Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Neighbour putting up extension

539 replies

BigPaperBag · 27/03/2021 21:26

Ok, our neighbour has informed us that they are going to be putting up an extension. No problem with that, their house and all that. What really riled me was when he just said ‘and we’ll be putting the scaffolding on your patio so we can rebuild the wall’ (in total it will be there about 6 weeks) Please don’t anyone ask me why it’ll be there so long as I genuinely don’t know, this is just what he said.

Anyway, AIBU to say that he can put scaffolding up but only if he rents my patio space? Do people do this? It’s my first owned home so I have no idea, just asking for opinions really.

OP posts:
covetingthepreciousthings · 28/03/2021 09:59

I echo all the other posters.. I would be saying no to this and also asking that he gets a party wall agreement.

I'd be worried that his comment about not getting that, is that he's possibly not even bothered to get proper planning permission etc for whatever he's having done.

When you say they need access via your back door, I presume that means they'll have to come right through your downstairs from the front door to take the scaffolding out?

Your neighbour sounds rude and entitled.

Hazel444 · 28/03/2021 09:59

No way would I be agreeing to lose the use of my patio or any of my garden when we are soon going to be able to socialise in our gardens. Tell him it's fine to do it over the winter, but not in the coming months.

rhnireland205 · 28/03/2021 10:04

I'd also be asking for a formal agreement that states that any damage caused to your new patio will be repaired immediately and at their expense.

Outbutnotoutout · 28/03/2021 10:10

When our builder built our extension in January he asked if he was allowed access into next door to build the wall, if not he would over lock the bricks ie build from outside.

Our neighbours did let him.

Single storey extension no scaffolding needed

SakuraEdenSwan1 · 28/03/2021 10:12

How cheeky your neighbour is!

PrtScn · 28/03/2021 10:20

He needs a party wall agreement and if possible don’t let them put scaffolding on your patio. It will be there longer than 6 weeks and the workmen will not respect your property. When I had scaffolding up they broke a really thick slate slab and knocked the end cap off my guttering and neglected to mention they had done either.
If there is no alternative then have a legal agreement that he pays rent to you, amd take before and after photos in case there is damage.

Mrgrinch · 28/03/2021 10:22

If they want to use your property then they need to do it when you say so. I wouldn't lose my patio for most of the summer so I wouldn't give permission until later in the year.

Also I'd want it in writing that they're going to cover any and all costs for damages to your home or patio.

BigPaperBag · 28/03/2021 10:22

Thanks everyone, sorry went to bed early and missed a lot of really useful comments. I think a party wall agreement it is then. DH doesn’t seem keen though as he doesn’t want to rock the boat but honestly he and I have been shafted in the past (not for building work) by being too nice. Perhaps it’s time we stood up for ourselves.

OP posts:
KarmaNoMore · 28/03/2021 10:26

If he needs scaffolding, he is building something high enough to reduce sun light in your garden and your home. I would be getting someone to check your neighbours is meeting the 45degrees rule before it devalues your property.

SquirtleSquad · 28/03/2021 10:27

@BigPaperBag

Thanks everyone, sorry went to bed early and missed a lot of really useful comments. I think a party wall agreement it is then. DH doesn’t seem keen though as he doesn’t want to rock the boat but honestly he and I have been shafted in the past (not for building work) by being too nice. Perhaps it’s time we stood up for ourselves.
It'll rock the boat a hell of a lot more when you have scaffolding on your patio for the entire summer and a cracked and scuffed up patio that you end up having to pay to repair Wine
Perlea · 28/03/2021 10:28

Such a bloke thing to do just 'tell' next door what's happening with their space that they own. No wonder so many men get fatally depressed at middle age, maybe they should have thought about actually regarding another person with a very basic respect.

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 28/03/2021 10:30

@BigPaperBag

Thanks everyone, sorry went to bed early and missed a lot of really useful comments. I think a party wall agreement it is then. DH doesn’t seem keen though as he doesn’t want to rock the boat but honestly he and I have been shafted in the past (not for building work) by being too nice. Perhaps it’s time we stood up for ourselves.
I can promise your DH that not sorting this out in advance will end up rocking the boat far more than having a proper agreement in the first place. Does he really think that a neighbour this pushy is going to respond well to your DH being a wimp? - The neighbour is a bully and that will just embolden him.

It's highly unlikely that it's essential for the scaffolding go into your garden in the first place, btw. No doubt it's the cheapest and most convenient arrangement for the scaffolder and NDN, but that doesn't mean it's the only option.

madmumofteens · 28/03/2021 10:30

Also OP i believe that if you give permission once and then the construction needs maintenance in the future they can re enter at anytime.

MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 28/03/2021 10:31

@KarmaNoMore

If he needs scaffolding, he is building something high enough to reduce sun light in your garden and your home. I would be getting someone to check your neighbours is meeting the 45degrees rule before it devalues your property.
Agree. Would also check that they have planning permission for what they are actually building, as opposed to whatever they may have told the planners.
DoubleTweenQueen · 28/03/2021 10:31

@BigPaperBag Standing up for yourselves is not rocking the boat. Your CF neighbour is very much seeking to rock the boat.
Look after your own interests first and foremost, and then be accomodating - but on your terms.

Do you know what the extension will look ok like? Is single storey? Are there plans?

DoubleTweenQueen · 28/03/2021 10:32

The ok was randomly added by my phone

honeylulu · 28/03/2021 10:32

There are two issues here (and your neighbour bears the burden of sorting out both of them).

Party Wall Agreement. Yes there is a statutory obligation on neighbour to serve a notice. Once you agree that the works may proceed by countersigning, that becomes the pW agreement. If you dispute it then you serve a counter notice (these are forms you can just print off the internet). Both parties appoint a surveyor (the building neighbour pays the cost of both surveyors) who together draw up a more detailed agreement of the scope of works including access arrangements and a schedule of pre work condition. This becomes the Party Wall Award and if it is breached/damage caused then it is also the mechanism by which the surveyors agree repair works which must also be funded by neighbour. It is a process that is intended to keep disputes out of court though if your neighbour fails to follow it you can apply to court to enforce it.

The purpose of it (I can see posters have said they can't see the point) is that it gives you a direct remedy against your neighbour. If the work proceeds without a PW agreement and your property is damaged, You can sue but you have to sue the tortfeasor who is not, as you may think, your neighbour but the builder who does the physical work. You will also have a claim for breach of statutory duty against your neighbour though.

The PW process doesn't need to be "costly" . As I said, the prescribed forms are available on the internet. It can start adding up if you dispute the scope of work set out on the notice (you can't refuse the works outright but can object to how they are going to be done or insist on more info) or you want a formal schedule of pre condition agreed by surveyors, meaning a PW award has to be drawn up. (When we served our neighbour with a PW notice they were willing to forego a schedule and instead emailed me a series of photos of their property as proof of its current undamaged condition).

The other aspect is the need for access and placing of scaffolding on your property. Your neighbour has NO right to this except for essential repairs (Access to Neighbouring Land Act). If your neighbour comes into or places material on or even oversailing your land, without permission, he (or rather the tortfeasor) is committing the tort of trespass and will owe you damages for the trespass and any damage caused.

You can come to an agreement by granting a licence for access. If you feel benevolent you can waive a licence few or state the sum you want depending how long the scaffolding/access is required and how far the intrusion will inconvenience you/spoil the enjoyment of your property (it's a good idea to make the licence fee weekly/monthly in case the work overruns though you can also specify an end point in the licence after which you will be entitled to damages for trespass at a higher rate). There are no prescribed fees, You can really demand what you want but may want to bear in mind neighbourly relations and whether you might want a similar favour in the future. (Our scaffolding over sailed our neighbours garden slightly but they waived the right to insist on a licence fee as they might have wanted the same from us in due course.) If you refuse any access then your neighbour has to find another way such as having materials craned in over his house. If trespass occurs without permission (i e. Workmen jump over the wall and start erecting scaffolding on your patio) you can seek an injunction from court.

The licence issue can be dealt with separately or wrapped up in a Party Wall Award (see above).

It sounds like access via your house is essential, which is good as your neighbour can't just go ahead. But as posters have said, make clear asap that you aren't consenting to what he has proposed and that you do not give permission for access and point out that he is obliged by law to serve a PW notice.

Hope this helps.

I am a solicitor specialising in property damage by the way!

BigPaperBag · 28/03/2021 10:32

@CovidCorvid

And what do you mean access by the back door?

Do you mean gate or are they expecting to come through your house?

Back gate, sorry that wasn’t very clear. Plus we have a 20 plate car on our driveway which cost us £25k which they’d have to walk past. DH works From home so it’s always there. What if it gets scratched?
OP posts:
MissLucyEyelesbarrow · 28/03/2021 10:33

@madmumofteens

Also OP i believe that if you give permission once and then the construction needs maintenance in the future they can re enter at anytime.
I think you might be thinking of vampires Wink.

(There are usually rights of access for essential maintenance, whether or not you have previously allowed access).

Himawarigirl · 28/03/2021 10:34

You need a party wall agreement, so that a surveyor will check from your side whether there are any implications of the extension for your property. He will have to pay for it, it is a completely common part of the process of building an extension in an attached house. And if the survey reveals anything that you are unhappy with you can commission your own surveyor and he will also have to pay for that. So you will not be out of pocket in any way but you will have peace of mind that the implications of his extension for your property have been fully considered. As for the scaffolding on your patio, if he had asked you if that would be okay, I would be minded to say yes out of neighbourliness. But his attitude does sound a little concerning.

CovidCorvid · 28/03/2021 10:38

Is the access via the gate just tomerect scaffold or for all the building work? I’d certainly say no to the latter and probably no to the former.

When my neighbours put scaffolding down the side of the house at least it was before the back gate. They have got some poles on our land, actually speared the middle of the hedge with them. But I’d had a detailed talk with the neighbours beforehand about needing access for bikes and that the poles couldn’t come any closer than x point and if that didn’t work for the scaffolders then they couldn’t do it. Neighbour was fine, he knows I use my bike to commute to work.

Cloudhopping · 28/03/2021 10:38

I’m normally quite an accommodating and laid back person but I would say no to this. Just no.

4Mongrels · 28/03/2021 10:39

Party wall agreement aside, he was very rude to tell you rather than ask. I wouldn’t even consider scaffolding in a new patio without seeing insurance documents etc.

nicknamehelp · 28/03/2021 10:40

Party Wall agreement is not optional its law. Contact a Party wall surveyor ASAP and don't let scaffolding be put up till sorted.

MyOtherProfile · 28/03/2021 10:44

Sorry if this has been asked but have you looked at the planning permission request? Has it already been granted? Did you get a letter from the council informing you the request was in and inviting a response? We did when our neighbours had an extension and our neighbours did when we put in a request for planning permission.