To think mandatory video calls is a ridiculous request?

[Lizzie523]

After nearly a year of working from home our manager has requested we all turn our cameras on for every daily team meeting (which is every day).

I can't say what my colleagues reasons are for turning theirs off some days, but I tend to do it on days my mental health isnt great or I've had a terribly sleepless night due to the stress of this whole situation. Probably once or twice a week. They are arguing we should appear like we were in the office - but in the office we got on with our work and were not having a daily meeting or sitting in front of all our co workers faces.

The meetings are usually pointless check ins where no one has a thing to say. It is always the same extroverts talking about personal stuff. The fact the videos on is now mandatory because they say so has annoyed me quite a bit. AIBU?

Genuinely gobsmacked that people are trying to call a video conference call a "control technique" or "bullying" bloody hell some of you are in for a rude awakening when you have to return to the office.

Having a live camera on 9-5 watching you all day is unacceptable but this is a video meeting. Im surprised some of you still have jobs if you think a reasonable reason to refuse a meeting is just "I don't want to". You couldn't say that in a daily morning meeting in the real world.

I think YABU. This is your employer, not your mate. If they want to see your face to make eye contact, improve team bonding, get a sense of your mood etc that is their prerogative. You sound like a real snowflake to be honest, it’s not about you, it’s about your work and your team. You’re going to draw much more attention to yourself by refusing. I hate it when people don’t have their camera on as I can’t tell if they’re there, don’t know how they’re reacting, and suspect they’re probably not actually listening or engaged. And I’m not extrovert. The only exception is a 2/3 person call where a person explicitly explains at the start why their camera isn’t on (normally a walking meeting) then continues to fully engage in the conversation, I think that’s fine.

I'm confused because cameras on causes tech glitches & more garbled speech, plus you get the distracting background effects (from fake backgrounds, I didn't like using one). I don't have a dedicated workspace so my background was Lego for a while, or a dirty wall & someone's bed (now wall painted). I don't need to see people to communicate.

You couldn't say that in a daily morning meeting in the real world

I've declined to attend daily meetings before because I don't feel they're a valuable use of my time/or i have other priorities

I disagree. If you are working your camera should be on. Would you sit in the office with your face covered?
What a silly thing to say.
In the office people are often obscured by their screens/looking down at papers etc on their desk/talking to colleagues while not even at desks (maybe side by side making tea etc).
Not at all the same as being full frontal on Zoom with your face appearing as large as multiple people make it on their own screens.
I think the employers are trying to treat the OP and her colleagues like children. I'd like to hear what the HR department's rationale for it is. And what they plan to do if people do not comply.

@Lizzie523

I quite agree with you *@Ciaobaby92*. Why give people a hard time for a small thing when we are all working hard?

I also have endometriosis and I simply wont turn my camera on on bad days when I'm on the couch face contorted with pain!

Then you should take a sick day, as you would need to do if you were in the office seeing people face to face.

why do a meeting via zoom if no ones turning their camera on?

Doesn't Zoom have text chat, slide/document/file sharing and screen sharing as well as voice and video?

Anyway, if a big video meeting is wasting your time you can usually pull a Word document or browser over the meeting window and get on with whatever you need to do while listening. You'll still be looking at your screen as if fascinated. Just don't forget you're in view

@alienspiderbee but that isn't this situation here, declining a specific meeting because you are busy or feeling unwell that day isn't the same as saying 'I don't want to do daily video meetings...because I don't want to'.

I hate being on video for the daily teams call as I'm trying to homeschool simultaneously and kids are around. It feels intrusive. Its my home not the office for gods sake cant I have some privacy. Fortunately there's a mix of people just phoning in or being on camera and its up to us.

Video meetings are much more unpleasant than face-to-face contact. It's not possible to make eye contact and it's impossible to know what other people are looking at. Not all platforms allow a virtual background so they are also a bit intrusive. The bandwidth requirement, for the internet that I fund since it's my home, is much higher with the camera on. And why the heck would I wear office clothes at home where small children are likely to be charging around? I put the camera on when I want to speak; otherwise, I generally leave it off.

I think it's incredibly rude to keep your camera off. I was taking part in a training course recently and most of the participants (who had paid for the training and presumably actually wanted to be there) had their cameras off. I thought what a bunch of arseholes! One would keep typing stupid questions in the chat, questions that had already been covered so god knows what she was doing as she wasn't listening.

It was a week long course and on day three the instructor asked if everyone could switch them on. I'm surprised it took her so long. People would also be there with bowls of cereal munching away and one guy smoked and another vaped throughout Bizarre behaviour. If you wouldn't do it face to face you shouldn't do it on screen IMO. I know it can be awkward on zoom, no one loves it, but as adults you should be able to get over it and get on with it.

It's another one of those 'it depends' scenarios.

High performing individuals don't tend to need cameras on to perform well. I've been in loads of calls without cameras in which the objective of the call was met/exceeded and everyone contributed.

However, I have also been in meetings with less confident people who I can see, on camera, trying to get a word in. The visual aid allows me to create a conversational opening to hear what they have to say.

I have also been on calls with easily distracted individuals who clearly use the lack of camera to go off and do something else, expecting to just chime in with a "I agree" every now and again.

I have also worked in places that are genuinly supportive - where cameras might be used as an aid to understanding what's happening for each person and providing them the support to do what they can.

And I have worked in places that are not supportive, where cameras might be used to catch people out or where managers have very poor management skills and instead use controlling behaviour to feel like a a manager.

How well I would take to a mandory 'cameras on' depends on the environment I was working in and what I perceived the genuine reason for it to be.

@dontdisturbmenow

All you managers assuming that if people don't have their camera on it means they are hiding the fact they're not paying attention - either you are hiring the wrong people, or you are paranoid. Either way you need to take a look at yourself Or maybe because they have very good reasons to suspect that sadly, some people associate working from home with slacking, people who when monitored closely, as in in the same building will do reasonable work.

Not everyone is naturally dedicated and diligent with work. Many still operate very much as if they are still at school, trying to get away with doing as little work as possible and only do what will otherwise get them into trouble.

I'm still to read a valid reason why cameras can't be on for a meeting and totally agree that talking to a screen is just not pleasant.

A valid reason - if there are lots of people, it can cause the tech platforms (zoom, Teams etc) to glitch and lag, whereas if you have the cameras off it doesn't glitch.

And if you think people are slacking, introduce performance metrics and manage the slackers.

This is at least an honest response... they get to decide on the rules, not me although this wasn't your original argument and misses the point that I was making. Your original post also sounded a bit more like 'I get to decide the rules, not you' vs some other 'they' deciding, but perhaps I was mistaken.

...another vaped throughout confused Bizarre behaviour. If you wouldn't do it face to face you shouldn't do it on screen IMO

Personally, I wouldn't have an issue. I think the reason not to vape in person is because it exposes the other person to the vaping fumes. That obviously doesn't happen over video and the sight (alone) of vaping is of no consequence to me.

Why does the MH of those who does like having cameras on take precedence over the those who need the visual? sparticuscaticus has repeatedly mentioned challenges for those with hearing impairments.

From my perspective, starting a new job remotely and going into meetings week after week where all I saw were black squares with initials on was one of the most isolating and demoralising experiences of my working life - it was very challenging to get any sense of how my new team worked without visual cues.

Communication is more efficient with cameras on generally but it sounds like your meetings are a little pointless anyway. I host several meetings a week and cameras are off with everyone muted if its a big call. Smaller calls people choose if they want the camera on, I would say maybe 10% of the meetings I make cameras compulsory because the plan for the meeting/topic being discussed needs everyone to be able to communicate 100% effectively or someone is giving a presentation and it is actually very hard to effectively present to empty boxes.
Are your company actually expecting you to be sat in your work attire? when I ask for cameras on I don't care if people are sat on the sofa/in comfy clothing/haven't bothered with their hair etc.

Oh my word, reading these comments makes me glad I work for who I do. Have been WFH home since March last year and I have had my camera on three times, once was for a team photo and the other two times for summer and xmas break catch up. We have our teams calls every morning at 8am and not once have we been asked to have our camera on. We have a table of actions similar to our whiteboard and go through everything as we would have done when were in the office. All our calls our presenter automatically puts everyone on mute this is to stop background noise etc and you turn it of when you want to speak. Cameras being on cause your bandwidth to slow done and issues with the meeting aswell. All through this pandemic the factory has been kept running, material has been ordered, going in and product shipped out to the customer with no hassle. Also had numerous audits, implemented three new systems for different ways of working, training etc aswell as fixing all the issues we have too . All without the need for the camera to be one. This is proof that your staff is doing what they are being paid to do, not by having the camera on.

I host several meetings a week and cameras are off with everyone muted if its a big call

How do you know they are even in the room listening?

It's not for you to decide just like you didn't get to decide at school.

Didn't comply with arbitrary pointless rules at school, don't comply with them now.

And yes I did well both academically and professionally.

@Atrixie

I disagree. If you are working your camera should be on. Would you sit in the office with your face covered?

We have a rule that all cameras are on for all meetings and we prefer that people aren’t muted either.

Does that not get a bit noisy? If everyone has mics on I often find there's quite distracting echoes and in a meeting with 10-40 people that I'm often in cameras are almost pointless.

I do have a few people who prefer cameras on in smaller meetings or 1:1 calls for a feeling of human interaction which is fine, but on at all times is too much especially when it's a daily check in.

@Catplanter

It's not for you to decide just like you didn't get to decide at school.

Didn't comply with arbitrary pointless rules at school, don't comply with them now.

And yes I did well both academically and professionally.

This is part of the (unfair) reality - some people, with valued skillsets and/or seniority and/or financial freedom DO get to decide for themselves. They will wfh, cameras off, in their PJs or hoodies, wandering off to fuss the cat - if that's what they want. If not given the choice to shape their working practice in a way that suits them, will simply go and work elsewhere.

Sometimes that won't matter to the company who will simply replace
them with someone better suited to the company; sometimes it will matter because it will be hard/impossible to find a suitable replacement, depending on the market for those skills.

Others do not have that same level of choice, sadly.

I wonder if there's an age split? If you've been taking part in telephone conferences for well over a decade are you less likely to suddenly think that video is essential?

I wish my colleagues would put the cameras on for morning briefing - wfh is so lonely. But no one should be made to.

I think it's incredibly rude to keep your camera off.

Unless everyone has excellent bandwidth, video often works badly and stops other people hearing properly. Hearing voices matters more to communication and learning than seeing faces. Does everyone who trained with you have such excellent bandwidth at home? Mine's pretty good but I still turn my camera off if someone else is struggling, unless I'm presenting and sometimes even then if I'm showing slides. Because that is polite.