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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

"I Wanna Be Like You"

274 replies

SpottyOrange · 13/05/2021 16:33

Not sure if this is an AIBU but is that song from the jungle book racist?!
Yes: it's dated and awful
No: don't be daft

OP posts:
SimonJT · 13/05/2021 17:06

@murmurflation

Other than being crows, they're not racist I would have thought. The crows are intelligent and good-natured, unlike the elephants and humans who are white and deeply unpleasant.
The main crow is called Jim Crow. Jim Crow is presented as intelligent, good natured etc. The character is a celebration of Jim Crow.

Its the same as having a character called Hitler who is intelligent, good natured etc.

Tullyjune · 13/05/2021 17:06

@BilboBercow

Lots of Disney films are racist. Have you watched Pinocchio received or Dumbo?
What’s in Pinocchio? All I remember is an island of terrifying donkey children and being swallowed by a whale? I think I must have blocked most of that terrifying film from my memory.
Honeycombskl · 13/05/2021 17:07

look at the lion king, pale lions good, brave, strong and loyal, dark lions bad, weak, untrustworthy.
That's interesting that you use the lion king as an example because if I was imagining them in human form I always associated Mufasa's pride more with the black commmunity due to the voice of James Earl Jones and Scar's pride as being white English due to Jeremy Irons' voice.

KittyKatChonky · 13/05/2021 17:09

pale lions good, brave, strong and loyal, dark lions bad, weak, untrustworthy

Jesus Christ, do disney add a warning to The Lion King now?

murmurflation · 13/05/2021 17:09

Was Jim Crow an actual person like Hitler?

whiteblinds · 13/05/2021 17:10

@KittyKatChonky

pale lions good, brave, strong and loyal, dark lions bad, weak, untrustworthy

Jesus Christ, do disney add a warning to The Lion King now?

No because Simon is talking out of his/her arse
whiteblinds · 13/05/2021 17:10

@murmurflation

Was Jim Crow an actual person like Hitler?
Omg.
LongPauseNoAnswer · 13/05/2021 17:10

Good fucking gods, just fuck off with this hyperPC shite.

I am thoroughly SICK of the whole thing

LittleRa · 13/05/2021 17:12

I’ve noticed there’s a warning message at the beginning of Disney films on Disney+ that contain racist stereotypes- I saw it at the beginning of Peter Pan, in which the portrayal of “red indians” is Shock

SimonJT · 13/05/2021 17:12

@murmurflation

Was Jim Crow an actual person like Hitler?
Jim Crow is a character (minstrel), its still used as a slur against black people, the segregation laws were named after Jim Crow. Hitlers policies and those under Jim Crow laws are very very similar.
Tal45 · 13/05/2021 17:13

He wants to be like man so he can make fire - sounds pretty ambitious to me.....and I'm pretty sure African Americans already had fire. Certainly there are racist things in some of the films, typical of the attitudes of the time but I think saying the oragutan is lazy (not sure where, as I said seems ambitious to me) and so must depict African Americans is really clutching at straws. And his linguistic skills are no less than Baloo's as far as I'm concerned and Baloo is far lazier - but I guess he's not a monkey/ape so he escapes this ridiculous criticism.

BrumBoo · 13/05/2021 17:13

@LongPauseNoAnswer

Good fucking gods, just fuck off with this hyperPC shite.

I am thoroughly SICK of the whole thing

So what part of historical racism do you enjoy and want to preserve the most?
whiteblinds · 13/05/2021 17:15

My friend's brother and his husband have mixed race children. Her brother in law had a massive go at her when she affectionately called one of the children 'cheeky monkey'.

Ridiculous. I call my son that all the time!!

murmurflation · 13/05/2021 17:17

That's what I thought, it's a slang term for black people that was used for racist legislation. I don't get that having a black character who is intelligent and a crow is saying that the Jim Crow laws were intelligent. I agree that the fact the characters are crows is still a bit uncomfortable but I also don't think anyone nowadays associates them with racist laws from the past.

littlepeas · 13/05/2021 17:20

Yes, it’s racist! I’m very surprised people didn’t realise Confused. I still watched it with my dc though. On the other hand, Dumbo is horrifying and upsetting in many ways - I don’t understand how anyone can enjoy it.

SimonJT · 13/05/2021 17:22

@murmurflation

That's what I thought, it's a slang term for black people that was used for racist legislation. I don't get that having a black character who is intelligent and a crow is saying that the Jim Crow laws were intelligent. I agree that the fact the characters are crows is still a bit uncomfortable but I also don't think anyone nowadays associates them with racist laws from the past.
It isn’t a slang term for black people, just as n*gger isn’t, its an extremely racist term.

So you think the representation of the Jim Crow laws being helpful and intelligent/clever isn’t problematic?

murmurflation · 13/05/2021 17:23

Dumbo is horrifying and upsetting, mostly in good ways I think. The one scene I really don't think they would make nowadays ( and rightly) is the one where Dumbo gets drunk.

SimonJT · 13/05/2021 17:24

@murmurflation

Dumbo is horrifying and upsetting, mostly in good ways I think. The one scene I really don't think they would make nowadays ( and rightly) is the one where Dumbo gets drunk.
Hang on, so they rightly wouldn’t have a drunk Dumbo, but they can glorify racism?
murmurflation · 13/05/2021 17:26

Simon, I really don't think they made the crows clever as a statement that the Jim Crow laws were clever. I am willing to change my mind on that if you can give me some receipts, but even if that is the case, I don't think anyone would read it that way nowadays.

Tullyjune · 13/05/2021 17:27

I always found the drunk scene in Dumbo uncomfortable and disturbing as a child. It definitely showed intoxication as a negative and scary experience. Which isn’t as problematic as the crows, which are racist.

AccidentallyOnPurpose · 13/05/2021 17:27

"I want to be like you"

The movie came out in 1968 at a time when the fight against segregation was still going on.

De jure segregation mandated the separation of races by law, and was the form imposed by slave codes before the Civil War and by Black Codes and Jim Crow laws following the war. De jure segregation was outlawed by the Civil Rights Act of 1964, the Voting Rights Act of 1965, and the Fair Housing Act of 1968.[11]

SimonJT · 13/05/2021 17:27

@murmurflation

Simon, I really don't think they made the crows clever as a statement that the Jim Crow laws were clever. I am willing to change my mind on that if you can give me some receipts, but even if that is the case, I don't think anyone would read it that way nowadays.
Its okay, we get it, you’re either a racism denier or a fan.
whiteblinds · 13/05/2021 17:29

'We get it'

Don't speak for other people it's really arrogant

Dollygirl2008 · 13/05/2021 17:29

@LongPauseNoAnswer

Good fucking gods, just fuck off with this hyperPC shite.

I am thoroughly SICK of the whole thing

This.
AgnesNaismith · 13/05/2021 17:29

How is Brave sexist? Or racist?