To think that a Rape Crisis centre should not have a transwoman CEO?

[ArabellaScott]

Mridhul Wadhwa has just been appointed CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis. The job was advertised as for women only. Mridhul is a transwoman (born male) without a Gender Recognition Certificate.

AIBU to think that women survivors of rape and sexual violence should be able to have a female only space?

theedinburghreporter.co.uk/2021/05/new-boss-for-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre/

@everybodysang

It's not an issue. She'll be an excellent CEO. YABU, however, for bringing your trans-bashing out of the Feminism boards. And I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks so. MN isn't just for transphobes.

How do you know they will be excellent ?

Utterly, utterly sick of all this trans stuff on Mumsnet.

@RedRec

Utterly, utterly sick of all this trans stuff on Mumsnet.

There's plenty on MN that I don't read, like conception threads. Just don't read what you're not interested in. Same as every other forum.

@RedRec

Utterly, utterly sick of all this trans stuff on Mumsnet.

I'm utterly sick of people arguing that people with penises should be allowed in women's only spaces but there we are. (And I'm sad that the plural of penis isn't penii.)

I agree.. this person should not be CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis.

This beggars belief. Disgraceful how little consideration has been given to service users. If she had any actual insight they wouldn't have applied in the first place.

For Christ’s sake. Was MW REALLY the most appropriate person for the job? No other suitable candidates with the right skills, experience and, you know, biological sex required by the job advert? Utterly ridiculous and if the comments about MW’s stance on single spaces etc are true, also very disturbing

Everytime I think this is a line crossed that will trigger a reaction from the silent majority and everytime I'm wrong.
This is incomprehensible on every level but still it is accepted. And all debate or rationale questioning is shut down with inaccurate slurs and threats, and on it goes, unchallenged with no recognition of the damage this is doing.
Where's the line?

Society is too polite.

Womens rights are going down the drain. The perceived right if a very small minority are treated as more important than women.
We are entitled to our safe space. And a job advertised for a woman should have been given to a woman.

Same thing happening in youth sports boys claiming they ID as s female and get to race girls. Nothing to do with the fact that they can't make the times on the boys teams...

Time for more ppl to stand up before its too late.

@Potteringshed

YABU to post here and not FWR which is really the proper place for yet another trans debate.

AIBU is the prefect place to ask this question and make more women aware that our rights , and those of our daughters, sisters and mothers are under threat. There is nothing wrong with women asking questions about subjects that concern them and nothing transphobic about those questions either.

@RedRec

Utterly, utterly sick of all this trans stuff on Mumsnet.

Well don’t read it then! A lot of us are fucking sick of the pandering to men in dresses that goes on and a large amount of women on here DO care about the rights of women and girls to safe spaces. What has it come to that women and girls can’t have that respected in a rape crisis Centre of all places 😡

Nearly 90% seem to think this isn’t a good thing.

And the stated philosophy of the new CEO of Edinburgh Rape Crisis is that transwomen ARE ENTITLED to cary out examinations of raped women.
This is it in a nutshell and exactly why this is wrong. It is all about their entitlement and always is. Absolutely nobody has an entitlement to examine anybody but trans activism has got so embedded in their entitlements and rights they have become blind to others.
Reasoned discussion of this is agressively dismissed and individuals and organisations targeted as transphobic.
Where is the accountability of the people who broke the law by using the equality act exemptions to advertise a position to exclude specific characteristics but then appointed from the excluded characteristics.
Would we except an exemption to advertise for a person from a minority ethnic community and then appoint a white male to the position? Of course not.

I'd have less of a problem if this was a trans man because he'd at least know what it's like to have a female body and exist as a biological woman.
Normally very happy and not really bothered about trans people one way or the other, but this is wrong. I know I would never ever access a service like this unless an XX biological female, like myself, would be the one to help me.

I think the fact that the person in question is trans is almost a separate, yet parallel issue. If this were a natal female she would still be wildly unsuitable on the basis of reported character, ethics and actions.

If a natal woman was reported:

• To look bored and be checking their phone whilst supposed to be listening to and counselling a rape survivor.
• Lied on their job application.
• Was actively involved in trying to remove the right for women and girls to request be intimately examined by a natal woman after being raped.
• Laughed when female rape survivors tried to explain why they need a natal woman to perform the intimate examinations.
• Changed political parties when their current party would not lobby for preventing women and girls requesting a natal female for intimate examinations.
• Made public comments about women orgasming and feeling pleasure whilst being raped.*

ALL of those would make the person wholly unsuitable for any position in a rape crisis centre. How on Earth could anyone argue otherwise? In this instance in makes no difference whether the person is a natal female, trans or a natal male, their character clearly could not be less suited to work of this nature.

*This can be a response to the trauma, and should never be held against the victim obviously, but the fact it is even mentioned by someone who vehemently wants to remove the right for women and girls to request a natal woman to intimately examine them paints this in an questionable light.

Reading this thread the thing that kept coming to mind is why would anyone want to remove the right for women and girls to request a natal female intimate examiner?
Anyone involved in this work, and any HCP should always be putting the patient/service user first. It is about whatever helps the patient the most, I simply cannot fathom why anyone would want to cause more trauma to suffering patients if it is within their power to prevent it.
It would also raise serious questions regarding the professional ethics of any person not putting the needs of traumatised, suffering patients/service users first.

It's really sad that the women of Scotland are so bad at their jobs that they had to appoint a male to a job that was only open to females.

Yabu, I have not bothered to name change as I have nothing to be ashamed about, but I have personal experience using a Rape centre and I could not give a shit who the CEO is, the staff who helped me were amazing and I am who I am today because of the help I got through them.

@CommunistLegoBloc

Imagine, just imagine, ringing a Rape Crisis line, and a man's voice answering.

This. MW is legally and physically male. They applied for a job advertised legally for natal women only. In previous roles they have said they do not want single sex spaces. This centre is a precious resource for the women of Edinburgh. I am frightened to think of the numbers now who may not seek help because of this. MW, the appointments panel and the board should hang their heads in shame.

@BetterKateThanNever

So *@MaxNormal, and @RufustheBadgeringReindeer*, you really think only men, or those with a penis can rape? What a silly concept.

I'm actually embarrassed for you now.

Do people really not think to check whether they have the first idea of what they are talking about before they spout their ill-informed nonsense?

It's literally written right there in the law of the land that rape is committed with a penis, so yes, we "really do" think "such a silly concept".

There’s certainly one person on this thread who likely believes in mermaids and I’m cringing for them. They come across as very ill informed and silly with no ability to back their points up.

@AfternoonToffee

I want to cry reading this thread, some people really don't care about women at all.

I'm almost numb to it now. The determination of the vocal minority to erase the concept of the biological woman, and the pervasive inability of those who blindly support this stance to apply any sort of critical thinking to the situation has more or less defeated me.

If just one person who bleats that TWAW could explain to me convincingly what a woman is if that is the case, I'd have so much more respect. But the fact that their sole response is to denounce everyone as transphobic suggests to me that there actually aren't and never will be any stronger arguments to come, and that just makes me so depressed. By all mean have a belief and support it. But to not be able to articulate a robust defence for that belief that stands up to scrutiny is just - slightly pathetic.

It's like living in a version of the Emperor's new clothes for those of us that get it: yelling into the abyss that the Emperor is naked while everyone else celebrates how stunning and brave he looks.

What can we do to challenge this? They have broken the law appointing a man into this post when men were exempt under the Equality Act. Any woman who applied for this post will have grounds to raise a grievance against Rape Crisis.

Transactivists (including Stonewall, Scottish Trans Alliance) lobbied the government hard to remove the single sex exception from Equality Act 2010. This was very close to being accepted by government. Pushback and challenge by women's grassroots groups led to the government U turn.
Detailed here by James Kirkup (July 2018)
threadreaderapp.com/thread/1004635839480164352.html?refreshed=yes

Mridul Wadhwa featured in Maria Miller's 2016 Trans Inquiry report in support of removal of this exception which uses women's rape counselling as the example whereby all males may be excluded including those who have acquired a GRC and changed their legal gender. This is used as illustration of proportionate for legitimate purpose:

(extract p31)
127. The Explanatory Notes to the [Equality] Act give the following illustration:
A counsellor working with victims of rape might have to be a woman and not a transsexual person, even if she has a Gender Recognition Certificate, in order to avoid causing them further distress.

Women’s Aid told us that:
In recognition of Women’s Aid’s status as the provider of services to, and promoting the welfare of women only, Women’s Aid has chosen to exercise its right under the Equality Act 2010 […] to apply the Gender Reassignment exception to employment posts within the organisation. This policy is under review

"We heard unequivocal opposition to this provision. The Scottish Transgender Alliance told us that they wished to see it repealed:
as well as violating trans people’s article 8 human right to privacy [under the ECHR] about their gender reassignment history, [it] is generally unworkable because the only way anyone could prove beyond doubt that they had not undergone gender reassignment would be to submit to an unacceptably intrusive medical examination.

129. The Alliance also advocated the introduction of a legal provision allowing for certain posts, “perhaps where providing support specifically to trans people”, to be available only to trans people, “as exists for other protected characteristics”.

130. Mridul Wadhwa told us that the provision was:
"discriminatory to transsexual people especially trans women. I genuinely believe that there is no space for it in the gender-based violence sector and that it has no place in violence against women work. I was unaware of its existence until a few weeks ago. I have worked in the violence against women sector since 2005 and have never known for it to be used. I am disappointed to think that someone has the right to refuse work to me and others like me in my sector just because they think that I might not be a woman."
publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201516/cmselect/cmwomeq/390/390.pdf

Utterly, utterly sick of all this trans stuff on Mumsnet

Utterly, utterly sick of women's rights being systematically destroyed to appease a small minority with extreme views in real life.