Husband becomes really nasty sometimes.

[itwillcomeback]

Is it normal? When he's stressed he's very very nasty to me. Bad attitude. Tutting, being mean for no reason, just the 'humph' attitude. Today he was throwing a hissy fit because 'I have too much stuff'. We're looking to renovate and moving out and even though I try to always stay a step ahead and tidy and box things up, there are some things that I simply did not have the time for. We have young children too.

When we first moved he did the same. When we have visitors around. Or when we're fixing something. I've also noticed he does it more around his family members. Almost like he's trying to show who's boss and wears the pants.

My question is this normal and AIBU to be very sad and upset by it. It's happened so often that my anger turns to sadness. I do sometimes end up taking it out on my family but then explain I'm just stressed out. I feel the the happiness of doing something great even though it is stressful it's still exciting, all seems to go down the drain for me.

Before you ask if we have talked about it. Yes we have a million times. He agrees and then does it again. Today he's pretending like all is ok and just ignored me. Basically can't even look at me. He's fully aware I'm not happy.

And please MN no posting about 'leave him' etc. He's a good man. Just had his moments which I feel I need to manage. How do I talk about it and does it happen to you?

It’s bullying -

would it help to explain it to him like that, and forewarn him that if he does it again, you will walk away from him, or if in company say ‘don’t talk to me like that’ (first offence), and ‘don’t talk to me like that, we agreed it was bullying’ (second offence).

He’s not that great a man OP - especially as he is making you doubt whether this is unreasonable or not.

But if you think he’s a keeper then you have to stand up to him or it will get worse.

@SkodaKodiaq

What do you hope to gain from this thread? A guide on how to fix him? That's not possible.

Nobody is going to tell you how to 'manage' an abusive husband (yes, from what you have described, he IS abusive) and if nobody is permitted to advise you to leave him, then what else is there to say? The only advice any woman with even a modicum of decency or conscience could possibly give you, is to leave.

I'm sorry. I know (like many, many other women) what it's like to still be deeply in love with a man who is abusive. It's hard as fuck, frankly. Especially when they're AMAZING the rest of the time. Especially when you cannot even begin to imagine life without them, without quivering and tears building. I get it.

However this will NOT improve. You either live like this for the rest of your life - when the nastiness is almost certainly going to increase, the older he gets - or you walk away and set yourself and your children free.....

This.

I was in a relationship with an apparently good man, lots and lots of laudable things about him; but he was a bit controlling .. and he had a temper and nasty mouth when he "lost his temper". The temper cropped up only occasionally (often in relation to the controlling/jealous/insecure aspect).

I stayed in the relationship foe nearly a year and a half, his behaviour has become obvious three months in .... I talked and talked and talked, he responded, he sat with tears in his eyes once, he said he would try to stop acting like that ....

Did he stop?

The fuck he did.

It is a choice .. and behind that choice is a set of values, of entitlement .. ultimately he felt he was in the right and he felt entitled to act like that, so why would he have stopped. He'd have needed to develop a totally different set of values, but he wouldn't/couldn't .. by mid 40s that was set in stone, and from listening to him it was obvious he was exactly the same as he's been as a young man.

They won't change or stop because they're worried that way, and because their values make them believe they're entitled to act that way.

*wired that way

And you can't manage them.- forget about it, you can't manage any adult, especially one who's bigger and stronger than you (oh and he sounds like he wants to be dominant too from what you said about the behaviour in front of his family. That is really significant; it's linked to how he sees himself, you, the relationship ... It's no coincidence that he feels compelled to show he's dominant in front of others, and also treats you like crap when he's "stressed" ... He thinks you're his punch bag, he thinks you're his inferior.

Baffling you think that what Countrycode said was mean and pulled her up on it, but you’re happy to accept the man who should love you above all others treat you like shit and humiliate you in front of his family.

What you’ve described is not normal and it’s not fixable. It’ll get worse as he gets older and you’ll be even less able to address it. You know that.

As you won’t leave, I suggest couples counselling and anger management for him.

And he thinks you're going nowhere .... And unless you totally change your thinking & attitude from this thread; he's absolutely correct.

I suggest couples counselling and anger management for him

Couples counseling is not appropriate for an abusive relationship - which this is regardless of frequency.

Anger management is inappropriate because he does not have anger issues.
Does he treat others especially those he is dependant on/subject to like this - I doubt it. If he did he'd probably not hold down jobs or get in trouble with authority figures etc. Most jobs are stressful; how come he doesn't act like this at work if he's got anger management issues.

He knows exactly where to focus his "anger".

His "I'm the boss" behaviour in front of family etc is extremely telling too.

As Lundy Bancroft wrote "he doesn't have a problem with his anger: he has s problem with your anger" is the woman is not allowed to be angry, the woman is to take whatever is thrown at her, the woman has no equal rights in the relationship.

You have young children? Would you like them to treat their partner like this, or be treated like this in 20-30 years time. They are learning that this is normal. What if he starts being like this with them as they grow up?

My old boss used to say that you 'will get the treatment you accept'. If you want to change this, have the flight with him, do it in front of his family. Lose your embarrassment around it. When he starts, walk away. Refuse to accept this.

If he doesn't lose his cool in front of other people...then it's 100% what others are saying. He's not a good man who loses it from time to time...he is in control, he does it with you and only you because he can get away with it and he wants to keep you in your place.

And think about it OP, when you're angry with anyone do you want to hurt, humiliate and devastate them? No. Because you're not nasty. He isn't 'nasty sometimes'. He is nasty.

He's nasty to people he thinks are weaker, smaller and / or unlikely to react. You've shown him he's correct, what about when he turns on the kids?

He doesn't do this to male friends, coworkers, bosses, men when he's out and about etc I would guess?

He's a nasty coward who abuses his wife.

By staying you are teaching your kids that this is what a relationship is supposed to look like. Even if you tell them different, that's what you're showing them. That is their truth.

Then I would have to deal with a huge argument and embarrassment in front of his family which I try to avoid. (They would love to see us in such a situation).

It sounds like there's also an element of staying with him to sort of 'prove people wrong' who would enjoy you having problems. Don't sacrifice your children's future relationships to make a point to his shitty family. It's incredibly unfair.

And OP, I'd love to know what constitutes a "bad man"?
If a good one is nasty, bullying, and likes to humiliate his wife in front of his family.

Perhaps think about how much you are trying to convince yourself this nasty pig is a decent human being.

Your poor children growing up witnessing that.

He's not really a good man who just has his moments.

He's a man who has a really, really bad habit, which is corroding the relationship and sucking the joy out of his partner's life.

He's a man who has no incentive to change until you make it clear to him that the alternative is him packing his bags.

Do you want to be treated as an emotional punching bag for the duration of your relationship or do you want him to treat you with the respect and consideration you believed him capable of when you committed to him and he to you? You are not a garbage can into which he can dump all the negativity he indulges in.

If you want a different outcome to the conversations you have about this you need to change whatever it is that you are saying.

Good men don’t behave this way, not two or three times a year, not at all. Please don’t allow your children to think this is what a healthy relationship looks like.

He sounds like an arse, definitely not a good man.
There is no way I would put up with that, and if standing up for myself led to a public argument then so be it. I would not be embarrassed because it's him acting like an arse, not you.
Agree with PP, if you want a different outcome you will have to change the way you respond. No one should accept being treated badly.

He wouldn't speak to his boss like that, a policeman like that, a friend like that would he?
He magically manages to control himself I'm sure.

You're not a punching bag OP.

To have your opinions scoffed at, the things you love mocked and sneered at by a racist, mysogynist, homophobic controlling bully until your self esteem is zero . Then he died suddenly and my life began. It is like a heavy weight being lifted from you

Only pathetic little runts of men need to show who wears the pants!

You can’t manage these moments because you can’t manage someone else’s behaviour and also because he’s behaving this way to have a very specific effect on you. I know you probably say to yourself it’s just a loss of temper because he’s stressed. But if you’re generally the one that’s on the receiving end of it, and not anyone with whom he knows he’d have something to lose (his boss, a policeman, even a bigger bloke in the pub) then it’s clearly not spontaneous. He’s doing it because he can, and it’s designed to make himself feel bigger by making you feel small. My mum had a relationship like this, and I know it’s been mentioned a lot on this thread but I can’t exaggerate the damage it did to us as kids, even though we were painfully aware at the time that the dynamic was unhealthy. In fact we’re still unpicking the fallout now, decades later. It was horrendous watching my mum make herself smaller and smaller as all her energy went into tiptoeing around managing his moods, as he dismantled her self esteem and even her sense of reality bit by bit. We literally begged her to leave, but he’d done such a job on her she thought she wasn’t capable and no-one else would ever want her as she was supposedly so broken (utter tosh by the way). Just because it’s not happening every day doesn’t mean it’s not massively damaging. And consciously or not, these men know they have to be nice sometimes to keep you in a sense of limbo. You’re obviously aware than something is wrong or you wouldn’t be posting on here, but men like this utterly mess with your sense of what is acceptable behaviour or not. You say you’re adamant you won’t leave but may I ask why?

Thanks all. All your responses have given me ALOT to think about. I genuinely thought it was ok. Reading all your comments made me re-read what I wrote. Like I made it sound worse than it is. But no. It is as I wrote it. I've always told him to mind his attitude. Be aware of his mannerism towards me and others. I've had issues in the past where it's been blatantly obvious to guests and he just embarrassed me. I always then felt the need to cover his behaviour.

I just want to 'keep the peace' whatever the hell that is and so don't speak when it's actually happening. Time to time I do then mirror his behaviour so will shout back at him instead of actually storming out or questioning his behaviour in front of others. So we end up looking like a bitching couple that no one wants to be around.

if he does it again in front of his relatives I would personally let rip and wipe the floor with him in front of them.
I would not ever be putting up with that.

That’s not an acceptable way to live, he vowed to love, honour, cherish and protect you and he’s not doing any of that, he’s abusing you, it’s an active choice that he enjoys by its very existence. There’s no reason to accept it and if you have a kid, it’s child abuse to make them live in a home with an abuser. I speak as a child whose mother chose abusive males over my safety and happiness and security.

Plus, the only point of a relationship is that it’s meant to be fun, it’s meant to enhance your life. This dude is just a bog standard, tedious aggressive male.

Sorry OP his behaviour is not normal, no. It’s controlling and abusive.

Op i highly recommend you read "why does he do that, inside the minds of angry men" (or words to that effect) by Lundy Bancroft.

It's quite American and not perfect (what is) but it is a very interesting & enlightening read. It's primarily about physical abusers but covers all types.

The "abuser profiles" and "myths about abuse" are excellent.

It dismantles every excuse we give and that men give themselves about abusive behaviour.

If you want a different outcome to the conversations you have about this you need to change whatever it is that you are saying.

If my experience is anything to go by, op.can say a hundred different points in a hundred different ways ... And he won't (permanently) change. All you'll get from ultimatums is a temporary hiatus. It'll be back to his MO sooner or later.

Because he wants to act that way, because he believes he's entitled to act that way etc.