No one wants weekend work

[LastOrdersMaura]

My friend has a cafe. It's in a central location with a good bus route, cycle route and ten mins walk from a huge university campus.
Despite the jobs being on Indeed and advertised on a local job site, no one is applying. Or they apply but say 'is there any negotiation on the days?' Why doesn't anyone want weekend work anymore? I would have thought there would have been college students, Uni students, mums/ dads who can only work when partners are home, retired people who are bored. Why is it so difficult to recruit?

When you're young that's the only time you can work and socialise consistently! I used to go out every Friday and Saturday night, work 12 hour shifts in Neros all weekend and felt great! Woke up at some random house and shower, I don't know how many times I used to ask my colleagues 'do I smell like tequila?' It was the best!

I agree OP, it's great when you're in your 20s. The buzz of a busy place, the camaraderie, the social life, friendships made etc. did make up for the crap bits (long shifts - sometimes 11 or 12 hours on your feet with a 30-minute break!, low pay, sometimes dealing with difficult customers etc.)
As for tips, I never worked anywhere that service-charged, tips were NOT guaranteed (except around Christmas). Tips were very good in the restaurant where I worked, they were pretty much non-existent in the pub I ended up in, but I agree that tips would not be a perk in a cafe in a department store. Fwiw, I was on NMW the entire time I was in hospitality. AND I was a very hard worker! I could easily say I deserved more than NMW but so do most people in hospitality, care work etc.
I'm so glad that we have NMW for hospitality staff in this part of the world and don't have a system like the American one where staff rely on tips to make up their wages. But I see no mention of some of the things PPs have raised as potential reasons for people being put off, such as no breaks offered, no uniform provided. I Imagine a chain cafe would provide a branded uniform and would have proper employee rights in place such as entitlement to a 15-minute break for a six-hour shift.

It's a chain cafe, she doesn't own it, and it's in the middle of a not very hip department store. Unlikely young people will stroll past the poster. It's both days of the weekend but 10-4.

I know that if I was late teens/early 20s again and looking for a job, I wouldn't be put off by minimum wage, and the prospect of a six-hour shift. I imagine that would suit a lot of people, but I suppose as many have already mentioned, the timing is unfortunate. I have a friend who runs a coffee shop in a student's union and they do keep running outside of term-time but they have no need for staff as the place is a ghost town when the students are away. What is the town like generally OP? What is footfall like in the town & in the department store? Has your friend advertised the vacancy on social media if that's an option?

@astery some people are only looking for 12 hours or less to keep their benefits.

@Tiffanny

Sorry if I offended people with the term crap job. They were crap because the money was low and I worked like a dog.

But brilliant jobs in terms of experience, leaning useful skills and a good start in life. Work ethic, customer service, communication, time management, responsibilities.

Taught me a lot and I have worked retail management too so have plenty of respect for that career.

But still, getting to age 21-22 and never having worked can only mean you are privileged and lazy. In my opinion. I would urge all parents to encourage their kids to get a job for various reasons. It's competitive out there. Start building the cv because no experience is irrelevant

It might mean the opposite.

It might mean you have parents who are unable to facilitate getting you there and back to a job in an area with rubbish & expensive public transport, maybe because they themselves can’t drive/have health issues or caring responsibilities.

Maybe you can’t afford driving lessons or if you can to be put onto the insurance of your family car (& 18/19 year olds at the moment have just had a year where lessons and tests were not allowed)

Neither of my kids even attempted to get jobs last summer because we were in a family crisis with one grandparent in hospital and the other one with severe dementia then dh was also quite poorly.

Ds managed to get some casual work last weekend leafleting for an event. But because the buses don’t run on a Sunday he was only able to do it because I could drive him there. The weekend before that would not have been possible due to our caring responsibilities.

But still, getting to age 21-22 and never having worked can only mean you are privileged and lazy

Bollocks. It could also mean:

• that you struggled with your mental health and couldn't cope with a job on top of your studies
• that you lived in a rural area as a teenager where jobs were non-existent
• that you studied a very time-consuming degree that wasn't compatible with having a job
• that you were a carer for a disabled relative - a parent or sibling, perhaps, or that you had a young child yourself

Or any number of other things. I didn't work as a student because I struggled with my mental health and I was fortunate enough to have parents who could support me while I was studying.

I got my first job at 22. The lack of experience never held me back. I've managed to get every job I've ever interviewed for, and now run a successful business of my own. Starting work at 14/15/16 isn't necessity by any means.

@ilovesouthlondon 12 hours is not enough to keep benefits. That was my point. It is too low a number of hours that mothers with children are required to work and too unsocial hours to attract anyone else.

[quote astery]@ilovesouthlondon 12 hours is not enough to keep benefits. That was my point. It is too low a number of hours that mothers with children are required to work and too unsocial hours to attract anyone else.[/quote]
Yes, in order to continue getting working tax credits you must work a MINIMUM of 16 hours a week.

6 hours in the middle of every Saturday & Sunday would unlikely suit parents, unless there was one parent at home but it would suit a teen looking for summer work.

Are teens these days not looking for experience / something to boost their c.v.?

@disconnected101

Are teens these days not looking for experience / something to boost their c.v.?

Sure, but that doesn't mean they need to accept awful shifts for awful pay. There are plenty of jobs out there that offer better hours, better pay and more benefits than that. Even our local chippy offers better pay and free meals.

2 x 6 hour shifts means two lots of transport costs and potentially zero breaks while at work. It also means your entire weekend is taken up by work (as realistically you're out of the house 9-5) as well.

Where are the in-work benefits? They could offer a paid lunch-break of 30 minutes plus free staff meals on-shift, for example. Or discounts for family members who choose to eat there as well. What's the uniform? Is this paid for by the employer? If not, why not? Is there access to good pensions, or discounts throughout the rest of the store? What about a cycle-to-work scheme or similar to help with transport costs?

People expect better than low hours, low pay and zero benefits. Why would you take a rubbish job unless you were absolutely desperate?

@NewMatress

She needs a reputation locally as a really lovely employer. Does she?

Too many small business owners feel they're doing staff such a favour to give them a bit of low paid amd unreliable work that they expect people to take all sorts. I don't know if that's the issue for your friend, but it's certainly coming accross a bit in your posts OP.

IME that is especially true for small cafes. I worked part time in one when I was a student, and the owner was a hard taskmaster who expected the earth for rubbish pay and zero perks. The cafe was packed every weekend and the job involved a lot of cleaning at the end of each shift. It was the worst job I ever had. A friend of mine had a very similar experience when she worked in a cafe a couple of years back, so maybe this attitude is common with cafe owners.

As a PP mentioned above, MacDonalds is a far more attractive proposition for most youngsters, and also gives opportunity to make friends and socialise a bit. That opportunity doesn't exist when you're the sole waitress/waiter working in a small cafe, with the owner's beady eye on you every working minute.

@LastOrdersMaura

But she's not asking for experience. What are all the teenagers doing for jobs these days? I'm sorry but you cannot be an eighteen year old with no experience and expect to get more than MW. I'm on 50p more than that and I am responsible for peoples lives (care work.)

Your right but young people coming into the workplace think they are entitled to all sorts. Gone are the days of starting at the bottom like the rest of us

Sure, but that doesn't mean they need to accept awful shifts for awful pay. There are plenty of jobs out there that offer better hours, better pay and more benefits than that. Even our local chippy offers better pay and free meals.
I must be in the minority here but I really don't think that 10am-4pm on NMW is an awful shift for awful pay!
Of course in a small cafe you can be at the mercy of whoever is running it & conditions could be great or they could be awful. Friends of mine have worked for some real tyrants & there was no-one above them to go to with complaints, no HR dept. etc. My last pub was privately owned & the owner & management were fantastically supportive & fair. It's a real gamble in a small outlet. But then, you could be in a big organization & still be under a nightmare manager. Though again, I know that there is a professional 'cushion' - HR, complaints procedure etc. with bigger employers.
Lots of people are speculating that working conditions in this cafe must be awful i.e. no benefits/breaks/food provided. I think the OP should clarify what is on offer.

I must be in the minority here but I really don't think that 10am-4pm on NMW is an awful shift for awful pay!

For an 18yo, NMW is £6.56 an hour. That's not even £35 per shift. Less than £70 to give up your weekend, pretty much.

My first job was in a supermarket. Minimum wage was about £6 per hour (as it was a flat rate for over-21's then) and I earned nearly £8 an hour. So, well above minimum wage. I worked two evenings and a Sunday shift each week. I had Friday night, all of Saturday and Sunday afternoon completely free. I got free uniform, discounted meals, discounted groceries/booze/clothes, a pension and more.

Why would anyone pick a NMW job in a café over that?

Your right but young people coming into the workplace think they are entitled to all sorts. Gone are the days of starting at the bottom like the rest of us

Why do you say this like it's a bad thing! Why shouldn't people be entitled to a fair wage (and minimum wage is not fair, it's not kept up with inflation so essentially people's time is being devalued year on year), decent working conditions, basic respect and a few workplace perks. Talk about a race to the bottom. I'm so sick of the attitude of 'we had it tough so you should too', progress is a good thing, things are meant to get better. And people are still starting at the bottom, the bottom is just (rightly) less shit than it once was.

Oh, I see!

Why would anyone pick a NMW job in a café over that?
Because, unfortunately, you can't just pick & choose a job. Especially with no/limited experience. If I was young & inexperienced, I would take the shitty cafe job. If it turned out to be actually shitty, I would apply for other stuff pronto, whist still at the cafe. In my experience, it's much easier to get a job when you have a job. I'm not trying to say that beggars can't be choosers - I'm no job snob, having worked in minimum wage jobs for more than 10 years, but really, I would rather have a temporary shitty job than none at all.

I must be in the minority here but I really don't think that 10am-4pm on NMW is an awful shift for awful pay!

NMW for a 17 year old is £4.72 p/h
I earned around £3.00-£3.50 p/h as a 6th former in 1990...

@disconnected101

Why would anyone pick a NMW job in a café over that? Because, unfortunately, you can't just pick & choose a job. Especially with no/limited experience. If I was young & inexperienced, I would take the shitty cafe job. If it turned out to be actually shitty, I would apply for other stuff pronto, whist still at the cafe. In my experience, it's much easier to get a job when you have a job. I'm not trying to say that beggars can't be choosers - I'm no job snob, having worked in minimum wage jobs for more than 10 years, but really, I would rather have a temporary shitty job than none at all.

Except in the current job market you can pick and choose! There are more hospitality jobs in particular than there are hospitality workers or even those just willing to go into hospitality.

Even with no/limited experience there are options right now as places are desperate for workers. There's no reason to take the shitty job with shitty wages and no perks when there's other options.

@disconnected101

Why would anyone pick a NMW job in a café over that? Because, unfortunately, you can't just pick & choose a job. Especially with no/limited experience. If I was young & inexperienced, I would take the shitty cafe job. If it turned out to be actually shitty, I would apply for other stuff pronto, whist still at the cafe. In my experience, it's much easier to get a job when you have a job. I'm not trying to say that beggars can't be choosers - I'm no job snob, having worked in minimum wage jobs for more than 10 years, but really, I would rather have a temporary shitty job than none at all.

I have to disagree with you completely.

McDonald's, Tesco, ASDA etc. all pay above minimum wage, offer on the job training, decent opportunities for progression, discounts, cheap or free staff meals, good pension schemes and more.

Most of them also give you a weekend day off and shifts in the evenings instead of expecting you to give up your entire weekend every week.

As for experience, I never had any experience before getting my first job. It paid well above minimum wage and I progressed towards management within a year. I never worked a full weekend, either.

There are plenty of jobs out there that pay above NMW and that don't require any experience. If this lady isn't getting any applicants then there's a reason for that - she either needs to change the hours offered, up the pay or offer something else to make the job more appealing.

Good job offers will get decent applicants.

And OF COURSE no one should have to accept shitty conditions & shitty pay but so many have no choice.
I have a friend who used to work for Tesco and was full of praise for them as an employer - pay was good, they were very supportive of working parents for eg. and I have a friend who currently works for another big UK supermarket & her experience is the other end of the spectrum. She gets min. wage & gets breaks, uniform, staff discount but says they are terrible employers. I appreciate that this is one person's experience but she is aware of many people who have had problems. She needs the job so can't just up & leave.
There unfortunately doesn't seem to be a good base-line standard for working conditions, pay, benefits & rights. Of course everyone should be on at least national living wage. But is it ever going to happen?

I think there's a big difference between being a parent who has no choice, and a student/teenager who works for extra cash rather than to pay the mortgage, though.

Most people on here are talking about students and most students can earn more money behind the bar in the SU than they would working in a café in a department store all weekend.

I have worked weekends all my working life since i was 12. I am beginning to get peed off with it. You don't get paid more. What's the point.

@Luddite26

I have worked weekends all my working life since i was 12. I am beginning to get peed off with it. You don't get paid more. What's the point.

Yep, I think that sums it up for a lot of people.

Society is still set up for people to work Monday-Friday, 9-5 and working weekends isn't worth it unless you get decent renumeration in return.

Are teens these days not looking for experience / something to boost their c.v

Yes they are but there are better jobs out there.
The problem is by the time you have spent 2 lots of travel say £3 each day and at £4.62 per hour you are looking at working for 6 hours for £24.72 per day on a Saturday and Sunday.
And even if you are on jobseekers you might as well work a full 16 hours per week to get as much money in as you can.
As a parent I have advised Ds not to bother with that low pay he was offered a 12 hour per day, 6 days per day per week warehouse job where he had to work every Saturday and Sunday on £2.75 per hour at 16 when he was looking for a job. He ended up finding something that isn’t exactly regular work but on 8 days per month it exceeds the monthly amount he would get and leaves him free to work other jobs.

If it was on £10 per hour I would think that this friend could be more successful but at writing off an entire weekend for less than £50 per week she is going to struggle.
Baby sitting pays more in one nights baby sitting and you sit on a sofa and watch tv or play with dc till it is time for bed.

@SchrodingersImmigrant

People will need to start deciding whether they want people to be paid more than NMW or whether they want full english with drink for under fiver.

Customer demand on prices is also tied to the wages. People got used to very low prices

Where on earth do you get a full english with drink for under a fiver?