If a step parent is a SAHP...

[PurfectlyCatish]

AIBU to ask your opinion?

Another thread inspired this but I'm interested in opinions as it may possibly be my situation at some point.

If a step parent was a SAHP, would you also expect them to be so for their step children when they were due to be at that parents home? I.e. school runs, holiday care etc...

YABU - the SAHP should do the care for all the children when they stay, step or not.

YANBU - the SAHP only has responsibility for their own DC and the parents of DSC should make their own arrangements for things like school and holidays.

I might be completely wrong here, but in my experience it’s the divorced man wooing a younger woman, making out that his existing kids aren’t really a great responsibility, in order to secure a younger model and never really realising that woman is going to want kids - where the older ones are pushed out.

I think it’s the combination of a woman who has never had children, who is looking to the older man to give her security and he in return, makes too much of acting like he’s still a free man - where older ones are seen as more an inconvenience. I think much of the blame is on the father, as he’s too busy wanting to prove he’s so hot he can have someone 15 years younger that he will throw his kids under the bus to get it, which is why he divorced in the first place.

Just my anecodotal observations. And quite possibly bitter experience making me too cynical!

However, again, it’s not the step mum parenting the father’s kids that is needed! It’s the father parenting his kids. Let’s put the blame where it lies.

So many sweeping generalisations about SP’s and their roles. Bewildering really.

I was in a LTR. I’m divorced with children. My exp was divorced with children.
There was ZERO expectation that my exp ‘step up’ around my children. Even though I had them 60% of the time and WOHM in a full on job. I have exh nearby, I have a great nanny and if needs be friends / family I could pull in in an emergency (not easily but that option exists).
My children are my responsibility to take care of, along with my exh. They are no one else’s. It is our job to discipline, feed, educate, treat etc.
I would not expect my exh’s partner to ‘step up’ to fill any of his role, it’s his role as a parent.
I would not expect a partner of mine to take any significant role with them either.
I therefore would not expect to do any of the same for a partners children. We each chose who you have children with, fulfilling the subsequent responsibilities falls only to those people.

Do I think that means I shouldn’t date / have a committed LTR with a man with children/ a child? Of course not. What does his child have to do with me? Sweet FA!

I would expect someone to warm, welcoming, kind, boundaried to my children and no more than that. It’s what I would do with anyone else’s children and I doubt I would ever want to do anything more. Why would I? I work and financially support myself whilst raising my own children. I would expect my partner to do the exact same.

My relationship with another person is with that person. More men (and ex wives) need to stop making everything about the children. And expecting whole households to pivot to meet ‘their’ children’s needs. My role is to accept and respect the prioritisation my partner will give to their children (time/ money/ emotionally/ physically etc) and support that by completely allowing them the time and space they need with their kids.

Outside of that? I will absolutely continue to date men with children, with the very clear view that the children really are absolutely nothing to do with me.

The OP’s example is nuanced. They are committed, with a ‘their’ baby and the Op is a SAHP. That is a far more complex situation and I’ve already said how I would feel if I was the OP’s OH.

So the broader ‘judgements’ about Sp’s and what they should/ shouldn’t do are a tad irrelevant to this thread.

Soooo often, the dad (and let's face it, it usually is the dad rather than the mum) assumes his partner will automatically step into the role of mother/carer for his kids when they're with him. And if she doesn't, he then tries to push her into that role by guilt-tripping her or sulking. It's not fair at all.

Yup, I cottoned on that this was happening in our house. I found increasingly, DH would go off and do something he preferred during DSS’ contact time and keep checking in with me to ask how he was. So for me, I was just dumped with an extra child. I think men like the dynamic of just popping into play and say hello, but avoid the heavy lifting. DH certainly does with our DC and that dynamic was creeping into my DSS too.

I am of the view that DSS was there to spend time with his dad, not me and actually being dumped with me and my DC wasn’t his preference anyway and that DH arranged his contact time/work schedule to ensure he is available and so should be available during that time - not busying himself elsewhere.

I don’t feel a moments guilt for pulling him up on it. He managed perfectly well before I came along.

sassbott
The complexities are precisely why much of this should be discussed prior to having a new baby when there's existing children in the household. That way both of them could have talked about how the saw the household running and how all children in the household will be provided for, both in terms of household finances and which adult is around for different responsibilities.

@LolaSmiles

sassbott The complexities are precisely why much of this should be discussed prior to having a new baby when there's existing children in the household. That way both of them could have talked about how the saw the household running and how all children in the household will be provided for, both in terms of household finances and which adult is around for different responsibilities.

The only thing that has changed is the father’s expectations.

*The only thing that has changed is the father’s expectations?
Really?
The OP says herself they've not had the conversation yet:
This isn't my situation yet. But it's a conversation that me and DH are going to need to have soon so I'm just not sure what is / isn't reasonable of me to suggest I do.

But don't let that stop the dad bashing.

@sassbott

I fundamentally disagree. I think if you enter into a serious, committed relationship with a man with dependent children (especially if it involves living with him), then to compartmentalise those children as ‘absolutely nothing to do with me’ is just plain wrong.

DH would go off and do something he preferred during DSS’ contact time and keep checking in with me to ask how he was.

This is totally unacceptable and he’s a poor excuse for a father. I would be massively disappointed.

@LolaSmiles

*The only thing that has changed is the father’s expectations? Really? The OP says herself they've not had the conversation yet: This isn't my situation yet. But it's a conversation that me and DH are going to need to have soon so I'm just not sure what is / isn't reasonable of me to suggest I do.

But don't let that stop the dad bashing.

I think I confused the OP for the linked post where dad had told the mum that SM would be available to help without consulting her.

A step parent is still a parent they should parent their stepchildren whilst they are at their house. My mum was a step parent and my step dad was a long distance lorry driver, they rarely saw their mum and my mum did everything a parent should for them whilst they lived with us.

DinoHat
I see what you mean.
The OP did say that her partner has form for being very flexible with the step children coming round in the holidays, and she wouldn't want to be on call every day if she was a SAHP, which is totally fair.

Most of my frustration with this thread is because neither the OP or her DP have discussed how the household will run.It sounds like there's some serious mismatches of expectations and they're only being addressed once there's a new baby (who is now a toddler).

@FloconDeNeige So pushy about what is and isn't "acceptable" and when step parents must walk away. It's not for you to decide. I do not feel in the slightest that if I am not up for any changes ranging up to becoming the SCs adoptive parent if their other parent were to die, that I MUST walk away from my relationship. No way. I've been up front with my DP. I'm up for HIM being locked into his responsibility to his son, and every now and then I might help, but he should never assume this. That applies whatever circumstances change. No I wouldn't be "up for" things changing if it wasn't necessary for the household - so I wouldn't just blindly accept him changing arrangements in ways that require my help unless it was essential. He has no problem with any of this. You are being extremely presumptuous.

@Cotswoldmama

A step parent is still a parent they should parent their stepchildren whilst they are at their house. My mum was a step parent and my step dad was a long distance lorry driver, they rarely saw their mum and my mum did everything a parent should for them whilst they lived with us.

She did that, which is fantastic. My DH is an amazing stepdad to my DS - he's every part a dad to him, just not by name - which is also fantastic,However I'd never expect that of him - I just feel lucky that I met such a lovely person.

That doesn't mean it's an expectation though, I think it's wonderful if step parents step up if needed (in DH's case, DS's Dad just wasn't bothered ) , but even then it's not for everyone, and I respect that. I think as long as they are kind and don't treat the children like they are a bad smell or resent them then that's fine.

It’s up to me to decide what I think is acceptable.

If you’ve been so upfront with your DP that you won’t be changing anything to accommodate his child unless it’s absolutely essential, you can’t be surprised if one day circumstances change and he chooses his child over you. As any half decent person would.

@LolaSmiles

DinoHat I see what you mean. The OP did say that her partner has form for being very flexible with the step children coming round in the holidays, and she wouldn't want to be on call every day if she was a SAHP, which is totally fair.

Most of my frustration with this thread is because neither the OP or her DP have discussed how the household will run.It sounds like there's some serious mismatches of expectations and they're only being addressed once there's a new baby (who is now a toddler).

What makes you think it hasn't been discussed though?

I would assume that it probably was discussed when OP became a SAHM, and at that time her DH was happy to continue with his responsibilities for his other children and so it didn't crop up. Now she has the impression that he may not feel that way anymore so it anticipating this change.

I mean, don't get me wrong I appreciate that people can change their minds or want things to change, I just don't get the impression that OP and her DH have gone into things with their eyes closed. More that they did make an agreement which suited them previously, and now she feels he may not be happy with that anymore.

What makes you think it hasn't been discussed though?
The OP said this isn't her situation yet in one of her earlier posts.
I could have got the wrong end of the stick, but it came across to me like:
DP has his children who stay for half the week
OP has her toddler with the DP
She's considering being a stay at home parent and there's a conversation she needs to have with her DP about what's reasonable for a SAHP regarding the step children.
At the moment she doesn't want to do breakfast exactly how DH does (reasonable imo, if he wants to make breakfast then he can but they're old enough to make their own) and she thinks that the school runs by DP and his ex baby the children, and she wouldn't want to be on call for ad hoc changes of contact (reasonable imo), but she only wants to have a helping relationship I she becomes a SAHP and isn't sure she wants to do SAHP things for her step children as well (unreasonable in my opinion, because the household contains contains children).

That's my understanding. It sounds like there's potentially a lot of being on different pages.

@LolaSmiles

sassbott The complexities are precisely why much of this should be discussed prior to having a new baby when there's existing children in the household. That way both of them could have talked about how the saw the household running and how all children in the household will be provided for, both in terms of household finances and which adult is around for different responsibilities.

Unfortunately most step mums would not be welcome in any discussions about kids though from previous marriages. Men tend to compartmentalise and also mothers, probably rightly, want to make childcare arrangements with their ex not the step mum too. I asked to be part of thinking about arrangements and was told to mind my own business!

@LolaSmiles

What makes you think it hasn't been discussed though? The OP said this isn't her situation yet in one of her earlier posts. I could have got the wrong end of the stick, but it came across to me like: DP has his children who stay for half the week OP has her toddler with the DP She's considering being a stay at home parent and there's a conversation she needs to have with her DP about what's reasonable for a SAHP regarding the step children. At the moment she doesn't want to do breakfast exactly how DH does (reasonable imo, if he wants to make breakfast then he can but they're old enough to make their own) and she thinks that the school runs by DP and his ex baby the children, and she wouldn't want to be on call for ad hoc changes of contact (reasonable imo), but she only wants to have a helping relationship I she becomes a SAHP and isn't sure she wants to do SAHP things for her step children as well (unreasonable in my opinion, because the household contains contains children).

That's my understanding. It sounds like there's potentially a lot of being on different pages.

Oh that's interesting!

See I assumed OP is already a SAHP to their toddler - I think she said she was but I may have picked that up wrong? - so is now a couple of years down the line, and her DH is looking to change things up.

So I assumed they had had the convo at the time when it was first considered - maybe when OP was pregnant - and it was agreed that OP would be a SAHP for their son but DH would continue his responsibilities for the older children. Either that or he just assumed he would and did not bring it up at all.

So my opinions are from that point of view - that they both agreed those terms and now he is looking to put quite a lot of extra work onto her. Not that they are newly discussion options now.

Rejoiningperson
Your partner should have stuck up for you then. It doesn't have to be detailed discussions about every element of the child's life, but how the household runs is 100% the business of both adults and I'll defend every step parent's right to be involved in a meaningful discussion of how their household is organised.

Bibidy
That would explain how we came to different positions on some elements.
Don't you love the ambiguity of the written word.

@FloconDeNeige

It’s up to me to decide what I think is acceptable.

If you’ve been so upfront with your DP that you won’t be changing anything to accommodate his child unless it’s absolutely essential, you can’t be surprised if one day circumstances change and he chooses his child over you. As any half decent person would.

Yes but you've said it over and over again like it's fact, which it isn't. Circumstances may change in that he might need to have his son more, but it will be him that will automatically take the burden of that. I might help in various new ways but that is not a pre agreed assumption. I would be more likely to help if it were something he had no choice about, like if DSS's mum died, than if he just decided he wanted to change his job etc. The point is it's entirely down to my discretion what I do and don't do.

As to choosing him over me - one, we are not opposing concepts. Me existing does not get in the way of him parenting his son, which he would have to do if he were single, anyway. If he chooses to leave me because me existing doesn't help him enough, that's on him. And two, he'd be choosing to leave his other child, our DD, too. He'd be cutting his nose off to spite his face.

It depends. Are they married and a proper family or are they dating? Is it a new relationship or a longterm and committed one. If either of the two later options, then yes, I'd think it was awful foe the parent not to care for their step child as well as their own. They aren't a proper family if they don't. But if it's either of the former options, i wouldn't expect the stepparent to take care of stepchildren. Like if they were already a SAHP before meeting their boyfriend/girlfriend and then their boyfriend/girlfriend just suddenly decided they could provide them with free childcare, then I wouldn't think this was fair.

@LolaSmiles

Rejoiningperson Your partner should have stuck up for you then. It doesn't have to be detailed discussions about every element of the child's life, but how the household runs is 100% the business of both adults and I'll defend every step parent's right to be involved in a meaningful discussion of how their household is organised.

There are stages in involvement though, and again I do think it’s the father that needs to be this clear to his new wife. Unfortunately what happens is at the beginning, there is an arrangement between parents and as step mum it is usually not considered good to stick your nose in.

In fact some of the misunderstandings come about when the step mum moves in and says ‘but can’t we have the kids 6pm instead of 7pm’ or whatever as that fits in with dinner time they want.

Often that can cause friction and many mothers gets quite annoyed that things change when the father marries again.

It is only down the line if the woman has a baby that things are often just expected to change. So the step mum is presented with a totally new situation that was not ‘what she signed up for’.

It is such a tricky thing to get right.

I and many other step mums, can often be told that the step kids is ‘one household’ as in their rules, their way of doing things. And not to interfere with that.

If a step mum tries to run a household, with step children in it, it’s usually a bit of a war zone for a while.

Just from my observations, the children are always better off if they can continue to have protected time with their father, where they can keep up their own ways of doing things, and where he does all the heavy lifting of parenting.

That way step mum is there but in a lesser role, there to include them and some mutual activities. But not where the kids are thrown in and then Dad scuttles off into a corner. Which so often happens, even when they are in the same house!

It has made me overall think that it is so much better not to separate in the first place, if we can possibly help it. Have better and happier marriages. Most second families do not work and have too much strife, and I think it’s the step mums and the kids who suffer most. Dads seem pretty oblivious on the whole. Of course I’m glad I’m not with my Ex, but I really would have spent more time finding someone much more of a sure bet marriage wise if I lived my life again!