Is anyone really making any actual sacrifices to combat climate change?

[Cam77]

Saw a news article about a well known celebrity who is very outspoken on climate issues having another child, which is of course literally the worst thing you can do in terms of your climate footprint. But anyway it got me thinking: Does anyone make any actual sacrifices/significant life style compromises for climate change? Or do we instead merely big up choices that we would have made for different reasons anyway?

For example, I'm vegetarian and when people ask the reason I'll cite the effect of beef and pork farming on the environment as one reason. But the truth is I wouldn't eat them anyway, as I hate the idea of inflicting suffering on other intelligent mammals. Or sometimes I tell myself not owning a car is me "doing my bit" but the truth is I don't really enjoy driving and don't need a car for work. Anyway, it often seems when you scratch the surface, there are nearly always reasons of immediate self-interest attached.

Of course, people are good at spending a few minutes to sort and separate their rubbish now, and we take more care to turn off lights we're not using. All good. But how many people are really making significant life style compromises for purely altruistic reasons. 1 in 100? 1 in 1000?

We are swapping our heating system to a heat pump this year. We use the excellent public transport instead of running a car (not in UK). We went on holiday by train which was amazing. We eat very little meat and choose high quality.

I’ve made some changes - but I’m not sure they’re sacrifices.
We brought an elect car (Nissan Leaf). It cost a bit more than an equivalent petrol car, but I live it, it’s really fun to drive and it’s saving us money on petrol.
We’ve also decided to significantly cut down on the amount of meat we eat due to the huge impact of the farming industry on Climate Change. This has been a huge sacrifice for my husband, but not really for me, as I like vegetarian food.
Individual actions can have an impact and collectively over time will change things.

I was a vegetarian for years, but animal welfare AND environmental reasons made me become a vegan 2 years ago.

DH and will not fly again (unless they invent electric planes!) so it’s been UK holidays for the last 6 years now. Possibly a European train holiday this summer.

We’re getting solar panels instead of having the driveway done (I would prefer the driveway because it’ll make the house look nicer, but the panels are more important I think). I’m hoping that we can afford an electric family car next time I need to replace mine.

We are trying 🤷🏻‍♀️

... Oh and we only have one child. This is also partly due to my health, but the environment tipped the balance for the decision.

@theleafandnotthetree Absolutely. And then I suppose the issue is how do we prevent rampant consumerism in a capitalist society, ie reduce demand for those products in the first place. I can't see it happening – profit above all else! I wonder if the new, much-feted (but yet to be seen on any meaningful level) 'sharing economy' will actually have a positive impact on emissions.

I do what I can. Drive a hybrid, only drive when I have to. Give money to the RSPB as they are not just about birds, they also have quite a voice and lobby on all sorts of eco issues.
Last time I went on a plane was 1997.
Mainly veggie.

@thecatsthecats I agree with you too and really enjoyed your calm and considered responses to some quite goady comments.

I love this idiotic Mumsnet preaching about how having a child is THE WORST thing you could do for the environment. I’m sure you all feel great listening to that borderline racist David Attenborough overpopulation argument but there are many more pressing things to address. How is ending the human race the answer to saving the human race?!

No not really

I try to do my bit but it’s hard sometimes. i am conscious of the need to do more

Positives
I have just started having British oat milk on reusable glass from the milkman
I Don’t buy multi pack tins wrapped in plastic
I use wild deodorant which has a refillable case
I have stopped buying disposable face wipes.
I sue a lot less disposable cleaning wipes than I once did
I use koh cleaner which comes in a refillable bottle
I use smol dishwasher and washer tablets which are packaged in cardboard. I also use their fabric conditioner which is highly concentrated and comes in bottles you can recycle
I buy who gives a crap loo roll which is recycled and wrapped in paper.
I try to recycle aa much as possible
I give stuff away rather than send it to landfill
I use the eco setting on the dishwasher
I wash clothes on 30 on a short cycle
I rarely use the dryer
I am vegan
I have 1 child
I didn’t fly in 2020 and probably won’t in 2021
I talk to my child about the environment and how to reduce our impact

The negatives and what (if anything) am going to do about it
I need to work on reducing single use plastics
I drive a diesel car which I would like to replace with a hybrid at some point. For now though I am working from home so have reduced mileage,
I like the heating on high
I live in a big house (which costs more to run)
I am not especially careful with water ( not leave taps running)
I have 1 child
I buy stuff I want rather than need (think about each purchase)
I have a dryer (air dry and only use dryer to reduce creases)
I like to go on holiday abroad (reduce this although I have promised DS a trip to florida - last years planned trip was cancelled. Maybe we will do a Europe by train trip or two at some point).

The main ‘sacrifices’ currently are cost related. The real sacrifices like not going on holiday and being cold are harder to do.

Interesting discussion.

Hmm, you’re doing good things. I don’t think there’s a need to be cold or not go on holiday though!

Since we stopped flying in 2016, we’ve done some properly amazing sailing holidays, caught the ferry to France and Spain with bikes, travelled by train to Eastern Europe and Scandinavia, made a lot of city breaks and UK holidays. I don’t feel as though we have missed out.

Likewise with keeping warm. I live in a modern house with really good insulation and draught proofing. Relatively cheap measures to implement and the heating does not kick in much on a day like today.

Yes, my partner of 20 years will make every sacrifice going to be ecologically guilt free. He does all the standard stuff (recycling, not driving, only buying second hand clothes) but has also given up coffee, tea and sugar, alcohol(no nutritional worth so waste of earths resources). He buys everything from the loose shop (which he initiated as our town didn’t have one) local veg stall or baker to avoid any packaging, strictly no palm oil in anything he buys. He’s setting up a car club so we won’t have sole use of our car. He sits in on local council meetings and annoys them with green initiatives. We are currently fitting an air source heat pump as our boiler broke, we fitted solar panels (expensive I know, but using government renewable incentive packages..plus we don’t spend our money on anything else!) He picks bags and bags of litter. We do have 2 kids, but he only wanted 1 (whoops-I didn’t quite Daphne him, but he says he wasn’t aware it was possible). He washed every single Nappy and wipe because he knew I’d find it too hard. It’s so fundamental to him now, that I think if it came down to staying with me or being eco, I’d be gone.
He’s black and white. I do my best, but I annoy him when I get stuff wrong and make bad ecological choices. I’d say it occasionally puts a strain on our relationship. But ultimately I can never argue against his reasoning, because he is right and I do really admire his passion for doing the right thing. Plus he’s really really good looking.

@edgeware

I love this idiotic Mumsnet preaching about how having a child is THE WORST thing you could do for the environment. I’m sure you all feel great listening to that borderline racist David Attenborough overpopulation argument but there are many more pressing things to address. How is ending the human race the answer to saving the human race?!

Most of what we are talking about is NOT about saving the human race, its about trying to ensure that in the future there is a planet liveable for a wide variety of species, that is verdant and not just filled with us and our hangers on (domesticated animals, rats, cockroaches etc). We are ONE of those species, please tell me you dont believe this amazing planet exists only for our use and pleasure

@bluebeach. Plus he's really really good-looking. 🤣. I think you probably bring lots of light and fun into his life regardless of not being 100% when compared to his efforts. He sounds brilliant and shames the rest of us to be honest

travelled by train to Eastern Europe and Scandinavia,

I was planning on traveling by train to vosit my family and then I realised the train just to London at some not godforsaken time making me stay half a night at train station costs me more than a direct flight from my city here to there...
The train one though looked really interesting. So did the river boat one. But I am money conscious person and just can't justify these differences.
I have nonoids though 🙈

No kids, and won't be having any. I haven't flown since 1998 and when I go to Europe, it's on the train or car/ferry, depending on where I'm going.

I've cut down on meat, buy fish from a quayside fishmonger, and try buy produce that is local sourced. I concede that this is easier for me than for many people, as I live on the edge of open countryside and we have a farm shop that is as close as my local Tesco. I've probably walked past cattle and sheep that I have subsequently eaten bits of!

I also don't replace anything that still works (my phone is about 6 years old) and was really pissed off that I had to replace my boiler recently after only 13 years (it needed a part that was nearly as much as the new boiler cost to buy and install). When I need a new washing machine or dishwasher, I get one with the highest energy and water rating that I can afford.

I only do about 4,000 miles a year in a 21 year old car. All the time it doesn't require expensive repairs, I'll hang on to it. I'd prefer to use public transport, but I live semi-rurally and it's expensive and infrequent (a bus every 2 hours, £3.20 flat fare and it only goes 2 miles into town!). If I need to buy furniture, I'll try and find second hand stuff rather than buy new and I rarely buy new clothes.

It's a tricky one. If you're wealthy and travel by private jet, you can claim carbon offset (also privacy and security). Queuing for unreliable buses and trains is less preferable to driving in your comfortable 4x4.
The cost of Covid means more taxes - maybe it's a time to implement green taxation?
Many good points on here.

@PinkyParrot

How many things do you order from Amazon - how many trees were felled to produce all the cardboard boxes needed.

I don't, I boycott them because of their tax-dodging and poor employment practices.

I've been buying more online during the lockdowns, and I've been horrified by how much packaging it generates. And it must be worst be worse to have a van drive to my house to deliver books to one house than it is for me to pop into Waterstones in the nearest big town when I'm going there for shopping anyway.

I have a neighbour who seems to have shedloads of deliveries (which I would never have known if I wasn't WFH) and I wonder if that will continue once we can shop locally again.

I won't be buying processed vegetarian bites which the TV advert claims will help save 'the planet'.

I won’t be sneering at people who are vegetarian or vegan.

@Botanicals

I won’t be sneering at people who are vegetarian or vegan.

I don't sneer at vegetarian or vegan people. I sneer at cynical marketing.

I think you're right OP, I don't know anyone who makes true sacrifices for the environment. I have often thought that I don't sacrifice anything for the environment, even though I have often been described as a green warrior! I don't eat much meat but do have some once a fortnight or so when I feel like it. I've used a menstrual cup for 15 years and think it's so much more convenient and pleasant to use than disposable stuff. I don't use the car much because I love walking. Since having kids, I've used it much more because using public transport with two tired kids - well, that would be a real sacrifice! I don't buy much purely for the pleasure of it - eg, I haven't bought a new pair of shoes for 2 years now. But the truth is we live in a small flat and accumulating things makes me feel anxious and claustrophobic.

I don't agree with people who say that there's no use in individuals making small changes. The reason the planet is suffering is because there are billions of people who consume more than they should. Yes, it's the huge corporations who destroy rainforest to build cattle ranches, but only because there are millions of single individuals who want to buy a lot of cheap meat. Corporations do what people want.

Haven't bought one single item of clothing during lockdown - moving away from fast fashion.
Not having kids
Cancelling my amazon supscription.
Eating less meat.
Buying meat from local butchers, veg from local stalls and dairy from local milkman.
Ensuring that I recycle, give away etc
But mainly ensuring I'm not buying rubbish I don't need, stopping wasting food which I use to be awful at, growing some of my own veg and fruit this year.
Everyone could do more, and people's hand may be tied for lots of reasons. It's about giving people ideas to help.
Ultimately, I'm not having kids. What boggles me is people with children who do the nothing - are you not terrified for their future?

With China's attitude it's pointless trying to guilt individuals into sacrifice.
I don't buy plastic tat, keep mobile phone for donkeys years, don't waste food, have an older car which is well serviced etc... And sits on the drive. Even before covid I would cycle to work as I'm P. T and resent paying parking and petrol out of my small wages.
Used to take 2 foreign holidays every year but my last was 2018 due to child being unable to walk whilst waiting for surgery. We thought last year we could resume and be a normal family but no..
We'll probably not fly until next year. I'm worried the pilots will be rusty so don't want to be the Guinea pigs.

@derxa it’s kind of assuming that people are stupid and you are so much better informed though.

I mean it’s not like the meat industry tries to mislead people ever is it? Or the free range egg suppliers.

Everyone has an agenda when it pays their mortgage.