AIBU to think schools shouldn't promote breast binding to 11 year old girls?

[OhHolyJesus]

Article in the Times today about a top grammar school.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/913e7f94-b038-11eb-b844-593e41a4a1a5?shareToken=96489378584664b8e46495232a22b86a

From the comments you can see the parents weren't aware.

Yes shaming or ridiculing parents who raise SG concerns is a massive red flag. What's their agenda I wonder.

It also restricts the ability to exercise. Which of course is known to improve mental health. So it's a practice that isolates the child even further. While all their friends are out walking and enjoying the sun and fresh air, someone who binds may well he stuck at home In doors alone unable to participate.

This is not accurate. I have worked with plenty of young people who have safely participated in PE, extracurricular sport and other physical activities such as dance while binding. I'm not saying the school were right to send out this information at all but posting alarmist, exaggerated stuff about binding rendering kids unable to even walk and enjoy the fresh air doesn't help the cause.

The newsletter also reinforces the completely self absorbed perspective for 'spousal veto'.

My god. When people consider that their needs are so vastly more important than the person they had previously agreed to love and care for that they, and the people eager to side with them, cannot even consider the implications of legally changing their sex on a spouse and the marriage contract, you know that this movement has dehumanised anyone that disagrees.

That a school allowed this phrasing to be used, simply reinforces that they either did not read this before approving it or allowed a teacher with a distinct bias to approve it.

Why are you and your school acilitating self harm @Washimal ?

Are you a teacher? Honestly I despair.

Washimal

I think it very much depends on the binding used.

Even Mermaids themselves sought to address this very issue last Summer as they recognised that there were, in fact, some young people experiencing significant difficulties exercising while binding.

It is great though that you have not come across someone having issues.

@Washimal

It also restricts the ability to exercise. Which of course is known to improve mental health. So it's a practice that isolates the child even further. While all their friends are out walking and enjoying the sun and fresh air, someone who binds may well he stuck at home In doors alone unable to participate.

This is not accurate. I have worked with plenty of young people who have safely participated in PE, extracurricular sport and other physical activities such as dance while binding. I'm not saying the school were right to send out this information at all but posting alarmist, exaggerated stuff about binding rendering kids unable to even walk and enjoy the fresh air doesn't help the cause.

Do you not find it concerning that you have encountered not just one but apparently "plenty" of young women who are doing this to their bodies? Does that not suggest something going very wrong in our culture?

"It is great though that you have not come across someone having issues."

Well only in the same way it great that the kids who self harm haven't actually managed to do themselves serious harm. The act of binding is harmful.

@Washimal

"Despite the ubiquity of the practice, a staggering 97.2 percent of those surveyed reported at least one negative health outcome that they attributed to binding. Seventy-four percent reported pain-related concerns—the most common side effect was back pain (53.8 percent), followed by overheating (53.5 percent), chest pain (48.8 percent), shortness of breath (46.6 percent), and itching (44.9 percent). Fifty respondents even believed they had suffered from rib fractures as a result of binding."

Survey of 1,800 young women who bind. www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/13691058.2016.1191675

It's not safe, it's damaging young women's bodies. It's a horrifying practice and we shouldn't be normalising it and shrugging our shoulders. We have an epidemic of young women who hate their breasts.

If my 11 year old was sent a newsletter promoting self harm and linking to sites promoting chemsex and fisting I would be absolutely furious. I think I'd have to withdrew my DD from the school due to the schools attitude to these which I consider to be safeguarding failures.

@2fallsagain

"It is great though that you have not come across someone having issues."

Well only in the same way it great that the kids who self harm haven't actually managed to do themselves serious harm. The act of binding is harmful.

I know this quite well. I had to explain to my teen just why binding is not 'just like wearing a corset' and the extend of the dangers that their friends are potentially doing to their bodies. Particularly since they are getting them delivered to their friends houses so their parents don't know.

Obviously there are many reasons why Washimal has not had an incident that they know about yet. For instance, the young females involved may well be removing binders for their sports. Or be loosening them. or whatever. It would be very interesting to know what Washimal would do if there was an incident from wearing a binder. What then?

I suppose my question is why are schools allowing girls to wear them at all?

@2fallsagain schools cannot really mandate what students wear under their uniforms as long as it doesn’t show on top. I think you can imagine a school saying anything about what a girl should wear on her breasts would get into a lot of trouble.

PS. This is not me advocating bonding before people attack me but it cannot ever be banned by schools obviously.

So the answer then I take it is to restrict pe lessons or have some kind.of two tier pe lesson system to ensure equal participation which will be no doubt to the detriment of the girls involved. Sport is great fir health and mental health. There's a massive issue with girls dropping out of sports at puberty. And reduced opportunities as they don't get the qualified coaches or the funding etc

Its yet another obstacle placed in the way of girls that has awful consequences bit schools are actively encouraging

[quote cinammonbuns]@2fallsagain schools cannot really mandate what students wear under their uniforms as long as it doesn’t show on top. I think you can imagine a school saying anything about what a girl should wear on her breasts would get into a lot of trouble.

PS. This is not me advocating bonding before people attack me but it cannot ever be banned by schools obviously.[/quote]
I recognise that. However, Schools can and should be very unequivocal about the fact they do not support or recommend their use because they are damaging.

To see a teacher saying "all the girls who bind don't have any problems" in such a blasé way is horrifying.

I had to explain to my teen just why binding is not 'just like wearing a corset' and the extend of the dangers that their friends are potentially doing to their bodies.

Is that how it's being talked about, normalising a binder as underwear?

Also weren't contests shown to be very harmful to a woman's body and health, based in the fact this is made internal organs moved around, all for a certain atheistic 'look'?

Oh yes. I got the entire ‘it is just like a corset’ spiel. And told to remember how women worked in corsets doing manual labour and how they were ok....

Beyond sick of this nonsense. I'm genuinely considering homeschooling when mine are secondary age because of shit like this.

@OhHolyJesus

Article in the Times today about a top grammar school.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/913e7f94-b038-11eb-b844-593e41a4a1a5?shareToken=96489378584664b8e46495232a22b86a

From the comments you can see the parents weren't aware.

It didn't promote breast binding. It didn't even mention it. But one of the links in the newsletter led to a webpage which tasks about it.

The print media is shit, and people who go onto social media and misrepresent further what's already been misrepresented, are behind the amount of conflict and anger in the UK right now.

This is the new emo and self harming that you saw in girls the last couple of decades, often a visceral response or reaction to puberty. Imagine a school teaching how to cut yourself safely.

No, schools should not ignore the mental health needs of dc but this is not the way Imo.

@TheGumption It's well worth considering home ed. I am so happy that my daughter is spared this sort of crap.

@saraclara one of the "queer questions" is "How do I bind safely".

'A tightly laced corset could reduce lung capacity, irritate skin, and weaken back and chest muscles used to being supported.2 Whether tight lacing caused long-term health issues, like reduced pelvis size, constipation and digestive issues, and reproductive problems ranging from miscarriage to uterine prolapse, is more difficult to assess and remains unclear.2,4,7'

nyamcenterforhistory.org/2015/05/29/did-corsets-harm-womens-health/

'Women were often laced so tightly their breathing was restricted leading to faintness. Compressing the abdominal organs could cause poor digestion and over time the back muscles could atrophy. In fact, long term tight lacing led to the rib cage becoming deformed. The Hunterian Museum has an example of a rib cage showing damage caused by tight lacing. Doctors labelled these symptoms as Chlorosis or ‘green sickness’ and Anaemia. Blood counts were taken and patients given pills to treat the symptoms.'

www.rcseng.ac.uk/library-and-publications/library/blog/effects-of-the-corset/

Of course there's not much recent research on corset wearing, because it's not really a thing anymore. So the studies involved are quite old.