AIBU to be completely on the fence? Straight men playing 'gay' roles

[Wheresmykimchi]

Article here - www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/showbiz-news/corrie-star-hits-back-after-19618647

Russell T Davies has decided to cast only gay men in roles for an AIDS drama.

Peter Ash , who is a straight man playing a gay man in Coronation Street , disagrees.

I'm usually a dog with a bone , irritating poster on topics I feel passionately about and LGBT is one but on this I just can't decide.

I can see Russell's point given the nature of the drama , and I'm never sure I agree with people playing 'gay' , in theory

But then I look at the gay characters in soaps in recent years , Peter's character being am excellent example along with Aaron Lindsay in Emmerdale , Kate Connor and Sophie Webster in Coronation Street , and see Peters point that the whole idea is that there is no such thing as acting 'gay', they are playing people.

I'm so on the fence I've got splinters. AIBU?

@Jaypreen

Your'e reaching back a bit there aren't you?

The battles for acceptance are won. There's nothing 'special' about being gay - there never was - prejudice has largely vanished - hurrah! Time to move on. To continue to think, speak and act as though (British) homosexuals are beleaguered and victimised, [as though sexuality is even all that important] is damaging - but also strangely reactionary of you!

That just isn't true, though. Prejudice hasn't vanished. People still get beaten up for being gay in the UK; children in schools still get bullied.

I don't feel very strongly at all about this particular issue with gay actors. But to generalise and say that prejudice has largely vanished is just wrong.

Seriously, the only people who seem to care about gayness are gays themselves. It's all they ever bang on about.

Davies is clearly trying to drum up publicity for his series, which may or may not be shaping up very well..

@HmmSureJan I think one of the large problems is that most writers are men, until we have more successful female writers I don’t think representation will change enough.

Its also the type of gay women who are represented, there are more shows/films about gay male teenagers or with gay male teenagers, but far fewer about gay female teenagers.

@SnowflakeCulture

They are not straight anyway, even acting kissing is still kissing, if they were truly straight they wouldn't do it - so it's a non-issue!

Lol ok

@Jaypreen

SimonJT

You are attempting to divert the discussion.

I honestly didn't even know this Russell T Davies bloke is gay, but also it had never crossed my mind to give his sexuality a second's consideration.

I just knew him simply as the bloke who wrote Doctor Who scripts. How many other writers of Dr Who scripts can people name?

So how does the fact that he's famous square with him being a member of an "oppressed minority"?

This who geek could name a huge number of them.

Being famous or successful doesn’t stop him being from an oppressed minority, just as it wouldn’t stop a black person or a woman being oppressed.

Oppression is a really important thing to consider in casting, if you can’t discuss it you can’t actually discuss the article.

All people get beaten up and of course there's prejudice. My nephew was beaten half to death in South London for the crime of being a white boy. Or so his assailants informed him.

If actors can only act in roles that reflect what they actually are, is there any point in becoming an actor at all? Surely the clue is in the word "act" which means that the idea is to be good enough to convince the audience that you are the character you are playing, even though you aren't - if you get my drift!

Why go to drama school at all? Just learn to impersonate

I long for the days when such things are irrelevant. What relevance does anyone's sexuality have to how good an actor they are? We do seem to be going backwards with putting people into smaller and smaller boxes.

All people don't get beaten up for their sexuality, though. That's the point.

There is clearly prejudice and violence against gay people because they're gay.

I do not think this issue is about acting ability; I think it's about representation. As I said.

Of course prejudice from irrational individuals exists.

Name a gay actor who has been "oppressed" then? Give us an incident date, location. Who were the people involved and what was the role he/she was refused due to their sexuality ?

The person playing Dr Who at present is just a woman pretending to be a Timelord. How on earth can he do that authentically without the lived experience?

@VanGoghsDog

But maybe it's a representation issue as opposed to an acting one...

Yes. Except then you get to the situation Netflix are in where they have mandated that every show must have a trans person. Not actually playing a trans person, but playing the sex they identify as.

It's bizarre.

Is this true? Do you have any info? Only I’ve googled and can’t find anything. Would like evidence before I invest energy in being outraged.

@Jaypreen

All people get beaten up and of course there's prejudice. My nephew was beaten half to death in South London for the crime of being a white boy. Or so his assailants informed him.

If actors can only act in roles that reflect what they actually are, is there any point in becoming an actor at all? Surely the clue is in the word "act" which means that the idea is to be good enough to convince the audience that you are the character you are playing, even though you aren't - if you get my drift!

Why go to drama school at all? Just learn to impersonate

You are purposely missing the point.

White actors playing a black character isn’t acceptable. The same should be applying to straight people in gay roles, able bodied people pretending to be disabled.

It isn’t about quality of acting, you know that, its that minorities are still treated unfairly and are at a disadvantage.

If gay people were treated equally it wouldn’t matter who played a gay role. If black people were treated equally it wouldn’t matter who played a black figure. If women were treated equally it wouldn’t matter if a female character was turned into a male one.

Actors are actors - they are there to play the part, and hood ones do it convincingly.

We don’t expect actors playing villains to actually be evil, or superheroes to actually have supernatural powers.

Gay can play straight straight can okay gay, so long as they are good actors.

I think RTD has missed the point of "acting".

What about actors who prefer to keep their sexuality private? What box do they get put into?

Obviously a straight actor can play a gay character well.

But until it's not just conceivable but normal that an out gay or lesbian actor can find work and be accepted at the top of the profession then yes, gay and lesbian people in the industry who can influence the jobs they get is perfectly within their rights to ringfence them like this.

How many out gay or lesbian actors have there been who have headed an action franchise or romantic film or even won an Oscar playing a straight character? As an industry and as a society they're not permitted those roles yet (while by contrast, straight men who play gay are lauded for their "bravery").

Your perceptions of victimhood aside SimonJT. The point is absolutely as clear as day to me as well as it is to anyone with a scrap of common sense.

The point you're missing is that to follow this argument to its natural conclusion, only straight actors should play straight roles. What’s more, it promotes the idea that gay characters can only ever be that — gay characters; that their sexual preference defines them and that's that. Any other trait is almost incidental.

Now will you tell me if the gay acting community will be happy to be frozen out of all non-gay roles?

Unsure about this one.

Being famous or successful doesn’t stop him being from an oppressed minority, just as it wouldn’t stop a black person or a woman being oppressed.

I feel uncomfortable saying someone like Obama is an oppressed minority while a white under class school boy in the city is not oppressed.

@Jaypreen

Your perceptions of victimhood aside SimonJT. The point is absolutely as clear as day to me as well as it is to anyone with a scrap of common sense.

The point you're missing is that to follow this argument to its natural conclusion, only straight actors should play straight roles. What’s more, it promotes the idea that gay characters can only ever be that — gay characters; that their sexual preference defines them and that's that. Any other trait is almost incidental.

Now will you tell me if the gay acting community will be happy to be frozen out of all non-gay roles?

I have no victimhood.

That wouldn’t be the natural arguement as straight people are not oppressed so their roles don’t require protection, just as while roles don’t require protection.

Unless you're saying that gay actors don't want parity. They want special privilege? The right to play both sexualities but straight actors cannot expect to do the same? This leads to harmony and fairness for you does it?

White actors playing a black character isn’t acceptable. The same should be applying to straight people in gay roles, able bodied people pretending to be disabled.

White people shouldn't play black people because blacking up is offensive and also, pretty obviously, appearance is a factor. Gay people and straight people look the same. Able bodied people sometimes have to play people with disabilities because often there are scenes that cannot be done (I'm thinking of specific roles where someone is a wheelchair user but there's a 'before' scene). There was discussion about an NT person playing someone with autism and that some scenes would have been incredibly traumatic for someone who had autism.

Black people can't play white roles either. So unless there are good black roles, and white people don't take them, black actors get nothing. But gay men play straight men all the time.

@Josette77

I think actors are paid to act. I don't see the issue. Can gay actors play "straight"?

NPH played Barney Stinson (HIMYM) for years. Mind you, NPH is a fantastic actor and is perfect in every way - from his gorgeous family to having multiple talents, not just acting ability. (His husband guest-starred in HIMYM as another straight character too.) So, yes, all good actors can play straight or gay characters very successfully.

I do think that the arts in general is one (one of very few?) industries where there is probably very little discrimination against gay people?

I know I say that as a straight man not in that industry, so genuine question.

@donquixotedelamancha

Probably best off that trans people play trans roles as generally you can tell the actor is trans anyway so it may as well work in their favour (ie Greys anatomy and also Discovery

This makes no sense to me. The lass in GA would be fine playing a bloke (albeit not a meathead) but the one in discovery looks like a girl- all she's done is describe herself as non-binary after getting a role as a NB character.

Things like sexuality and personal feelings of identity should have no bearing on any roles.

Even physical characteristics are irrelevant to lots of characters.

for discovery, i meant Grey, who is trans, not the adira, who is non-binary (and makes perfect sense for the character as they are the minds/memories of many people of different sexes from the past)

I don't think the greys actor passes as a man, so in any event, if they are playing a man, I'd be waiting for a trans reveal at some point.

Its an entirely "natural argument" that's why you can't address it without employing your adolescent intersectional buzzwords.