To be angry at the frenzy caused by others last night

[BarometerTV]

I think it was utterly disrespectful. We are in lockdown and it was not the right time for a protest. I agree with a quiet, respectful, socially distanced space to grieve - which is what appeared to happen during the day.

I don't think they have attempted to protect the suspect. What I mean is that some police tend to get very defensive when they are not regarded with complete respect and awe, and take it very personally. Not all police, but too many police - and I suspect a fair few of those were involved in 'policing' the vigil, given the line they took.

[quote Mittens030869]@youvegottenminuteslynn

Yes, I’ve already had that pointed out to me and apologised for unknowingly repeating fake news.[/quote]
Sorry, I genuinely missed that. Thanks for acknowledging it I do appreciate when people take the time to do so

@FerrisWheelTrain

Oh come on *@rosetylersbiggun* - killed by the system we are told protects was one. I’m sure there were others.

As well as loud chants of "fuck the police", of course.

A placard is not necessarily hostile

Depending of course on what it says it on it.

FerrisWheelTrain you clearly have an agenda, since you're ignoring all my points.

Why did police ask women to go onto the bandstand then kettle them?

Why did police refuse to arrest the violent male protestors, but arrest women sitting quietly on the floor?

Why did police leave before the vigil had ended, and permit the rest of the vigil to go ahead?

Why did police harass and threaten to arrest the OPCC Independent Observers?

Why are you choosing to ignore the fact the hostile comments from police started long before the protest began, when it was just women peacefully coming forward, lighting a candle and laying some flowers down, and leaving?

The police made hostile comments to women gently and quietly laying flowers down? Why would that even happen? What comments?

Does everyone badmouthing the police and disseminating the erroneous idea that they instigate violence realise that if the police are defunded there will be more women murdered, not less?

[quote FerrisWheelTrain]@rosetylersbiggun the he issue was that it was Covid times, and the protest was not allowed to go ahead. What were the police supposed to do? And actually I find the rhetoric of peaceful, passive, slight women v big burly police officers HUGELY sexist.[/quote]
We have already had this debate but be clear, the law did not prohibit protest. Thanks

@rippledegg

Does everyone badmouthing the police and disseminating the erroneous idea that they instigate violence realise that if the police are defunded there will be more women murdered, not less?

Probably not.

As well as loud chants of "fuck the police", of course.

Those chants were in response to the police brutality.

Do you really think a load of evil feminists just rocked up and disrupted a vigil by chanting "fuck the police"??

No... police disrupted a peaceful vigil with a response that was hostile, aggressive, completely over the top, and which inflamed tensions.

I was at some of the BLM protests which was far, far larger and much angrier yet the police presence was much smaller and not aggressive. If they had chosen to police this protest in the same way they policed the BLM protests, none of this would have happened.

@LucieStar

A placard is not necessarily hostile

Depending of course on what it says it on it.

Yes. But even if it had something offensive on it, that would not be a crime.

Yes. But even if it had something offensive on it, that would not be a crime.

I didn't say it would be a crime. I said could be potentially hostile depending on what it said.

@LexMitior yes - completely agree there was a lack of clarity here, and THIS was a huge failure. The rules were not clear.

Do you really think a load of evil feminists just rocked up and disrupted a vigil by chanting "fuck the police"??

"Evil feminists" is not a phrase that's ever left my mouth, so that would be a no.

Do I think that some people there were unnecessarily hostile towards police purely because of who the suspect is? Yes, I'm afraid I do.

@rosetylersbiggun how about the placards slating the police, were they suddenly created when the police got hostile?

The police made hostile comments to women gently and quietly laying flowers down? Why would that even happen? What comments?

Yes they did, I personally witnessed it as did many other women.

I'm not going to repeat the comments because I know if I did, you and others with an agenda will derail the thread into a debate about "well the comments aren't that bad" and that's not the point - police have a legal and ethical responsibility to behave in a professional manner.

Backchatting and making disrespectful comments during a vigil, and having to be shushed for chatting during a minute's silence, are not professional ways to behave and inflamed tensions.

[quote Mittens030869]@mbosnz

I don’t think there’s any evidence that the police have attempted to protect the suspect. The police officers dealing with the women at the vigil were completely out of order, but that’s no reason to suspect that this is because the suspect is a serving met officer. They have after all arrested him very early on and charged him.

You would have had a point if it had turned out months later that they had concealed evidence.[/quote]
And will you revise your opinion if it comes to light that this suspect as a police officer had previously displayed inappropriate behaviour to women and it was not dealt with?

the he issue was that it was Covid times, and the protest was not allowed to go ahead. What were the police supposed to do?

Walk alongside the women like they did with the hundreds of male football supporters?

Yes I think you are being unreasonable.
I'm thoroughly glad it happened. The fact that matters took a turn... less glad about that. But the vigil absolutely should have happened.

Do I think that some people there were unnecessarily hostile towards police purely because of who the suspect is? Yes, I'm afraid I do.

I've said all along a minority of (mostly male) protestors were there with an ulterior motive.

My question is why are all the women (other than the Good Little Girls who lit a candle and trotted home as soon as the sun started to set) being painted with the same brush?

Why are certain posters steadfastly ignoring my questions about why the police ignored and refused to arrest the violent men, and why other female protestors had to shove the violent men away and try to prevent those men from co-opting the vigil?

"That girl made a slightly mouthy comment to the police, so she deserved to be body slammed to the floor by four men" is not a sentiment I ever expected to hear on a forum for women!

@rosetylersbiggun

The police made hostile comments to women gently and quietly laying flowers down? Why would that even happen? What comments?

Yes they did, I personally witnessed it as did many other women.

I'm not going to repeat the comments because I know if I did, you and others with an agenda will derail the thread into a debate about "well the comments aren't that bad" and that's not the point - police have a legal and ethical responsibility to behave in a professional manner.

Backchatting and making disrespectful comments during a vigil, and having to be shushed for chatting during a minute's silence, are not professional ways to behave and inflamed tensions.

Well surely if the police made hostile comments, you'd want to share them to make your point? I'm genuinely interested in what possible hostile comments could be made to a person just quietly laying flowers out of respect?

@LucieStar

Yes. But even if it had something offensive on it, that would not be a crime.

I didn't say it would be a crime. I said could be potentially hostile depending on what it said.

I think it’s pretty important to understand that even if there is hostility, this puts the police in a position to act with greater care, dependent on risk.

Acting towards individuals that they are borderline criminal if they hold a hostile placard is not appropriate. The police manage hostility to them in multiple contexts and with far less threat than this occasion would seem to present.

@rosetylersbiggun

Do I think that some people there were unnecessarily hostile towards police purely because of who the suspect is? Yes, I'm afraid I do.

I've said all along a minority of (mostly male) protestors were there with an ulterior motive.

My question is why are all the women (other than the Good Little Girls who lit a candle and trotted home as soon as the sun started to set) being painted with the same brush?

Why are certain posters steadfastly ignoring my questions about why the police ignored and refused to arrest the violent men, and why other female protestors had to shove the violent men away and try to prevent those men from co-opting the vigil?

"That girl made a slightly mouthy comment to the police, so she deserved to be body slammed to the floor by four men" is not a sentiment I ever expected to hear on a forum for women!

I've seen footage of a man attacking an officer in what is clearly an unprovoked manner, while women standing with him chanted and cheered.

This stereotype of poor, innocent, weak women - or even ‘evil feminists’ at a vigil : and mean, scary, nasty, misogynistic police officers just inflames me - this is NOT positive change, OR working together OR recognising there might have been fault on both sides.

Were you saying this about all the BLM protests at the height of the pandemic

You really see where people stand and their little prejudices when they make negating comments like this and about two issues which are equally deadly serious.