to not beleive that a women not breast feed is selfish and using 'i couldnt' as an excuse?

[aleciawalton]

im a mum of 1 who bf till 15 months, and now pregnant with second and will bf. i also am a breast friend and took training to support mums who are bfeeding. ( learned how milk is produced, history, attachment...)

i just think that too many women use 'i couldnt bf' as an excuse. its only been in the last 50 to 60 years bottles and formula have been around. what happened back then??? did more then 50% of the babys die? no cuase back then 99% women breast fed! why could they do it then and not now???
i just feel it a cop out and the mums are just being selfish.
yes its hard, but so was labour, so raising a kid. however they choise to have the baby. i know it takes time and comittment and not having that all important wine drink. but i personaly think that its for how long??? if i can give my child the best start and yes it can take a year or 2 but is my child not worth it??
if some one said to you while prego you have a choise to either have your baby and make your child as healthy as it can be or just have the baby, what would you want? why do we give the baby vitamine K, if not to help the baby be healthy. would you not get your baby vaccinated?

sorry just makes me mad. when i hear my nipples hurt and thats cant be normal so i stopped. or babys 3 weeks old and wanted feeding all the time so it ment i didnt have enough milk so i stopped. or there's a xmas party i want to go to so im not going to bf. the exuces go one. i really love the one 'bf is not natural, its disusting'. WTF were breast made for then and why does milk come out of them???

SSD- it is dangerous to let an OP like this stand unchallenged, for the reasons outlined by hunker

i find it astonishing that a BF supporter feels that this sort of OP is acceptable and neccesary

if AW cannot see why she has been the recipient of anger and upset, then that is not hte fault of Mumsnet per se, if she is a regular poster she should realise how these debates go...

BF is an incredibly emotive topic

but lulu, the poster said she doesn't bring any of her views into her "work" and thats why she wanted to have a moan/rant on here as she knows she can't say what she really thinks in rl

I've just read a post from you on another thread about your mil threatening to have your baby taken off you if you moved back to canada, is that correct?
I just wanted to see what would make someone start a thread like this and I can only conclude that the op is extremely unhappy and feels she has no control over a lot of things in her life except her ability to bf, and because she feels so terrible she wants to make others feel bad in some way, as she knows that this is a very sensitive subject.
It may give her a sense of empowerment knowing that she has upset people, but really I think she needs help.

SSD, if she posts that she's a peer supporter and holds views such as she does, do you think she'll encourage women to access breastfeeding support?

What was the face re applause for your post about?

I can't let posts like this go unchallenged - it's too important.

Lissie, thank you.

Do you really think that because she doesn't voice her opinions at 'work' they never come across??

I Bf DD1 for all of one week. I was seriously engorged and in more pain and discomfort than I had ever felt. I used to cry when feeding her, and she was a total savage who required constant feeding, which didn't make it any easier. Then to top it off, she became jaundiced. When I decided that I couldn't carry on, my MW was fantastic. Not only did greedy DD get all she needed, I was actually able to relax and enjoy motherhood which, up to then, had been a nightmare.
Then (nine years later) DD2 came along. Feeding her was a joy and a delight (yes, I tried again despite my previous experience of BF). I adored feeding her - she was gentle and easy but unfortunately my milk production was about that of your average stone. I fed her for about 7 weeks, but when she failed to gain one single ounce in weight for 3 weeks running, I got a bit worried and reluctantly switched to formula because she obviously wasn't getting enough from me. My milk dried up within about 2 days with no discomfort at all, so my suspicions that I wasn't producing enough for her were well and truly realised.
The reasons for not BFing are many and varied, and I can't believe that anyone would be so naive and judgemental to suggest that we are all just lazy. It was agony for me to have to admit failure, but it would have been selfish and foolhardy to have tried to continue.

SSD- if she feels that strongly, i doubt very much it doesn;t come across in her work, conciously or unconciously

also, if she is open about the fact she is a peer supporter, but that it is ok for her to say women are selfish for not breastfeeding, women could be forgiven for thinking a lot of BF supporters think the same

so they don;t go

so they don;t breastfeed

so they feel guilty

and so it goes on

I am so glad my Sister doesn't come on here.

Sister ahd severe rpe-eclampsia, was hospitalised from 32 weeks, and after induction her BP rocketed and her baby needed NICU care for 4 weeks 9was born at 36 weeks), he is OK but she will be on meds for the rest of her life.
She tried everything to BF- knowing she would never have a nother child on medical advice- and expressed in hospital after Baby wasn't strong enough to feed, and for weeks when he just regurgated all feeds.

After 3 weeks, the MW told her to stop- she was making herelf ill and needed recovery time herself. She did.

Her resultant guilt (despite the SCBU MW pointing out they'd never met anyone trying as hard as her) in part caused the PND that effectively ruined the first year with baby.

I work in childcare.

If I thought working mothers were selfish excuse-makers, would you want me minding your children?

Can you imagine how much fear that opinion might have on working mothers - does my childminder secretly think this, what does she say behind my back, am I really selfish?

Hunker has a point. Very sadly, it's the OP's ranting opinion which could be seen to tar bf supporters with the same brush.

I bf DS1,2 and 3 until they were all 14 months, no probs, loved it, totally devastated that I couldn't feed DS4, it later transpired tha ha has low muscle tone and was unable to latch on and suck properly, therefore the old supply and demand didn't kick in and similar to Lewis' LO he almost starved.

Get you facts straight, lurk a little before you post, get the feel of a forum. Realise that you are possibly talking to hundreds of people through your posts (especially on threads that have an obviously controversial title).

I can honestly say that MN has taught me to be a better person because I have stopped judging and I have seen the world of parenting through a thousand different eyes. Don't leave mn, learn from it.

Good point about guilt link to PND

Oh and OP sympathies about your MIL- I too have an evil one but even she is not THAt desperate to ruin our family life (have only read reference on here, not original thread). being separated from DH's family is ahrd, and I sympathise.

Ms Walton, you are either a journo looking for a new story, someone who just likes to pick fights or someone who just likes to brag and feel smug.

When you get a job as a BF counsellor and have seen thousands of women, come back and start another thread.

seriously, AW, look back thsough some of the stories about trying to bf. not just on this thread. you will gain a different perspective on it and (hopefully) realise that most women dont ff out of choice, and the ones who do aren't selfish or bad parents.

peachy- for your sis

Surely this is a wind up!
Fwiw, my first child was bottle fed and my second was breastfed and do I give a monkeys what anyone else thinks about that. Do I heck as like!
I do think it's a shame though that the OP has given a thoroughly bad image of bfing supporters though.

lulu I have dreams and wake up upset about ff feeding ds1 who is nine.

OMG, I guess you're making yourself feel good at everyone else's expense - people normally say this kind of judgmental stuff when they are feeling not so good about themselves.

By the way, years ago when women couldn't breastfeed (because that does happen!)they employed wet nurses so no babies died.

I couldn't breastfeed my first one because my nipples are inverted and she would not latch on - or perhaps this was indeed my fault. My second one I chose not to breastfeed because of the nipple problem and because I have a history of really bad postnatal depression. My thought was happier mum, possibly more settled baby - so shoot me for being so selfish. I don't really care what you think about mums that can't or choose not to be breastfeed.

On a kinder note, I'm so glad that you have found it so easy and it has worked out for you.

very true VS, I just thought it's possible (if unlikely) she doesn't even think that and is just on here for the reasons that Lazarou outlined?

ok, AW, just imagine i'm a mum in your group...

i've been breastfeeding exclusively for 10 days. baby is large and hungry but is losing weight fast. feeding continuously. still hungry. breasts never feel 'full', even before a feed. never experienced leakage. could never express.

hv suggests mixed feeding, due to weight loss. i follow advice. am i doing the wrong thing???

the scenario above is what i experienced with both my dds. i am convinced that i simply didnt have enough milk. i mixed fed them for about 5 months. the only time my breats ever felt full was when i stopped feeding them i felt v inadequate about my milk supply.

are you really telling me that i'm selfish?

The constant rush to label women selfish every time they take a parenting decision that not everyone agrees with is more about ingrained misogyny than the wellbeing of newborns. Many people insist a mother is 'selfish' if she isn;t visibly suffering: how dare she behave as though she's a human being? She's had a baby, now she's a baby-tending machine who mustn;t voice an opinion or enjoy her favourite food or drink, or want any time off. BF is in general better for babies than FF, but FF is better for babies than becoming malnourished and dehydrated because their mothers are unable to BF but feel too guilty to give them formula.

Why on earth does the OP was to be a BF councellor if she has such a negative view of women who struggle? Honest, and very serious question here.

If it makes he 'Mad' to here them say that their nipple hurt etc, how does she ever expect to help them?

The day I have such a universally poor view of the children I teach will be the day that I quit. For their benefit and my mental health.

its the bf nazis nasties again - ok we all know breast is best. lets just give it a rest hey?

We all know 5 portions of fruit and veg are best too... but it aint always gonna happen.

no-one I know of has ever (in modern history) died as a result of being ff so lets just give all mums whatever they choose (or have impsoed upon them for whatever reason) to do a flippin' rest.

I'm b/f, but I'm lucky and its fairly easy for me. I can't wait to give up, I hate smelling milky, and don't really enjoy it, so there we are.