To be really shocked and surprised by dds continuously oppositional behaviour? Can anyone tell me why she's like this and that I can do?

[Falaffeleybollocks]

Dd is 6. Her father and I share care following a difficult split when she was 1. She has settled into the routine between the 2 houses which is a long held and reliable routine and behaves well at school. With me however she will simply refuse, avoid or be oppositional to each and every suggestion and request pretty much all day. She is sunny tempered and fun so at first ie at the beginning of a Saturday or from when I pick her up from school I don't notice that actually she is oppositional to pretty much every request or suggestion until I am asking to sit down for dinner or wash her hands or not to get up and dance during dinner... And then lose my rag. Last weekend I was sobbing by 11.30 am as after 4 hours of it I felt broken. She also lies, frankly, continuously about anything that she thinks she can do there is also a continuous stream of tall tales that I actually don't know what to make of. She is very bright I can see that, (working at greater depth in all areas, always has) so is she just running rings around me?
I genuinely do not understand what is going on. Is this disrupted attachment as she experienced a lot of distress going between homes when a little baby, which I feel terrible about but was court ordered? Is she just a cheeky kid who is getting away with what she can with me? Is this some form of pda or odd?
Or am I just a crap parent?
When I have asked her in a calm moment when we are just relaxing together she says its just with me and dad and she doesn't like how we boss her around.
Any help much appreciated!

OP,
She has told you what the problem is she is really unhappy about the house sharing. She wishes she could live in one house. You have said she is really struggling with it.
I can’t imagine the constant feeling of having to move between houses all the time to have things at one house that I might forget and have left by mistake at the other house. To have different rules and expectations. To cope with one very rigid parent who allows 2 week toy removal and endless sobbing. Then another more wishy washy parent who suddenly explodes. Also how did you and your ex parent cohesively when you didn’t talk for 4 years. If I was an adult I think I would develop mental health problems let alone a 6 year old.
Try and imagine, really imagine what it is like to be her, juggling all that as well as coping and performing at school. I would be so stressed all the time.
You need to stop exploding no matter what, you need to stop nearly being in tears, you need to be something constant and reassuring and mirror back at her something safe and calm. I think her perceived defiance is an attempt to try and control something in her environment.
She doesn’t like the way she has to live and she is trying to protest it.

I would agree that she is probably upset at changing houses, but I don't believe that she has any kind of disorder. ( I'm waiting for the post which suggests she may be autistic.)
She needs firm control. If she's refusing to wash her hands before dinner, then no dinner until she has done it.
Similarly, getting up and dancing during a meal should result in the meal being taken away. She will soon learn.

Ok, your problem is the "losing your rag", "sobbing" and then apologising.
My mother was exactly the same, and I behaved the same way with her as your DD does with you. My parents argued a lot, never agreed on anything, there were no clear rules, no consistency, no one who was really in charge. Just lots of "do this", then I would refuse, then there would be lots of ineffectual shouting. I couldn't abide seeing my mother cry, it gave me the rage. But I was well behaved for other adults. This is the situation you're in now.

It may not be a popular view these days, but IMO what children need is leadership - at least one of the parents needs to be a clear authority figure. That means setting clear rules and expectations, with consequences for not complying. Don't "suggest" or ask, tell her outright what she needs to do and when. Don't apologise and don't backtrack. It's important to stay calm - getting angry shows you've lost control of the situation - but do enforce consequences. I know it sounds draconian, but it doesn't have to be...you can be firm and fair rather than harsh. Calm, firm leadership makes children feel secure. They might say they don't want to be "bossed around" but actually it's pretty unsettling for them to feel like no one's in charge. I agree it's not great for her to be moving between two houses with different rules in each one, but there's not much you can do about that, so just focus on your own parenting and leave the ex to his.

It may not be a popular view these days, but IMO what children need is leadership - at least one of the parents needs to be a clear authority figure. That means setting clear rules and expectations, with consequences for not complying. Don't "suggest" or ask, tell her outright what she needs to do and when. Don't apologise and don't backtrack. It's important to stay calm - getting angry shows you've lost control of the situation - but do enforce consequences. I know it sounds draconian, but it doesn't have to be...you can be firm and fair rather than harsh.
100% agree with this. I am a retired teacher with over 30 years of experience. How could schools cope if children were allowed to refuse to obey, or how would school lunches work if children were allowed to get up from the table and dance? It wouldn't work.
Half the trouble is that in today's world, no child is ever 'naughty.' There always has to be some mental problem that means the naughtiness is excused and has to be somehow 'managed.'

@aprilanne

This is why shared care doesn't work for very small children .sorry I know it was court ordered but do these court folk not understand children need a permanent home and not shoved from pillar to post every week and not to actually have a main home is got to be traumatizing .no wonder she us acting out .PDA is an actial developmental health condition. Usually linked to autism ..I feel sorry for her and you

My child had shared care from 5 yrs old. She is now a very well adjusted mother of 2 who is very vocal about how the arrangements we had were the best in the situation. Conversely her best friend growing up saw her dad every other week, missed him terribly and ended up committing suicide aged 16.

Your comment is incorrect and far too general.

I agree with Chocho I think you can set clear boundaries and seem calm and composed. I think she is testing you in fairly normal ways but you are responding with losing your rag, sobbing and then apologizing. I think you can be firm with clear consequences and most importantly consistent. It can be done with kindness it doesn’t have to be draconian in anyway. I do think children find parents that seem out of control very unsettling.

@nanbread I’ve been dealing with demand avoidance for a loooong time. I struggle with it myself too. 🤣

Any anxious child will benefit from the advice given freely in this thread, even those without a SEN diagnosis. If we as the parent change our phrasing/demands/mode of punishment, eventually ground will be gained and everyone gets a more peaceful life. My child with ASD has come on leaps and bounds in the last year. People used to say I was babying them by removing demands, that they’d never fit in, they’d never be independent. Maybe they won’t, but the difference in them at age 6 and now age 13 is vast.

This is so incredibly sad.

She's six. Six . And for her whole life has had to deal with conflict between her parents. And now has no base, as she has to split herself between two places.

And has a mother who thinks that her playing with dolls is regressive, as opposed to completely normal and age appropriate.

And who seems determined to label and find something wrong with her.

Don't put so much pressure on her. Parent her but also play with her. Don't put more pressure on her to demonstrate how you should show her you love her. Most adults cannot articulate that. Let alone a six year old.

And just spend time with her. Just you two. Lots and lots and lots of time

Why do you apologise for shouting? You really don't have to.

and the fact that she is doing well as school just reinforces the message that she is not happy and finds living in two homes difficult

ODD is very rare and usually associated with quite extreme trauma in early childhood. It also usually shows itself in school.
She's smart. Smart enough to understand consequences.

Maybe get up and dance with her at dinner (talk to her about restaurants/clubs where adults do this
Which restaurants are you going to? I've never been to a restaurant where adults are expected to get up and dance. Not helpful advice.

@ufucoffee

Why do you apologise for shouting? You really don't have to.

If someone lost their rag and really shouted at you, would you want an apology?

I would feel hurt and scared even as an adult if someone properly shouted at me.

I think apologising appropriately models the right behaviour.

@Falaffeleybollocks

Thanks all. We have to try very hard to present a united front now as for a long time ie about 4 years it was a struggle for us to speak to one another. But we do now.

The week is split in half and she goes between houses with her older brother and at my house my partner lives as well, with whom she has a positive relationship and he backs me up 100 per cent.

What happens when you ask/tell her to do something and she says No?

What consequences?

@Lovelanguedoc

I would agree that she is probably upset at changing houses, but I don't believe that she has any kind of disorder. ( I'm waiting for the post which suggests she may be autistic.) She needs firm control. If she's refusing to wash her hands before dinner, then no dinner until she has done it. Similarly, getting up and dancing during a meal should result in the meal being taken away. She will soon learn.

^This.

She's not in charge

OP,
Trying to move between two parents with very different parenting styles must be very hard. I think you need to have a proper touch base with her in the first few hours after she arrives when you said she seems amenable and happy.
Play one to one with her, do something physical that gets rid of some of the tension of the changeover. Don’t just expect her to fit seamlessly into the bustle of what’s going on in your lives. When she arrives give her some real quality time, help her to burn off some nervous energy. Above all work on your way of managing conflict with her without shouting and crying.

She needs to be able to lean on you and to challenge you in these very straight forward ways without you breaking down. I am not saying that occasionally a child's behaviour can’t reduce a mum to tears but I would imagine the child would need to be exhibiting much more extreme behaviour and the times of the mum actually crying in front of the child would be very rare, not habitual.
Children, whether they show it or not become incredibly distressed by their parents crying. She really doesn’t need to carry anymore burdens of how her parents feel. I think you need to work on helping her cope with acting out by supporting her by good boundaries and calm direction.

@CaraherEIL
At no point have I suggested or implied that I cry often I front of my children. It was a one off.

Thanks to all posters who made really helpful, non judgemental and well informed suggestions.

@Falaffeleybollocks

Yes *@aprilanne* I agree - I wish it could have been different and it broke my heart to be away from her. I can't bear to think what she might have gone through but I have to tell myself exh wanted them very badly and has always been loving to both, although I have always personally experiebded him as cold, lacking in warmth and coercively controlling to intimate partners, ie me and then my successor.

The problem is your xH.

That’s who needs diagnosing not your DD. He will be cold, controlling and authoritarian (because that’s who he is) to them so that they are fearful and anxious walking on eggshells with him. She comes home and is allowed to breathe and pushes all of the boundaries that constrained her with her Dad. Her behaviour is a normal reaction to a his dominance. I would choose to show her the warmth, flexibility, fun and laid back light heartedness that she doesn’t get at his. She must be emotionally exhausted. Proactively put in loads of TLC and positivity alongside firm and fair consequences.

OP you seem defensive, I think it’s unrealistic to not acknowledge that your behaviour might be feeding in some part your daughters behaviour.
I can’t really be ill informed as all the information I have has been provided by you.
You said you were sobbing and felt broken which made it seem more of a pattern of behaviour that had developed rather than a one off and a number of other posters read it that way too.
Sometimes uncomfortable truths can be helpful too, even if they are not always pleasant to acknowledge.
No judgement at all, genuine observations from your posts.

I know I posted earlier but OP.

She's 6. She's tiny.

She's in a really difficult situation for a child.

Why does it matter if she dances during dinner?
You say she defies you all the time but how many things can she be defiant about.

The speed to think oh yes maybe she's got xyz behavioural problem?. Why?

She's just a little girl who wants your attention. Yes she is attention seeking. But that's not always a bad thing surely. She's been away from you. She wants you to make a fuss of her. She wants to make sure you want her and love her.

Put the love languages stuff to one side. Do stuff like. I dunno.

The day you're back from dad's let's have your favourite tea. What would you like? And make sure you do it.

If she dances say you know. Wow that dancing looks fab tell you what I'd like to see it properly after dinner. Is there a song you do that dance to?

And you find the shit song and you pretend she's on the stage and you clap a lot and then you shout encore and ask her to do it again.

And then you tell her you really enjoyed it and you give her a big hug and you go and play babies for half an hour.

No? Everything she's doing just sounds like she wants her mum to show her she loves her and is interested. And in the situation it's totally understandable.