Do you WANT longer school days and shorter school holidays?

[shadowlily]

YABU- yes I want schools to have longer school days and shorter holidays

YANBU- no I'd rather keep the hours/terms we have.

I keep seeing this is being discussed in the media today, do you think it's likely to happen? Personally I think kids would benefit more from the summer holiday and being able to catch up on the activities they've missed and socialisation with friends. They've been home schooled to keep up with the curriculum (for the most part! I know this might be a contentious statement for some!) but nothing has replaced the play dates, day trips, parties etc. they have missed.

What do you think?

As a parent its the same amount of holiday days to cover

I know my DH (office) and family members (NHS) really struggle to get the weeks annual leave that they want, as their colleagues who are also parents are fighting over preferred weeks out of the 6 available. I think this would be a nightmare if they were all competing for just 3/4 weeks.

@TakeTheCuntOutOfScunthorpe

Longer days and shorter holidays are a good idea, not just for the post-Covid period but generally going forward. The school day should be long and children should be too tired afterwards to do anything other than do homework, eat dinner and go to bed. Ideally my timetable would be something along the lines of

8am - sports
9am - assembly
9:30 to 12 - lessons
12pm - lunch
12:30pm - break
1pm - lessons
3:30pm - sports
5pm - home, unless in detention until 6pm.

Absolutely...and mental health issues show lack of strength of character...so anyone with mental health issues, should continue work until 8pm.

Maybe parents should have babies and enjoy maternity...but when maternity ends, we should shove the kids in the school building and keep them there until they turn 18. We should then hand them back over to their proud parents, just in time to enjoy grandchildren and have someone to look after you in old age.

children should be too tired afterwards to do anything other than do homework, eat dinner and go to bed

So all of the things my friends and I did after school when we were young are not valued at all?

Brownies/Cubs
Ballet/tap/modern
Karate
Latin/ballroom dancing
Trampolining
Swimming
Judo
Athletics club
Piano lessons
Table tennis

How very sad that some people want their children worked to the bone at school, and kept too tired for hobbies and developing talents and skills.

After both of those studies (well the TES article is generalisations rather than study) The EEF did extensive research into summer learning loss and actually found no evidence. The Sage study you quote twelly uses evidence from a long time ago. It has basically been debunked since Gove went , who backed various studies to try and prove himself correct.
Even most Conservatives are dubious about it. (or were in 2015 when it last came up in parliament)

I can't decide if you are being ironic scunthorpe...

@Piggywaspushed

After both of those studies (well the TES article is generalisations rather than study) The EEF did extensive research into summer learning loss and actually found no evidence. The Sage study you quote twelly uses evidence from a long time ago. It has basically been debunked since Gove went , who backed various studies to try and prove himself correct. Even most Conservatives are dubious about it. (or were in 2015 when it last came up in parliament)

If kids don’t fully understand something they’ve learned, they also forget it over the weekend. Should we therefore work them through the weekends too @twelly

@Piggywaspushed

I can't decide if you are being ironic scunthorpe...

I think they were being sarcastic.

That’s the thing isn’t it?

If you try and simply cram information into a child’s head, they aren’t going to remember it.

If you have fewer in the class, you can check everyone understands and it doesn’t matter how much time passes, they still understand.

Also twelly most of that Sage report is not about academic stuff. It is about hunger and poverty : which this government has done the opposite of fuck all about and - yes - once more left schools to sort it all out.

@GrannyRose15

Abaxan

Yes, children need to develop their independent skills but a lot of the time this would be better done in a well-resourced school library than in an under-resourced household.

And young children need their time at home to be free of the stresses of school. Remember children get homework sent home from the age of 5 - and it causes a great deal of unnecessary conflict in homes throughout the country.

Not all primaries send homework. My infant school only sends home reading - we recommend 10-15 minutes reading a day with someone at home. We don't send anything more home.

Does this mean that you don't currently see teaching as a full time job??? My God, try it and see. We don't go home at 3.15 you know. We don't rock up at 8.45 and just ... teach. Lessons don't just appear by themselves

I can't believe people think this, either.

I'm not a teacher, but I have friends who are/were. They are regularly working until late in the evening, always busy catching up on stuff at the weekends and in the shorter holidays and by the time they break up for the summer holiday, they're like zombies with PTSD. It takes 2 weeks before they've turned back into normal people.

I wanted to be a teacher when I was younger. I'm fucking glad I never took up my place at college.

I have QTS and have never worked as a teacher. I qualified at 52, and IME based on my job applications, schools prefer younger teachers, but I would still like to be useful and work with (preferably) secondary school students. I don't need payment but would be happy to work/volunteer for free. I wouldn't be happy to be judged as a teacher on that basis, then treated like a cattle herder.

I'd like to help individual students catch back what they have missed, which I could manage for English and most humanities subjects to at least GSCE standard. That would be interesting. But I think the education establishment will remain impervious to anything that isn't sanctioned by at least two unions.

Those people saying they want shorter school holidays because they have to find childcare to cover the other weeks, are basically saying they don't want to pay for their children to be looked after and they want the state to cover it

Funny how it's always turned into parents not wanting to pay for childcare or engage with their children.

I very much like to spend quality time with my DC. But by law I am entitled to 4 weeks annual leave... Summer holidays are 6 weeks +. I love to use these 4 weeks to have quality family time ... instead of taking odd days off to cover for childcare.
Also, having less holidays is not about the cost of childcare it's about giving children continuity. They are in school with their friends, with adults they know.
With more teaching days, things could be more relaxed, especially for early years and KS1. Make school fun again!
I am happy to pay for this the equivalent I paid out on holiday clubs.

And for the record, I am against longer school days, so will still continue to pay for after school clubs ... only my DC are past that stage. So I would not even benefit from all of this.

exept for knowing that my teens are at school rather than roaming the streets

That was a quick Google www.economist.com/leaders/2018/08/11/school-summer-holidays-should-be-shorter but there are many article studies - yes some are older . The problem is in introducing it - but it is in the interests of the children

Let's just let kids and teenagers have a bit of time for them to hang out with their mates and have some fun, away from parents and teachers.

I'd like school to run 9-5pm with homework and more pe fitted into the extra time. I like the 6 week summer holiday but would be happy with a 4 week summer break and those extra weeks added to other breaks in the year

Education is so much more than the academic aspect as the lockdowns have proved so therefore reduced holidays serves a social and academic needs

Kids tend to forget a lot of stuff that they don't see as relevant or interesting to them. Some kids make themselves remember cos they want to do well. Keeping them in school longer won't help.

@TakeTheCuntOutOfScunthorpe

Longer days and shorter holidays are a good idea, not just for the post-Covid period but generally going forward. The school day should be long and children should be too tired afterwards to do anything other than do homework, eat dinner and go to bed. Ideally my timetable would be something along the lines of

8am - sports
9am - assembly
9:30 to 12 - lessons
12pm - lunch
12:30pm - break
1pm - lessons
3:30pm - sports
5pm - home, unless in detention until 6pm.

That’s less learning time than my child has at the moment. Just more sport time and a longer lunch and assembly every day. There’s actually only 5 hours of learning in that day. It’s not uncommon to do an hour journey to school so when they get back at 6, having got up at 6am how much homework do you think will happen?? What about kids who are talented at music, theatre, dance or any number of extra-curricular activities. Just tough luck can’t do them anymore. Some kids actually want to do degrees and have a career in some of those areas😮

Nope. I want a pared down curriculum and changes that encourage life skills such as budgeting, understanding finance, politics, proper health and social education. Increased PE. Changes to holiday ms I could get on board with but NOT longer school days.

A couple of weeks into lockdown 3 (when DD hadn't been at school for four weeks she obviously relaxed and became much less stressed- just like in the summer holiday). So I don't want shorter holidays as she obviously needs a decent break.

No, no and 1000 times no!

School days are long enough and children spend most of the sunny summer days in classrooms. And I’m not talking about private schools with small classes, swimming pools, tennis courts and surrounded by green fields. I’m talking about ordinary overcrowded classrooms in quite old shabby buildings surrounded by concrete.
And let’s not pretend, the problem is the flexibility of jobs and the availability and cost of childcare/ after school activities, that’s why some parents want longer school days and shorter summer holidays.

Anything like 9-5 has to be optional as it would be really off to deprive all kids of a balanced life just because some want theirs out of the house for longer.

My kids who've been right through school did excellently on 9-3 and their lives would have been crapper if in school 9-5.

Oh, I don't know twelly : how about funding proper summer schemes away from schools? How about providing free meals during holiday times?

You have moved away from your original claim that it could assist academic catch up.

Schools cannot solve all of society's ills by just being open longer and longer.