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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Dh work making people go flexi and take a pay cut

212 replies

Thedarksideofthemoon30 · 28/02/2021 08:31

Dh works for Network rail. He’s been with them roughly 10 years but at his currently job for 3.

He’s a signaller and they are changing the hours from 6/2 - 2/10 6/6 etc to 12 hour days/nights.

But they have announced they need 14 people to go flexi, meaning they won’t get any overtime or Sundays etc. We rely to the overtime and 2 Sundays a month.

If people go flexi he would have to take a £10k pay cut from missing out on the overtime etc.

They said it will be the people who haven’t been there the longest.

Aibu to think this is wrong and the job he applied for wasn’t flexi shift? Can they even make you do it?

It also means he won’t know his shifts until a week or so in advance, which with young children makes things so much more difficult and hard for me to work.

OP posts:
GraduallyWatermelon · 28/02/2021 09:19

I think before covid I would have agreed with you that it's unfair.

But rail networks have been massively affected by covid. Passenger traffic was down to 5% for a significant portion of the previous year, and has been far far below normal this year. People aren't renewing season tickets and many were given partial refund last year's. All rail companies are going to have to make cuts unfortunately.

NerdyBird · 28/02/2021 09:22

If the money you're talking about losing is purely non-guaranteed overtime then he's not taking a pay cut. Cutting back overtime is a standard money saving exercise, and with the probably long-term reduction in rail use it's not surprising.
The rail unions are usually pretty strong so I suggest he joins pronto if he isn't a member.
Lots of people are in this position or have lost jobs and had to take actual pay cuts so this is far from unusual.

PurpleFlower1983 · 28/02/2021 09:24

I can see why they are going to flexi if they are paying people £500 a day overtime for Sundays in a 7 day a week industry. Saving have to come from somewhere and that’s the obvious place to start.

Tinkerbell1010 · 28/02/2021 09:26

I'm also a signaller...I don't understand how changing to 12 hours will require him changing from regular to flexi?

GintyMcGinty · 28/02/2021 09:26

Cutting overtime is a way to reduce costs without making (or reducing the number of) redundancies.

Its quite legal to do.

Network Rail is heavily unionized so this will have been negotiated with the unions.

flamingomingeo · 28/02/2021 09:27

Because relying on overtime is risky, as it can be removed. I work in the emergency services where overtime is nearly always available, and have seen people come to expect it and not live within their means and then come unstuck when overtime is not available. It should always be treated as ‘nice to have, not guaranteed.’

RedcurrantPuff · 28/02/2021 09:27

A lot of companies are doing this, fire and rehire. Some might be genuine but I bet there are a fair number taking the piss and using the pandemic as an excuse to cut terms and conditions.

I’d anticipate the Union to be all over it so he should speak to them.

TulisaIsBrill · 28/02/2021 09:28

If you have kids and rent, check out your universal credit entitlement. Chances are, it could top up pretty much all you ‘lose’ at a rate of 75p in each lost £.

If they are going to play silly beggars, use the system to make the most of it.

Original poster
Thedarksideofthemoon30 · 28/02/2021 09:31

I very much doubt we would be entitled to anything, we don’t even get child benefit x

OP posts:
Backtoschool101 · 28/02/2021 09:32

If they were talking about it pre covid, then you have had a long time to decide if this is right for you. Its not a shock really is it. £500 a day over time is amazing but also very expensive and post covid they probably cant afford this and now think actually this flexi no over time business is the right time to do it so employees have a fairer working day and the workload is spread so they dont rely on over time workers. He can either negotiate, accept it or look for something else. Or if i was you get rid of the car as you said. We did this in the first lock down. I have t had a car for a year now. Its not ideal but saved us a lot!

lightand · 28/02/2021 09:35

@RedcurrantPuff

A lot of companies are doing this, fire and rehire. Some might be genuine but I bet there are a fair number taking the piss and using the pandemic as an excuse to cut terms and conditions.

I’d anticipate the Union to be all over it so he should speak to them.

local government that I know of, do it very frequently
flamingomingeo · 28/02/2021 09:35

@TulisaIsBrill

If you have kids and rent, check out your universal credit entitlement. Chances are, it could top up pretty much all you ‘lose’ at a rate of 75p in each lost £.

If they are going to play silly beggars, use the system to make the most of it.

They’re trying to run a business, not ‘playing silly beggars.’
TryingNotToPanicOverCovid · 28/02/2021 09:35

I think if they're paying so much for a sunday its rather obvious an area for them to cut and to move to not paying overtime.

Tinkerbell1010 · 28/02/2021 09:37

They won't cut Sundays and if they did how would you travel on a Sunday if no one works

lightand · 28/02/2021 09:37

local government fire and rehire, and the rehire is often not quite the same jobs as before either. The "new" jobs, get rejigged.

RedcurrantPuff · 28/02/2021 09:37

One of the unions recently got an interim court order to prevent Tesco doing it, @lightand. It’ll be interesting to see how it pans out, as you say it’s a pretty common tactic.

TimeForTeaAndG · 28/02/2021 09:45

If this was talked about pre-covid then I would guess that it's already been through union negotiations and everything.

He could see if "last in, first onto flexi" is really how it's going to be done, I would think some folk might be happy to go onto flexi if asked.

My DH changed from 8 hours to 12 hour shifts when covid hit (key workers on site with legal minimum staffing levels) and the difference in our home life has been massive. If we had been still needing childcare (I'm wfh so don't need it, noone clutch your pearls, she occupies herself while I work) this year we would have had several days a month fewer because of DH being at home. He is less tired on night shifts because he has plenty of rest time after day12s.

Try and look at the positives that way round. Will it mean someone at home more often to organise dinner rather than takeaway when you both finish work knackered? Less childcare requirements?9

Can he speak to his boss about the assistant manager role and what's happening with that? What does the 12 hour shift rota look like for those not going onto flexi?

TryingNotToPanicOverCovid · 28/02/2021 09:53

@tinkerbell1010 cut the overtime payments like OP is suggesting- not the whole service!

sanfranfibber · 28/02/2021 09:59

@TulisaIsBrill

If you have kids and rent, check out your universal credit entitlement. Chances are, it could top up pretty much all you ‘lose’ at a rate of 75p in each lost £.

If they are going to play silly beggars, use the system to make the most of it.

Jesus this attitude.

How much UC do you think someone earning £500 in a day is entitled to?

NoIDontWatchLoveIsland · 28/02/2021 10:07

£500 for a single days work is a ridiculously high rate of pay to be paying 1 in 7 days. You could be earning around the average income of the UK for only working 4 days a month. No wonder they need to cut that.

lolulop · 28/02/2021 10:15

Unfortunately this is inevitable with lower passenger numbers but my condolences. I guess he either looks for another job or takes this over redundancy. Does the job still pay well?

lolulop · 28/02/2021 10:19

From the management side if someone is getting £10k in overtime, something has gone seriously wrong with the management in that department previously, and it isn't a suprise that they met to correct it now.

Not necessarily lots of police for example would earn that. Many industries pay o/t because it's cheaper then having more staff.

Soontobe60 · 28/02/2021 10:22

@Thedarksideofthemoon30

Why is it an issue he gets £10k from over time and Sundays? On Sundays he earns £500 so it soon adds up.

We don’t rely on it for our bills etc, but it’s nice to have extra once the bills etc are paid.

Tbh we need to get rid of our car and that would save us a lot lol

£500 for one day’s work!!!!! That’s crazy! No wonder he’s not happy. My DH earns this much in one week.
Comefromaway · 28/02/2021 10:24

Is the issue not so much that they are cutting overtime (which isn’t guaranteed and they are entitled to do) but that your husband on flexi is going to be expected to to work Sundays but at the normal rate of pay?

I’d have thought that was a change in his terms/rate of pay that requires proper consultation etc.

doubleleopardy · 28/02/2021 10:26

This is a tricky one for unions because actually they will be fighting for properly staffed services so companies are not reliant on overtime. There is also the issue of work life balance and an expectation of overtime disrupts that.

I'm guessing that there will be consultation over the flexi shifts and people will be able to discuss the impact on their family life and any mitigation they have for not being able to do the new flexi role.