To think 'celebrating your curves' is becoming a worrying trend?

[Freesunglasses]

So many of my overweight 'friends' on facebook are joining in the whole "I'm embracing my curves and loving this body, every inch"
The thing is they are Obese, not use a little overyweight but really fat. The more people see and read things like this the more it will become normalised.

Worrying times ahead I think. We're going to be a very fat country in the not too distant future.
I know it's hard to lose weight. I know lockdown has made lots put weight, I'm a little overweight myself but I will never say I'm happy with it because I'm not! I like being thin, I want to be thin.

For the love of God stop normalising and celebrating obesity.

@AlwaysLatte

NB curves as part of a normal BMI are totally fine, of course.,

BMI isn’t a good way to track either my partner is a doctor and hates how people use it - you know most Olympic athletes would come under obese due to the amount of weight muscle mass, when clearly they are health and active.

Still waiting for somebody to give me their opinion on whether I should be allowed celebrate my 'unhealthy' chronically ill disabled body?

Or would that be frowned upon too?

Really, us sick folk should just keep quiet and keep our heads down eh? Just pretend to be 'normal' and not get in the way of the perfectly healthy people, not make them think about anything unpleasant like the realities of being sick forever?

Fuck that. I celebrate my body because it's frankly quite amazing I'm still alive - my body does a good job.

So am I allowed to celebrate or not?

Or is it only fat people that you have a problem with celebrating something that isn't optimally healthy?

@JaniieJones

'Don't use quotation marks around things I didn't say. If you can't create a valid counter-argument without accusing me of saying things that were never said then just accept that you're wrong. The vast majority of obese people don't have organ failure'

It was a new paragraph . 'Discrimination' and 'fat shaming' have been wanged on about defensively throughout.

Oh fgs of course obese people may not have organ failure (yet), but their obesity is a sign of their excess in the same way liver failure indicates a drinkers excess, and we don't congratulate those with liver failure and say it's beautiful and empowering do we now.

New paragraph or not, you implied I said it and I didn't - your argument was invalid if I didn't say it...and I didn't.

You're missing the point ENTIRELY. You're saying overweight people who are pre-organ failure should be judged for posting about unhealthy food on social media but people who are alcoholics who are pre-organ failure should not be judged for posting about excessive drinking on social media. Do you have any justification for why you think that because the last reason you gave was that fat people aren't beautiful but alcoholics can be?

I gave up reading the posts as half of them are quite simply mad. At no point did OP flame her friends, say they shouldn’t love themselves or should publicly flog themselves, have no worth etc but what was said was sensible: being overweight shouldn’t be praised or embraced as being good or to be admired.

It causes terrible health issues and is set to cause huge strain and burden on our health services. Accepting yourself is fine, being proud of being obese is a different thing entirely.

I’m overweight, I drink too much occasionally and I know I should do better. I don’t want to be praised for being unhealthy. I want recognition if I take care of myself and set a good example. I don’t want to be thin, I’d like to be strong and lean.

'Really, us sick folk should just keep quiet and keep our heads down eh? Just pretend to be 'normal' and not get in the way of the perfectly healthy people, not make them think about anything unpleasant like the realities of being sick forever?'

We aren't talking about 'sick' people, we are talking about obese people who celebrate it. When you say sick do you mean those who live with a chronic condition?

'Or is it only fat people that you have a problem with celebrating something that isn't optimally healthy?'

Yes.

Why do these discussions always end up so polarised? It's for sure not okay to randomly say horrible things about overweight people; but it should also be okay to say "clinical obesity isn't really healthy" without heads being bitten off.

I have a friend who has a rounded, curvy body-type. Technically speaking, I'd guess she's a bit overweight. But when she lost weight I'd guess her weight would have been considered "healthy" although she looked anything but. She said she felt much better when she put the weight back on - and she definitely looked better. Everyone's "setpoint" is different and some people are built to be larger, curvy... it is bone structure as much as anything. But that is not the same as being overweight (or, indeed, underweight) to the point where it negatively impacts your health.

@likeamillpond

Maybe 10-20 years ago but the trend now is very much curvy/thick. I ate huge portions to try and gain weight. That was influenced by the Kardashians and they are well on the way out. Clothes look better on slimmer people. Slim will always be in.

Slim, not skinny.

Of course average is in. Skinny women get shamed plenty, as in actually skinny. Outside of fashion skinny is referred to as not real women and a product of gay men. Day to day 'more "womanly" figures are valued

BMI isn’t a good way to track either my partner is a doctor and hates how people use it - you know most Olympic athletes would come under obese due to the amount of weight muscle mass, when clearly they are health and active.

Most? Some would, in the more muscle-bound sports but the majority certainly would not.

The problem imv is too much delicious food available cheaply - food designed to pleasure our tastebuds rather than just fill us up and keep us alive.
This wasn't available in the past, or certainly not to the same extent and not as cheap.
Booze is the same - there was a stigma attached to being seen with a couple of bottles of wine in your bag. You went to the off licence especially to buy it. And now it's cheaper too. It's addictive and hard to resist.
Society has changed and manufacturers now deliberately make things we will love eating.
It's so hard for humans to fight it.

@spittycup sure thing! When I was pregnant with DS (this is 3rd pregnancy...) the midwife was constantly saying "oh my God, you're tiny" and saying that my pregnancy would be risky because of my weight (after 2 uncomplicated pregnancies at the same weight). A friend of a friend I barely know said once (in front of other people) "shit, you're like a skeleton". I struggle to imagine anyone saying, "shit, you're so fat" to someone they barely know. But one is considered fine and the other isn't.

[quote Jourdain11]@spittycup sure thing! When I was pregnant with DS (this is 3rd pregnancy...) the midwife was constantly saying "oh my God, you're tiny" and saying that my pregnancy would be risky because of my weight (after 2 uncomplicated pregnancies at the same weight). A friend of a friend I barely know said once (in front of other people) "shit, you're like a skeleton". I struggle to imagine anyone saying, "shit, you're so fat" to someone they barely know. But one is considered fine and the other isn't.[/quote]
That's not fine. No rational person thinks that it's ok to call a slim person a skeleton. It happens, of course, but it's wrong.
My weight has ranged between 36kg and 80kg in my adult life (BMI 14.6 and 32.4) so I've experienced both sides of this. I'm currently around 50kg (BMI 20.2) and that's where I'm comfortable and have spent most of my time. From my personal experience, I've received a lot more nastiness for being overweight than being underweight. I think that when people are slimmer there's a sympathetic (of course insulting and unacceptable) assumption you're ill and you need support. On the other hand, overweight people are treated like lazy, uneducated, greedy and selfish people. There's an assumption you don't work hard at your job if you're fat - because laziness makes you fat. There's an assumption you don't understand basic things - otherwise you'd understand that you're killing yourself. Aside from the comments on your actual appearance, the incorrect assumptions people make about overweight people are abundant and horrendous.

I hear you. Celebrating your curves is fine if they are proportional to your build and aren't affecting your health. If not, it's problematic and requires action which isn't facilitated by well meaning, but ultimately enabling talk of "fat shaming".

Lots of 'assumptions' there Sonny and perhaps more than a little projection.

If I ate a Tunnocks Caramel Wafer for each “concerned” poster with overweight “friends”... well, I’d be a lot heavier than I am now.

Goady bullshit. As if fat people are all going to hate themselves just because someone on Mumsnet thinks they should.

I'm so tired of these threads, and people going 'but it's about heeeealth'. It isn't, and you know it. You just think fat people are disgusting. 'Curvy' does not automatically mean 'fat' btw, unless you're implying that women with big tits and arses are disgusting.

@ChaToilLeam

If I ate a Tunnocks Caramel Wafer for each “concerned” poster with overweight “friends”... well, I’d be a lot heavier than I am now.

I'm amazed they deign to be friends with fat people, frankly. I'd hate to be friends with someone who was sneering about my looks and my body behind my back.

@amusedtodeath1

It's not about advocating an unhealthy lifestyle though. It's about saying I may be overweight but I still value myself, I am still sexy and I won't allow people to make me feel ashamed because I am just as worthy as anyone else is.

Exactly what it is. But people want an excuse to continue to hate fat people and make it about 'health' and 'the NHS'.

I don't think that believing the celebration of obesity is a bad thing (and agreeing that celebrating curves is not good) is remotely the same as hating fat people.

@AuntieStella

I don't think that believing the celebration of obesity is a bad thing (and agreeing that celebrating curves is not good) is remotely the same as hating fat people.

Yep. And celebrating curves/different body types is not the same as celebrating obesity! Being massively underweight isn't healthy. Being massively overweight also isn't healthy.

Cancer Research UK was criticised when they had that billboard asking what’s the biggest contributor to getting cancer. Being overweight. It’s a not brained. More of you equals more cancer. The cost of obesity is enormous

Follow any British meme account and it is filled with photos and videos of drunken behaviour and comments about 'legends' and 'not all heroes where capes'. It's considered a part of British culture and viewed in a comedic light.

No one talks about the strain that drunk and disorderly behaviour puts on the NHS, despite there being documentaries about it.

Being overweight isn’t healthy. But in our world it’s easy to be overweight and hating your body and what you look like all the time is no way to live. I’d never say that an overweight person shouldn’t be able to buy nice clothes or feel good about themselves when that look in the mirror. That is clearly ridiculous and damaging.

@JaniieJones

'There's a fuck tonne of people who post about drinking to excess on Facebook and are proud of it and no one judges'

If they had liver failure (the result of drinking too much), I guarantee people would judge. So again, it's fine to eat cake if you're a healthy bmi and post about it if you must, not so much if you're 20 stone.

It isn't 'discrimination' or 'fat shaming' it is a fact that when your over eating and excess drinking causes you to display the physical effects it is not fun or beautiful.

There you go. But you can't tell someone has liver damage from looking at them, can you? Fat people are easy targets for people to make all kinds of assumptions and comments.

@JaniieJones

'Really, us sick folk should just keep quiet and keep our heads down eh? Just pretend to be 'normal' and not get in the way of the perfectly healthy people, not make them think about anything unpleasant like the realities of being sick forever?'

We aren't talking about 'sick' people, we are talking about obese people who celebrate it. When you say sick do you mean those who live with a chronic condition?

'Or is it only fat people that you have a problem with celebrating something that isn't optimally healthy?'

Yes.

Oh but we are talking about sick people - this thread is littered with criticism of type 2 diabetics and their burden on the NHS.

The NHS does not fund diabetes care properly, it's that simple. You need tools to manage it and most people don't have access to these tools. No amount of gaslighting will shame people into taking care of themselves.

You cannot have a discussion about obesity without including a myriad of health conditions that are part of the issue. Type 2 diabetes is one, thyroid conditions are another (again, the NHS doesn't perform adequate testing here and pretends problems are all in your head) and mental health is another - certain meds like olanzapine are well known for significant weight gain.

'Or is it only fat people that you have a problem with celebrating something that isn't optimally healthy?'

Yes

Thank you for your frankness here in admitting that it really has nothing to do with genuine concern for health.

Stop normalising and celebrating body-hating. Everyone deserves to love and value their own body for what it does and who they are.