When your mother blames the woman...

[anxietyaunt]

My mother is... something else. She’s never been much of an advocate for women’s rights. I’ve always known this so I shouldn’t be affected by some of her comments, but I am.

Despite being a smart woman and (allegedly) knowing the statistics around domestic violence against women, she can’t help herself. She thinks courts are unfairly biased towards women. That women should “stop carrying on” and sort things out themselves. “Deal with it.” “Stop making things up and ruining lives.”

This woman raised me. Sorry, not sure what my AIBU is, but I’m so incredible saddened by it all.

And what does your father think about domestic violence?

My MIL (now deceased), one of my favourite women, nevertheless blamed women for how they dressed if they were attacked. She also used to say that she had to put up with sexual harassment in the workplace so what was so special about anyone else. It was just one of those things.

Sigh

@Oenanthe

And what does your father think about domestic violence?

They’re separated. He’s made some very questionable comments himself, but he doesn’t carry on and on about it to me like she does. She knows my stance yet insists on ranting me to me. @Oenanthe

I sympathise. My Mother of a similar ilk.
I have stopped trying.

My Mum too. Keeps blaming my sister for the fact BIL has left. Its very tiresome.

Maybe there is something personal to it.

I know someone who says people are all snowflakes now and people shouldn't be so sensitive about words. As a child his brother said awful things to him. I think he can't accept his brother was emotionally abusive so he says all verbal abuse isn't serious.

Maybe it's all about one specific case that she can't make sense of. I think when people keep returning to a topic with someone who doesn't agree with them, there's usally something unresolved for them. They can't look at it straight on but they can't let it drop either.

Same here, it’s always the woman. She also constantly comments on the appearance of women on tv.

I think internalised misogyny really hit that generation hard.

My mum too, we've had some awful rows about it. Now I just walk away when she starts 😒

My take on it is that women like this have dealt with their fear and vulnerability by conjuring in their minds some sort of control, i.e. "if I behave myself, I'll be safe".

There's nothing you can do except refuse to listen to it.

Sounds like my mother.
She doesn't believe in equal pay or women's rights. She thinks men are better at most things.
When I asked for her help in my early 20s because my OH was physically abusing me- punching me in the face, throwing me against a wall etc, she told me I must try not to annoy him so much.

She knows my stance yet insists on ranting me to me.

You don't have to sit and listen to her rant on and on tho. Say firmly - yes mum, you've said all this before, let's agree to disagree and change the subject. And if she won't let it lie, leave the conversation.

This is my DM too.

She believes firmly in 'girl jobs' and 'man's work'.

She refuses to try and get the lid off a jar because "that's a man's job." And disagrees with female clergy, female police officers saying "it's not right."

I've tried and failed to help her see the misogyny and sexism.

My mum as well, absolutely scathing about other women and their appearance. Judges everyone by that measure.

I had a very interesting conversation with my MIL a few weeks ago. We were talking about wolf whistling in the street and other forms of micro aggressions towards women, it was shortly after Sarah Everard had been murdered. She said she had sort of liked being whistled at as a young woman, she is 79 now. I explained that the men that did it saw her as an object only. They were not interested in her brain, her views on anything and anything she had to say. As a person she meant nothing to them. We then had a long discussion.

It’s easy for people to understand that rape and murder are bad but the smaller stuff, the insidious stuff in society that is ingrained. My Grandmother was born in a time when not long before their Grandmothers had literally been chattel and belonged to their husbands. When my MIL married in the 1960’s many companies that women worked for would not employ them and they had to give up work. People will say my Mother or Grandmother was not like this but ideas take a time to trickle down. I personally remember as a very young woman the comments made by Judge Pickles. He did us a favour because it bought the issue out in to the open on just how little women can be valued and not get fair treatment.

She had a real lightbulb moment and said she had never ever thought about it like that.

We may get exasperated with the older generation but we have to remember the sort of conditioning they had. I am in my fifties, things are improving but when I told my sons girlfriend that men could rape their wives without fear of prosecution right up till 1991 she was completely shocked.

I’m not sure how your discussions progress. I find in any debate quote hard facts, do not give in to emotion. When quoting ask rhetorical questions of the other person. I used to do a lot of public speaking on women’s and ethnic minority employment rights and helped write a local Governments equalities policy so am confident.

Remember to also feel sympathy for women that feel like this, they may be part of the problem but to live their whole life feeling so much lesser than men must be awful for them.

*Same here, it’s always the woman. She also constantly comments on the appearance of women on tv.

I think internalised misogyny really hit that generation hard.

Yes, the internalised misogyny is so dangerous.
I was brought up to think women were my enemies, my competition. My mother insists on a male hairdresser, as "women will always give you a bad cut as they want you to look uglier than them".

*Remember to also feel sympathy for women that feel like this, they may be part of the problem but to live their whole life feeling so much lesser than men must be awful for them.

Is it though? They have a choice whether to be a hapless handmaiden.
My mother wouldn;t have it any other way. She gets to duck out of adult responsibility and be a 6 year old forever.

Mine too! She has never experienced sexual harassment or sexism (she says! Personally I don't think she can have avoided sexism she just didn't see it). I was shocked to hear her dismissing women's claims. she's an intelligent woman who did a professional job before retiring.

Yup my mum too. My favourite is 'but women use sex' in reference to her friends son accused of rape at Oxford uni.

Yes mother of course the promising young Oxford female student made it up...

My mum is similar. Not with views towards domestic violence but for example thinks women shouldn't be allowed to change working ours after having children or get paid maternity leave, she didnt (because she didnt work) so why should anyone else get a year off with 9m pay? She also says she'd never hire a woman of child bearing age...like me mother? Drives me mad. In used to it but tell her to br quiet around my dds.

She had really bad depression as a sahm but is a martyr and thinks she did what was best and every woman should do it

Can so relate to the messages on this thread (Gen -Xer). Internalised misogyny was very much a thing. My mum used to say of successful women 'one of those oh-so-very EFFICIENT women'' with a real bitter contempt in her voice. My father didn't like women being in the public sphere at all.

It’s interesting isn’t it, you say your mum always blames the women and yet you say your mum is worse than your dad, do you think you have been influenced at all?

Very sad but sadly I doubt your DM is alone.

We may get exasperated with the older generation but we have to remember the sort of conditioning they had.

My Grandmothers did not believe that women should go out to work, earn money, drive or fix anything. It was the man’s job.They had 15-20 years of being SAHMs and it suited them to remain so long long after their DC left home.

Its very common. I think some women are so shocked by rape, domestic violence etc that they could not accept that these things could happen to anyone. They cannot cope with the fact that they could be innocently dragged from the street, so they have to victim blame. It must have been what they were wearing, she must have led him on, she shouldn't have been out so late etc, etc. This way she has a sense of security that these crimes will never happen to her. Look at how many parent blamed the McCann parents for what happened to their daughter.

This is only evidence that misogyny is so engrained in society. If younger generations on the whole have a different view it's thanks to feminism alone.