to believe the Mumsnet High Earners?

[LigPatin]

Every time there's a thread about earnings, there's always multiple posters who claim that most people on the thread must be inflating or plain lying about their salaries.

Whilst I recognise that people lie, especially on anonymous forums, I find it quite sad that people prefer to dismiss these posts as lies rather than take inspiration/education from them (or just not care).

I come from a poor background - we never had enough money to the point that food and electricity use was rationed. We weren't on the streets, but that was a looming possibility. We lived (mostly) within the midlands.

I fell into nannying as a career (having dreamed of being a primary school teacher) and my first job was in Kensington. The housekeeper had been gossiping about the rent on the house we worked in - it was £3k a WEEK. This was 2012-ish. I remember wondering how on Earth anyone could afford paying £200k+ a year on rent alone, when - in my mind - earning just £50k was amazingly rich.

I remember walking through Kensington and Knightsbridge and Chelsea and seeing thousands and thousands and thousands of these houses, all huge and grand and all presumably commanding similar rent or sale value than the one I worked in. They were all clearly lived in and used.

Perhaps it was arrogance, or naivety, but I figured that if there were enough people who could afford to pay £1k, £2k, £5k+ a week on rent (or buy million pound houses), then there must be a lot of money out there to be earned, and I couldn't see any reason as to why I couldn't find a way to get a share of that money.

That's sort of how I feel about these earning threads - hundreds of people are posting about their high salaries and instead of scoffing that they must be sad-sacks who hang out on Mumsnet to lie about their lifestyles - I think it's inspiring and encouraging to see so many women out there making amazing money and securing their futures.

FWIW - I was 21 back in Kensington, amazed at the £3k a week rent. I'm coming up to 30 now and my average yearly income is about £120k. I remind myself every day of how lucky I am, and how 21 year old me would have been incredulous. Though I'm, of course, absolutely nowhere near being able to rent a £3k a week house

@SomewhereInbetween1

Wow, it didn't take long AT ALL for the "I've worked hard" comment to come out, as if the average earners don't.

She said that in response to someone else who chose to misread her original post as her saying that simply knowing about high salaries was enough to “manifest” earning one. So she said “no, I worked hard to gain it.” Then up pops another poster misreading that she’s saying “only people with high salaries work hard”.

So many people with their own agendas looking for reasons to think badly of anyone who is not them.

OP I get it. I earn over 100k. I’m lucky to have had opportunity to take this career path AND I’ve worked hard to progress in it. It’s not one or the other.

Similarly, I know I’m in the top income bands which puts me in a much better position than a lot of people but I also know there’s a huge gap between my income which affords me a pleasant and comfortable lifestyle in a small house in a very rough part of London and the “money is no object” lifestyle popularly associated with being “rich”. Again, both things can be true as the same time.

I think it’s a real shame when posters assert that everyone on a high salary must be lying, because they are sending the message that these salaries cannot be achieved by a woman posting on Mumsnet so there’s no point in trying, and that’s not true. There is a huge difference between saying everyone can’t do it (true) and saying that means that no one can ever do it (false).

And the OP’s post is hardly a “stealth boast”. She’s saying quite openly she is proud of what she achieved.

@SummerHouse

I loved this post. A nice rags to riches story from an OP very grateful for what she has and has worked hard for.

Ten pages of comments mostly proving the point she was making that instead of a positive / trusting response, a high salary gets derision and disbelief.

My last post quoted the wrong poster. Should have been this post ^^ I was agreeing with.

@LoisWilkersonslastnerve

Statistics would tell you that while there likely will be high earners on MN, there won't be many so that tells me that sadly there will be more than a few liars on here.

Not true Those statistics are PAYE

@LoisWilkersonslastnerve

Statistics would tell you that while there likely will be high earners on MN, there won't be many so that tells me that sadly there will be more than a few liars on here.

Well they might be too busy bored my mumsnet, but they do exist. I live in Wales and if I know quite a few I suspect in cities there are many more.

So what s your job then?

Are we missing the point, or do you actually just not have one?

People generally say "You're missing the point" when either they don't have one or they have explained their point particularly badly.

Can't stand "You missed my point" type bullshit, especially if it's wheeled out because someone doesn't agree with said point.

The way the OP was phrased was patronizing as though low earners don't realize they could earn more. There are all kinds of barriers to overcome and not everyone can no matter how hard they try.

That said, I don't think there are rafts of Mumsnetters sitting around making up high salaries for fun.

Wow, it didn't take long AT ALL for the "I've worked hard" comment to come out, as if the average earners don't.

it's not just about "working hard" it's working with a goal.

Nothing wrong with whatever you choose, but you must know that some areas will never bring you a high salary, unless you start your own businesses, retrain or ..move.

Why do you think so many nurses are retraining and working in the beauty industry for example?

@wesowereonabreak - you are correct

@ClarkeGriffin I'm actually grateful to you for pointing this out, I've had it removed.

Was a dick move, I didn't realise how identifying it would be. Thanks.

Thanks to the other posters sticking up for me as well, I was trying to make a point but in a stupid way.

@samG76

The thing is, though, that there aren't loads of people on £107K in inner London - it my experience it is a few on much higher salaries and lots on much less. At DS1's school gate (state school, inner london) there was a lot of banter (and sympathy) when it transpired that a couple made less than £250K between them.

There are absolutely loads. The leafy boroughs are full of them - SW London, W London, N London.

But it's true that there are far outnumbered by those who are not on 100k + However it is hard for lower paid key workers like nursing, firefighting to afford London rents.

A typical 1 bed flat in Fulham could be 20k a year in rent.

Not true
Those statistics are PAYE

you know if posters pretend to believe higher earners willingly waste half or more their income in tax by staying on PAYE, let them.

@littlepattilou and @IamnotH I am working today, as long as I get my work done, I can take breaks. I know the statistics on earnings, what I was trying to say (clumsily) is that its great that women can have careers and earn the same as men. I wasn't aware growing up there were these options, many of my friends are not from a privileged background either. A lot of it was luck and the good fortune to have an amazing female mentor when I was starting out who pushed me and helped me realise the opportunities. I think its important to share info on salaries, and its why my female friends and I do, because when things are in secrecy its when employers can get away with paying some people less.

I've never said that people that don't earn more than the average wage don't work hard. I know they do, because I've worked jobs where I wouldn't have had the flexibility that I do now.

I don’t believe all of them no. Me and DH have a combined annual income that puts us in the top 10% of household income but don’t earn anywhere near the amount stated by most people on these threads. I believe some earn that amount but not the amount of people who say they do.
Also you’d have got a better response by not stating your current salary at the end.

Sorry OP, but I was more inspired by the MN poster who saved a baby snail from being washed down the sink

I don't doubt there are plenty of very high earners on here but I tend to see them on the education forum rather than the 'look at how much money I earn' threads.

@wesowereonabreak well, it’s not a precise science but I’d say anything > 2 X average median is overpaid? I don’t celebrate the fact that some careers paths vastly outearn others.

[quote JessicaaRabbit]@ClarkeGriffin I'm actually grateful to you for pointing this out, I've had it removed.

Was a dick move, I didn't realise how identifying it would be. Thanks.

Thanks to the other posters sticking up for me as well, I was trying to make a point but in a stupid way. [/quote]
I would change your username too. This is why you don't put anything revealing or even slightly revealing on sites like this.

We all live in bubbles with certain things in common with other people in the bubble. The beauty of mumsnet is that it exposes you to how people think outside your bubble. I do tend to believe what people say even when they are describing a situation that I have no personal experience of, because I come on mumsnet to hear about exactly those people. It's pretty sad that people are suspicious and want to talk the OP down rather than congratulate her for her success.

Many who earn huge amount use umbrella companies

I think you mean limited companies. An umbrella company is for contractors and freelancers and operates a PAYE system. Most people on high salaries in corporate roles are paid via the PAYE route.

Our joint income is respectably OK but nothing to write home about., compared with the high inclomes lots of posters have on here. We are in the UK top 4% of income so one would think that there are ot that many people with joint incomes four times as high as ours (commonest figure I remember these tpes of posters citing) Perhaps all the people with sky high incomes spend their days posting on Mumnsnet. Probably not.

[quote tinierclanger]@wesowereonabreak well, it’s not a precise science but I’d say anything > 2 X average median is overpaid? I don’t celebrate the fact that some careers paths vastly outearn others.[/quote]
huh?!

Many people are paid based on what they bring to the company! Their salary and bonuses barely reflect their worth actually. "Average" is completely irrelevant.

You might argue that some jobs are ridiculously underpaid and some areas under-funded, but there's no such thing as someone being overpaid when you are talking about private companies at least.

ClarkeGriffin I am impressed, I couldn't read any character on that blurry photo!

I work in IT and run a large-ish team. I have a number of contractors earning GBP1,000 per day.

Generally this reflects about 20 years of experience, but qualifications at this level are immaterial, for the particular work that they are doing (architecture and programme management). I'm doing my second masters, but again, it's my experience that's most valuable.

Other contractors will be on GBP500 per day on average and yes, some of them are women.

HR people - I don't want to talk about IR35, but I have people both in and outside of IR35 on those amounts, if anybody wants to start sharpening pitchforks.

Gosh the usual MN tough crowd.

Well done you, you have obviously taken the opportunity when they have risen and I think that is key to success whether that be financial or just having the lifestyle you love.

Luck is an interesting concept - are people just born lucky or do they put them selves in positions and take opportunities and risks when they arise allowing them to take the leaps of progression when the time comes.

I love to hear of successful young women aiming high and getting there. Good luck to you.

Earnings in our society are not proportional to how hard people.

'Believe randomers on the internet'

Says randomer on the internet