To think that if the only black adult in your family says they have experienced racism...

[Overcastcloudy]

... it's counterproductive to send a white man out to say, We're very much not racist?

That just is never going to end well. Ask Ian Murray how it worked out for him.

I couldn't care much either way about the Royal Family. Just baffled at the headline of William saying this.

Yes indeed - weirdly the Crown series might actually help unravel the mess Harry has tried to create for some of the woke mob that think everything is about racism or bigots etc. Look back at the royal family and how it works with the current Queen and her sister's children.

The Queen is still reigning and her nephew and niece - name them - those shouting out racism. Are they important royals or are they getting on with their lives privately, without demanding security and to be treated differently.

Harry IS asking to be treated differently, he isn't currently being treated differently.

Harry is the problem. Harry is the problem. It's a massive sulk that he isn't important anymore and to imply to M that it is racism he is acting in an unforgiveable way.

This is what Harry and Meghan's interview has done. Hope they are proud!
If they needed to point the finger of racism then make it direct at the person involved. Now his grandmother is the target of abuse as head of the family. Seriously they are a couple of dumb asres. Thank heavens we don't have to pay for the smeg heads. Good luck America this pair will ruin any chance of people taking equality seriously.

I really think MN should delete this thread now. Despite good posts from intelligent posters the thread is dominated by some really vile attitudes that does MN no favours.

I suppose it does serve as a testament to how far we still have to go as a society.

@Tzigane you will never be able to shut down intelligent debate.

The fact that you think any criticism of MM is racism shows your lack of knowledge. The fact that you can not tolerate even BAME people criticising her because you decide they’re all racist too is sheer ignorance.

Criticism of MM or Harry is not racism. That is why the debate was continued.

No amount of “this thread is racist vile abuse” you and your friends have to resort to saying makes it so.

Tzigane it certainly stands as testament to how some will go to shut down people with differing opinions.

Sorry if you thought Harry was a cool hero - he's shown racist attitudes and make racist remarks and he has called someone in his family a racist without naming them.

He has also wilfully misunderstood and not explained to his wife how unimportant he now is in the royal line-up now William has had children.

He has led his wife to believe that it is because of racism that Archie was not born a Prince and the security issue is entirely misrepresented by him. It is appalling how Harry behaves.

Doesn't fit the narrative though does it.

@Marmaladeagain

Harry is now the equivalent of Prince Edward (who is son of the current Queen and will be the brother of the future King) in the current set up now that William has his own children.

Why are you not shouting that Prince Edward should have full time security and only gets it on official engagements? He is the son of the Queen. Harry will one day be a son of a King, but at the moment he is grandchild of the Queen.

Where' the outrage for Prince Edward's lack of security full time (sarcasm). If Prince Edward decided to live abroad would the taxpayer be paying for his security. No. No No no no ono....non no no

I think lots (including Harry) don't realise how far away from being important at royal events he is now that William has 3 children.

Same will happen to George's children in say 20 years as they will become direct in line and then Charlotte and Louis and their children will become irrelevant again.

Harry is already not important in terms of royal family - so it is disingenuous to try to blame racism. In fact, it is facile.

Eventually when William becomes King (ie. a long time in the future) then Harry would have become (but now won't) the equivalent of Princess Margaret (ie sibling of monarch) and Archie would have been same as Margaret's children in the current set-up, does that help understand how quickly Harry's relevance to royal family is dwindling?

Archie wouldn't have been the equivalent of Princess Margaret's children for a long while yet though, not until William comes to the throne.

Do you know who Princess Margaret's children are off the top of your head? I know some do, but I'm talking about the others that think Harry is a very important royal.....he's not. He's been indulged and thinks he is important, but he's not. Charles knows all this obviously but Harry can only see what he wants NOW I should get NOW.

It's not a fairy-tale, Harry lost his job of direct line to the throne which will now go through George, if something happened to George then it is Charlotte or Louis. Harry is irrelevant but the whole Diana love-in still means people think he's special.

Do you worry about Edward's security? Son of Queen, future brother of King. No didn't think so. Maybe now you'll notice what a fool Harry is making of himself.

Crikey, didn't even think of that perspective. Well said @Marmaladeagain

@Marmaladeagain no matter how many times Harry’s actual real and raw racism is mentioned do you notice how no one responds to that?

.

When ever factual evidence about anything is mentioned they don't respond

You can't argue with false claims and fantasy opinions to hard facts

It is very telling of a fingers in ears halal mentally. Some people just want to blindly follow rather than making informed and considered opinions

*la la la mentality

you will never be able to shut down intelligent debate

One would hope not. While there have been some very intelligent, interesting posts dotted through the thread, unfortunately intelligence is generally exactly what has been lacking. The latest posts are a case in point, attributing to me things I have never said, don't believe etc, it's not worth engaging with.

Truelymadley that front cover has just popped up on my radar and I came on to post almost word for word your post.

Name or naff off. I hope they both feel that airing their dirty laundry in public is going to be worth the backlash. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence would have advised them to the contrary but they obviously know best.

I know, I know... @topmum66

Also calling to shut down the thread. I guess must mean they really don't like the hero Harry being shown as a petulant child.

Is it airing dirty laundry or standing up against racism and sexism?

You are either part of the solution or part of the problem.

And keeping quiet or minimising and excusing these things in UK highest institutions is definitely being part of the problem

@Tzigane

I really think MN should delete this thread now. Despite good posts from intelligent posters the thread is dominated by some really vile attitudes that does MN no favours.

I suppose it does serve as a testament to how far we still have to go as a society.

There have been some brilliant, thought provoking posts here and @Marmaladeagain has made some excellent points today. Most of what you claim is vile and racist has actually been constructively discussing ways in which racism in the royal family has been present and could have been tackled head on. I'm really glad MN have allowed this thread to stand, we have to allow discussions to happen even if they are uncomfortable. It's not enough to sling a bit of mud around and then shout #nodebate. We all have an interpretation, we all have a voice, and we can all learn from each other when we use them.

Getting personal now, huh? Charming

Calling someone racist is pretty personal, don't you think? Or is it supposed to be a compliment?

Someone saying they're the intelligent one because they call me racist - that's personal.

Hope that helps any injured feelings, hun.

@Sprining wasn’t it you that accused me of not being BAME yesterday? And of being racist and sexist because i don’t like MM? Id way that’s a pretty strong personal attack.

Well said Topmum - nonsensical rubbish from the people that want the thread deleted.

@Marmaladeagain a lot of unanswered questions just ‘your racist blah blah your vile hidden racism blah blah’.

Let’s hope Harry has the balls to stop defending a racist family member soon and fucking out him.

Indeed Harry needs to get it out in the open and deal with it properly.

Horrid bullying behaviour to cast the net so wide and play the victim when he's the only one known to have said vile racist slurs.

Some very interesting stuff said about emails and texts messages in the media this week. Eventually they will be made public I am sure.

Though some papers have already spoken to ex staff. Evidence of the palace taking at least two court orders to stop bad press for Harry and Meghan when they were in the UK is available.

@Marmaladeagain especially from two people who view themselves as so against bullying. And who really think they are going to ‘bring people together with compassion’.

I’d say the RF would disagree, their MH now in tatters for payback.

We do really do need to know who the racist is and they can send him/her on a few courses like they did with Harry. Worked wonders.

great post @topmum66 - couldn't agree more with everything you've said.