuck with this teacher for much longer. I presume come September she'll be in a new classroom with a new teacher?

[NumberTheory]

You’re nearly at the end of the school year, so unless DD is going to have this teacher again next year I might just leave it. But I don’t think it would be unreasonable to write to the teacher’s line manager and tell them that you know DD’s actions were unacceptable and you aren’t in anyway challenging the punishment but you dropped the ball earlier in the year because this has in fact been an issue that DD has brought up again and again and you have not helped your DD express it in an acceptable way. But you are sure they are aware that an BO can cause an unpleasent environment for those who have to work around it and that is true for children in a classroom too and could they take action ensure the 30 children in the class do not have to endure it any more.

[Zzelda]

@FrangipaniDeLaSqueegeeMop

When I had this at work I just went in one day raving about this new deodorant i found that works wonders. Obviously, entirely different relationship and dynamic, plus being a bit sweaty myself it didn't come across as "aimed" at colleague. She asked what it was,where to buy it from, she did and it worked for her too so problem solved

But you understand that a teacher/pupil dynamic is different than you and a colleague?

She literally said so in the bit you've quoted.

[Zzelda]

@Flowerlane

Seeming as your daughter and her friends have pointed it out, the teacher will be well aware there is no need to embarrass the poor teacher even more by pointing it out again

You daughter and friends were wrong and should be taught remarks like that are uncalled for.

Did you miss the bit where OP explained that that is exactly what she has told her child?

I can't understand why people are trying to pile in on OP when at no stage has she sought to excuse her daughter.

[Whyhello]

I actually sympathise with your DD and her classmates if the teacher genuinely does stink every day. In primary school you rarely get to escape from your teacher, it isn’t like secondary where you have 5/6 different teachers a day. She’s also 9 and in her eyes probably made an accurate remark, not a teenager who is saying it to purposely be a dick.

[CustardSquirrel]

It is horrible working with someone who actually smells really bad. Being a child stuck in a hot classroom with a teacher that smells really bad during summer must be awful.
The management should enforce the dress code, everywhere I've worked it has included being clean with clean clothing.

[cupsofcoffee]

Why is it unacceptable?!

Because it's bloody rude, that's why.

How odd of you to think it’s appropriate for a child to hide that they feel uncomfortable!

There are more appropriate ways to show your discomfort than physically recoiling from people, though. This girl is 9 years old - she's more than old enough to understand that her behaviour isn't very nice.

Would you think it appropriate to physically recoil from someone who smelt due to illness, for example?

[Whyhello]

Should also add that hopefully this is a wake up call for the teacher and she now fixes her personal hygiene. It’s important to smell good as a teacher (I am a teacher), you frequently have to lean over students.

[me4real]

If I were a teacher and I had children saying that about me, I'd just wash more/freshen up etc. That's the way to stop them thinking that, after all. I did part of a PGCE and that's what I would've done.

Imagine a teacher complaining to the head about a discipline issue caused by the teacher's own behaviour, their own b.o. I'm embarrassed on their behalf.

[cupsofcoffee]

@CustardSquirrel

It is horrible working with someone who actually smells really bad. Being a child stuck in a hot classroom with a teacher that smells really bad during summer must be awful.
The management should enforce the dress code, everywhere I've worked it has included being clean with clean clothing.

It is unpleasant but as has been said numerous times, there are medical conditions that can cause BO and excess sweating. No amount of "enforcing the dress code" will change that.

You can't discriminate against someone because they have a medical condition.

[ObviousNameChage]

@InFiveMins

I get where you're coming from OP, but honestly, your child won't be stuck with this teacher for much longer. I presume come September she'll be in a new classroom with a new teacher?

Sometimes they do have the same teachers more than one year and it hasn't been announced yet. It's unlikely she'll have her again though , so yeah just 6 more weeks.

[Zzelda]

@oohyoudevilyou

The kids are in trouble because they were rude and unkind. Whether the teacher smells or not is irrelevant: They need to learn not to make nasty remarks, particularly in class.
Teacher has decided the consequence is to miss play for a week and write letters of apology. You don't need to do anything else, except reinforce that it's unkind and unacceptable (as you already have done).

I really don't see how you can say that OP doesn't need to do anything else given the fact that teacher does have an odour problem. It must be really difficult for pupils with sensory problems to cope with, and if other staff in the school aren't dealing with it then it's perfectly appropriate for OP to raise the matter.

[cupsofcoffee]

@me4real

If I were a teacher and I had children saying that about me, I'd just wash more/freshen up etc. That's the way to stop them thinking that, after all. I did part of a PGCE and that's what I would've done.

Imagine a teacher complaining to the head about a discipline issue caused by the teacher's own behaviour, their own b.o. I'm embarrassed on their behalf.

How do you know the teacher can help it?

She could be pregnant and struggling with BO.
She could have hyperhidrosis (excess sweating).
She could have hyperthyroidism.
She could have skin conditions that cause poor odour.

Google also tells me that liver and kidney conditions can cause bad odour.

Washing more often won't get rid of any of those things.

[cupsofcoffee]

I really don't see how you can say that OP doesn't need to do anything else given the fact that teacher does have an odour problem. It must be really difficult for pupils with sensory problems to cope with, and if other staff in the school aren't dealing with it then it's perfectly appropriate for OP to raise the matter.

It must also be really difficult to struggle from a medical condition that causes BO and poor odour, knowing people are talking about you and "recoiling" from your very presence.

[Iwonder08]

Ffs, the girl didn't say anything directly to the teacher. It is the teacher who is in the wrong, anyone who is dealing with people on a regular basis should take extra care of body odours. How awful it must be to be stuck in a classroom with a person who stinks. It could indeed make the girl feel sick.

[MumofSpud]

@ObviousNameChage

DD got in trouble at school. I have no issues with the consequences she got and we had a very stern chat at home. For background she's never in trouble and described as a shy,quiet ,polite child so this is not the norm for her.


What happened was that some of her classmates were laughing and making comment that their teacher smells really bad, has sweat stains,you get the gist. DD said "I know , it makes me feel sick". Teacher overheard this and obviously all of the girls are in trouble, got a bollocking from her and also the head . They have to write apology letters and will miss play next week. We also had a talk at home about making comments,hurting people's feelings ,what's acceptable and what isn't etc.

The issue is, the teacher does actually smell quite bad, especially now in the heat, so many bodies in a sunny classroom etc. It is slightly noticeable at pick up and I'm not even that close. DD really doesn't like it and the smell (smells do in general she even recoils from me and her dad if we're smelly) does bother her. I do believe she made an honest statement , but still hurtful and as such she needs to deal with the consequences.She can't avoid it as there's group work,reading ,having chats, teacher coming over for help and so on.

It's such an awkward and difficult situation and the poor teacher must be mortified. However, at some level I also feel for the kids that have to put up with is for several hours a day and have no choice or option to "escape" from it.

If I say anything to the school I'll sound like a dick myself, the teacher will probably feel even worse and I don't think anyone can really do anything about it. At the same time I don't think it's ok for the children to just shut up and put up with it.

I am going to disagree with a lot of OPs.
Yes I get that some people may have a medical condition (I believe it's rare) which may cause BO, yes some people may have lost their sense of smell but IME adults with BO have had the subtle ways of being told about it and a more direct approach is needed.
I don't think your DD was nasty but the others laughing were as it wouldn't have helped at all.
Also, if children and parents can get this is an issue why hasn't the school dealt with it? They must have realised that this was an issue.
Poor children in this classroom all day!