DD involved with older man

[boomhiss]

My 20 year old DD has fallen for a man who lives in our village. He's at least twice her age, divorced and single-parenting two teenage DS. (For context, I'm also divorced and single-parenting. We live overseas.) Both of his kids are "troubled" and my DS used to hang out with the older boy. They live in our village and are acquaintances of ours.

Obviously, like everyone else, my DD is starved for social contact. She's been going to a nearby café for months, chatting with the locals, all of whom are much older. Social distancing, masks of course. In the last few weeks, she's been a bit distant and preoccupied. Today I found her in tears and eventually she confessed that she's overwhelmed by her feelings for this man. She's a beautiful young woman, intelligent and sensible. She's been in a couple of relationships but never developed strong feelings for anyone until now.

She's adamant that nothing has happened, no sex, not even a kiss or hand-holding, mostly because of Covid but also because she feels he's too old for her. But now she's considering taking it further.

I'm inwardly shocked and angry with this man for "leading her on". But she's an adult and should be allowed to make her own choices. Yet I want to give this man hell. AIBU?

As she has no learning disability you need to back off and let her learn from this. It sounds like she’s very immature at 20 to behave like this.

You sound like a really nice caring mum. But as she’s living with you, you can keep a close eye and just encourage her to make some more friendships with people her own age. If she’s at uni this shouldn’t be too hard for her. It’ll be a good distraction for her to go out with them when lockdown is lifted.

On reflection I think you’re not getting the answers you want so you’re going to rewrite the narrative.

This.

She went from being a beautiful young woman, intelligent and sensible to DD has epilepsy and a brain injury, which is why she still lives at home. She's had a very sheltered upbringing, lots of hospitalisations and takes a shedload of medication, including ADs to pragmatic on every level - serious about her university studies and her part-time job, her friends, her health...

It seems strange this man could be taking advantage of the young woman you describe initially and latterly, but the woman in the middle? She sounds like someone else entirely.

I find it strange she had so much upset yet you didn't use that as a chance to talk to her about this.

Your thread title says they are involved but you haven't given a single example of anything other than a crush.

What has actually happened?

Honestly from what you've said it sounds like there isn't a lot to be concerned about. His personality is "a bit meh"? So what? She could have a partner her age that wasn't to your taste - not everyone is attracted to the same things.

I think you are getting involved in something that is none of your business - and actually proving your daughter right that she should be worried about you judging her for her relationship choices, because you are.

If you have no reason to think he is actually abusing her (which it sounds like you don't - you said he seems like a decent guy), then let her get on with it and make her own choices.

@Laggartha

I spent some of my teen years living in a very rural area of England. Intergenerational socialising, friendships and relationships were far, far more common than in the city.

It sounds as though she has a crush on him, but I'm not sure why it's so distressing to her.

It sounds like her distress is due to worries about how she will be judged for being in a relationship with an older man - which her mum is blatantly reinforcing.

She feels like this is "wrong" or "weird" and everything surrounding it is distressing her, and her mum is also reinforcing that it is abnormal.

It sounds like it's nothing to do with the actual man or the relationship itself but the fact that she is in a judgemental environment.

I find this hands off attitude so strange. The OP thinks that the man in question could be a lot older than 40. Her daughter is I think both emotionally and physically vulnerable. Was your daughter hysterical because she was telling you in the hope you would give her the green light to go ahead with a relationship? I think the distress is because you have gently told her that you do not think she should get involved with him. Not because of the intensity of her feelings necessarily but because you haven’t given her the go ahead.

OP maybe try supporting her, allowing her to talk to you about him and the situation and encourage her to make safe decisions. You don't have to stop her from trying something new just because you're unsure. Support her choices and feelings and make sure she feels she can work out what she wants to do with your help.

I was 19 when I met my 35yo husband, he wasn't grooming me and I felt very secure with him. Don't mark this man down as some predator or 'bad news' before you even know him.

Also, I would never talk to him about this, even though I'm angry

OP why are you so angry, it seems nothing has actually happened between them? Also why is your daughter so hysterical and upset, as again it seems nothing has actually happened between them?

I used to work in a pub and was friendly, chatty and smiled at everyone, the amount of men that thought I was up for a fling or affair was awful. Are you sure your daughter is not misinterpreting his friendly behaviour for romantic interest? He may just think she is his son's mate and being kind.

@CaraherEIL

I find this hands off attitude so strange. The OP thinks that the man in question could be a lot older than 40. Her daughter is I think both emotionally and physically vulnerable. Was your daughter hysterical because she was telling you in the hope you would give her the green light to go ahead with a relationship? I think the distress is because you have gently told her that you do not think she should get involved with him. Not because of the intensity of her feelings necessarily but because you haven’t given her the go ahead.

Or the distress could be because the man has told her however kindly that he is not interested in a romantic relationship with her?

I think there is nothing wrong with this mum telling her daughter that this man is not an ideal focus for her feelings. The feelings are not wrong but the person selected as a focus for those feelings is not a good choice. With her particular set of vulnerabilities I think the OP is doing exactly the right thing. But OP, you mentioned uni so if your daughter will be returning to a more normal life with her friends the situation will resolve itself naturally.

Also why is your daughter so hysterical and upset, as again it seems nothing has actually happened between them?

She's upset because she feels like a weirdo for being infatuated with an older man and considering taking it further. And her mum is reinforcing that.

Counsellor- yes it definitely could be that too, maybe she plucked up the courage to say something to him and he’s not interested in her romantically. That’s very possible too. I think OP you can only wait and see how things unfold.

Only the OP who was there can judge, was she sort of happy and excited when she starting telling you and then the hysterics were a reaction to what you said or was she subdued and emotional and then burst into tears as soon as she started talking about it. That should tell you if she is upset by what you said or upset by something he had said.
If not either of these too she might just feel totally overwhelmed by how big her feelings are and needed a good vent.

It sounds like she has a crush more than anything else really. He hasn’t made any moves on her and so far it sounds as though they have just exchanged friendly conversation. She fancies him and has convinced herself it could be something more. I’d be encouraging her to drop it and try finding someone closer to her age. 20 years is a big gap but it’s even more prominent when the younger party is only 20.

It seems strange this man could be taking advantage of the young woman you describe initially and latterly, but the woman in the middle? She sounds like someone else entirely.

I find it strange she had so much upset yet you didn't use that as a chance to talk to her about this.

Yes, it just doesn't feel as though this is coming from a mum. It's more like a male fantasy.

I think your anger at him is weird, on the surface of it, it doesn’t appear he’s done anything.
And you can’t possibly know she’s developed feelings because he encouraged her that’s just nonsense. I think your overprotectiveness is skewing your view of this.

It all seems very dramatic, but I personally think you should just let her know you are there if she needs you and then leave her alone. She’s 20 not 12!

Op you wroteI have seen them in a group setting and it's clear he finds her very attractive and charming.

So what exactly did he do/say to evidence this? Agree this sounds v dramatic.

Do you think she's missing a "Dad" and subconsciously that's why she wants/needs/seeks this older dad figure to take an interest in her?

It's pretty creepy of him to encourage any personal relationship between himself and the female friend of his son.

Its one thing for a young girl to have an intense crush on someone.
From her tears I suspect her gut instinct is sending a warning signal that a crush is not a healthy relationship between equals.

With luck she's already got one foot out the door on the older-man scenario and just needs your confirmation to trust her gut.

Possibly she also needs your advice and help on how to disentangle herself from a relationship that she instinctively knows is not right for her.

It's pretty creepy of him to encourage any personal relationship between himself and the female friend of his son.

Except there is no real evidence he has done anything except be friendly.

Hi OP. I was 19 when I met my ex who was 32 at the time. We dated for 6 years. He was divorced, no children, nice looking but all round a pretty average guy. But I was infatuated with him. It’s a cliché that older men are flattered by younger women, but really younger women are flattered by older men. I could not believe this guy was showing me attention (in reality, it’s obvious why, I was a pretty 19 year old!). Much like your daughter, I thought he understood me, got my quirks, wanted ‘older guy stuff’ (whatever that meant) and would therefor treat me better. He told me he liked me because I was mature for my age, which is nice to hear because every teenager wants to be a grown up.
I came to realise latter that if he wanted someone as mature as a 32 year, he would have just dated a 32 year. He wanted a much younger girl who was naïve and didn’t know her worth. Although our relationship did become far more equal in later years as I become more confident, with that came my realisation of how he had consciously and subconsciously used the age dynamic to his advantage and couldn’t get over how in the past he had treated be baldy, just because I had let him.
I’d say your daughter sounds even more vulnerable than most 20 year olds and although he may not be adversely doing so, the age difference will cause power struggles.
My advice would be that if they really enjoy each other’s company, perhaps they could stay friends until DD is more confident and in a better place. For me, there was a huge difference between being 20 and being 24/25. I wish I’d met ex a little later in life and I would have felt confident to speak up for myself earlier in our relationship.

However, I do know that at 19/20 it’s very difficult to imagine feeling ay different then how you do in this moment.

@boomhiss

As far as I know, they're "just good friends" so lots of chatting. But I think he should have set boundaries in his approach right from the start. DD isn't the type to fall for someone without a lot of encouragement.

By now I'd have sounded out the village gossip to find out a whole lot more about him , starting with his real age, and does he have a past history of encouraging young girls his son s brought home..

So she's two years older than his oldest son? Hmmm think it's weird.

I did go on a few dates with a 40 year old when I was 20, but one on one it didn't work out. He just had very old tastes. He owned his own home, a business and had a cat. I mean there's nothing wrong with those things, but it was so done. There was nothing to achieve together. He was nice, enough, but no kids to complicate matters. I knew him from the gym and chatted lots maybe two years, before going on a date. I think taking it from friends to kissing, it just felt weird even though I liked him. I think success ( and so the freedoms of having money) can be very attractive. He had a nice car and those things.

@Whatwouldscullydo

What's actually going on with them?

If uts just a crush and nothing happening or going to happen you can just ride it out.

If they are together it then its a different story

I would say just be there for her. Don't lecture don't point out all the ways he's wrong for her. She won't listen and you will just push her towards him and she won't wanna hear " I told you so" so will stay way after she's discovered its a huge mistake.

Just make sure she's aware of what constitutes a healthy relationship. And how to recognise arouse or unhealthy dependency.

As someone who dated a 36 year old at 21 this will he a disaster. For all the reasons you are probably thinking.

As someone who married a 39 year old at 24, to whom I'm still married 36 years later, speak for yourself.

That was not the experience of anyone I knew who did similar.

Age gaps when you are older probably matter a bit less as 40 and 55 isn't realky a huge deal nor 65 and say 75.

But it's not really the norm in your late teens and early twenties to be on an equal footing with someone that much older than you. Sometimes it's even a very real abuse of power.

There are plenty threads on MN too from women who married young or married men alot older than them who now find them selves married to "old men " in terms of their behaviour and what they want to do.

Whereas its it entirely possible I don't think it's really the norm that you get the happy ever after that way. The age thing can't not ever come up.

id play it really carefully. Keep dialogue open with her in a non judgemental way, but id warn her to be wary of older men flattering her with attention, and that its a lot more common than she might think. About how its not always about people trying to spoil her fun, its because there is a genuine issue with men doing this with young women who should be in the prime of their life, and experiencing new things, and ending up being tied down to a middle aged man who gets them pregnant and wants to settle down, and how limiting that could be. That you understand that theres a certain comfort in someone acting like they would look after you, but that she needs to keep her wits about her, because this is very unlikely to be any sort of fairytale