To be shocked at how normal everything looks in New Zealand?

[GoldenLabbie]

Huge crowds seeing the New Year. No masks, no social distancing. You wouldn’t know that the rest of the world is in the grip of a pandemic looking at those scenes. How did we manage to get it so wrong but they got it so right? When you look at that you realise how the rest have screwed up so badly don’t you? I wonder what they make of all?

It wasn't hindsight, people were jumping up and down screaming at them to act at the time. Back in January and February.

But there were (possibly still are) more people moaning that lockdown is unnecessary and how we're penalising the poor young people for a condition that is low risk for most, etc.

Aucklander here. The strength of anti NZ feeling here is very odd. As are some of the misunderstandings about the country. Here in Auckland we are pretty densely populated with a lot of public transport. Gone are the days when you drive everywhere and park for free in the CBD. There was also a lot of international travel (~7 million arrivals a year www.stats.govt.nz/information-releases/international-travel-december-2019 stats. I know several families where one worker used to travel to Oz weekly.

I reckon we have done well because of the following:

Strong leadership, following the science
Responding early
Closing our borders
Clear communication of simple, easy to follow rules. (Daily bulletins)
Efficient track and trace (No idea how much it cost so suspect it wasn't significant)
Hard lockdown with schools shut
High testing rates
Compliance for the common good
Enforcement of lockdown by police (DH was stopped frequently but politely during lockdown)

Very different to the UK response.

I find NZ to be much more community minded, which I believe is down to our large Pacific and Maori populations. Protecting the Pacific has also been a factor in our lockdown. Some Pacific nations could be very vulnerable. The 1918 flu pandemic killed 1/5th of the population in Samoa for example. As a previous poster mentioned, we have contracts to buy and supply vaccines for several of our Pacific neighbours.

Jacinda believed that best way to protect the economy was to protect people. Our economy is doing pretty well and will end the year only a few % down. I lost my job but that is rare in our social circle.

It's very strange watching the UK from here. Our friends and family around the world are never far from our thoughts. I don't really care how countries tackle the pandemic, as long as it works. It seems that the UK is determined to continue along a path which isn't working, and refusing to learn from what has succeeded elsewhere.

Kia kaha and arohanui to all.

Same as Aus.
One arsehole ruins it for the rest, so self isolation moved to managed quarantine (with a few fuck ups including the current Sydney one)

Well I for one (from Aus) was shocked and horrified that in the UK you could come straight home from Italy in March/April and didn’t have to quarantine (with checks and fines for non compliance) for any period of time and could send your kids straight to school as long as they didn’t have symptoms.

Many of us here were horrified too. It was so unbelievably stupid.

@SkinnyMinnieee

It wasn't hindsight, people were jumping up and down screaming at them to act at the time. Back in January and February.

But there were (possibly still are) more people moaning that lockdown is unnecessary and how we're penalising the poor young people for a condition that is low risk for most, etc.

That's because we do repeated lockdowns here, followed by then being encouraged to mingle for Christmas, hit the pub with our mates and travel abroad. What's the point? It's a total waste of time.

The ad hoc lockdowns are ripping the economy to pieces for no enduring health benefit. The vast majority of people were 100% on board with one good lockdown at the start - indeed, offices and staff were already anticipating and planning for it in February with absoutely no opposition. It was supported. The problem was that we kept the border open, then as soon as lockdown ended we encouraged holidays abroad and bars and unis and the summer was one enormous piss up and covid spreading event all over the UK and Europe.

Stupidity seems to be the whole UK govt strategy. Staggering from one stupid choice to the next.
Stupidity and the least scientifically logical choice 1st everytime.

No quarantine from returns from Spain, the fact you could holiday in the rest of Europe in summer was Extremely odd.

@Turangawaewae

Aucklander here. The strength of anti NZ feeling here is very odd. As are some of the misunderstandings about the country. Here in Auckland we are pretty densely populated with a lot of public transport. Gone are the days when you drive everywhere and park for free in the CBD. There was also a lot of international travel (~7 million arrivals a year www.stats.govt.nz/information-releases/international-travel-december-2019 stats. I know several families where one worker used to travel to Oz weekly.

I reckon we have done well because of the following:

Strong leadership, following the science
Responding early
Closing our borders
Clear communication of simple, easy to follow rules. (Daily bulletins)
Efficient track and trace (No idea how much it cost so suspect it wasn't significant)
Hard lockdown with schools shut
High testing rates
Compliance for the common good
Enforcement of lockdown by police (DH was stopped frequently but politely during lockdown)

Very different to the UK response.

I find NZ to be much more community minded, which I believe is down to our large Pacific and Maori populations. Protecting the Pacific has also been a factor in our lockdown. Some Pacific nations could be very vulnerable. The 1918 flu pandemic killed 1/5th of the population in Samoa for example. As a previous poster mentioned, we have contracts to buy and supply vaccines for several of our Pacific neighbours.

Jacinda believed that best way to protect the economy was to protect people. Our economy is doing pretty well and will end the year only a few % down. I lost my job but that is rare in our social circle.

It's very strange watching the UK from here. Our friends and family around the world are never far from our thoughts. I don't really care how countries tackle the pandemic, as long as it works. It seems that the UK is determined to continue along a path which isn't working, and refusing to learn from what has succeeded elsewhere.

Kia kaha and arohanui to all.

This this this! Says everything I'm too tired to type.

Happy new year @Turangawaewae
Enjoy your wonderful freedoms.

All the people rushing home to England from holidays abroad when quarantine was introduced for the countries they were currently holidaying in, so they could avoid quarantine but not the potential of spreading the virus. Determined to go on holiday in the first place without thinking that they might be spreading the virus. There are too many people in this country just thinking of themselves. Not like NZ buying vaccines for their Pacific neighbours. Probably be an outcry in this country if we bought vaccines for other people.

There was actually a thread one or two weeks ago where the OP was really angry about the Isle of Man buying some vaccines off the UK. She thought they should not be given anything yet as their cases are almost 0 and thought that sending a few hundred jabs to the IoM would delay the whole of UK's vaccination schedule.

Probably be an outcry in this country if we bought vaccines for other people.

www.gavi.org/news/media-room/gavi-welcomes-uk-funding-pledge

Just to add to the debate- I’m a Brit living in NZ and few things to clarify, some have been mentioned before...

Auckland is a similar size and population to say Birmingham- yes nz as a whole is lesser populated but we have large cities that are densely populated and we managed lock down compliantly just fine.

Tourism is less than 6percent of GDP and our economy is back on a good ground, so our go hard and fast approach has not decimated our economy like some misinformed posters previously commented.

The government has made some astounding contributions in committing to purchase vaccinations for our pacific neighbours, supporting entire other nations financially and logistically in their plight against covid.

I’m been amazed at the efforts and communication from the government and how easy it has been to follow to the rule without needing to be suspicious or concerned about things like tracer apps- seems to be a good level of trust.

But, and these are big buts,

Our infrastructure is different, so whilst I don’t think the population size is the reason, our border controls were far stricter and easier to manipulate to suit plus we have an ability to be largely self sufficient In terms of energy, food production etc (still upsets me that I can’t buy melon and similar seasonal foods other than in the peak of summer even without closed borders) so border closure seemed a fair option. Note our ports are still wide open for import/export.

I don’t think we’ve seen the worst of the economic hit - with the rest of the world struggling, that is bound to have a knock on effect during this year.

I haven’t seen my family for a year, and my baby who was born during first lock down has yet to meet his grandparents, cousins, aunts and uncles etc. I’m not sure when he will get to meet them to be honest as no one is allowed in the country at all. It’s very sad.

I feel safe in NZ and and am grateful I live here especially right now, but I miss everyone something rotten.

Even less do I understand why people are still excusing our government, when you only have to look at other comparable countries and see how much better they have done.

Which countries are you calling comparable?

Letting skiers back in and sending dc to school was crazy, I thought it at the time

On a purely numbers POV NZ had 105 cases on lockdown that is so incredibly low. When would our equivalent date have been? Given Chinese tourism numbers.

And at that number what was the ROW doing?

I’m ready to be convinced we could have done the same but based on numbers and facts.

Also there was an astute poster questioning direct flights from Wuhan around Jan 21. We should have stopped them although everyone should have, 40 plus countries reacted to our new variant but very very few did to Wuhan. But this is largely to do with the WHO’s guidance.

We, in NZ, had 48 hours warning that we would be going into total lockdown. That's a lockdown that was stricter than your current tier 4.
We listened to our leaders, they inspired confidence, they gave us the facts.
So we got on with it.
Every day, every single day, at 1pm, the PM and Director of Health went on live national TV and social media and answered questions, live.
We closed our borders.
Then it stopped and we were free.
Yes, we are smaller etc but imagine if the UK had taken the same approach, how different would it be...
If the UK had closed and kept it's borders shut.
Our borders are STILL shut. It's pretty devastating for those of us who are separated from family overseas. But they are STILL closed and there is no hope of them opening, whereas in the UK you are still planning holidays!

I have to stress - our lockdown was nothing like your ‘lockdowns’.

The reason our lockdown worked, and other countries’ ‘lockdowns’ haven’t, is because we did, actually, lockdown.

@KrisAkabusi

They had a proper lockdown and shut the borders. Strict rules that the UK decided would be unacceptable.

The PM decided, not the UK population.

The difference between the UK and NZ was the choices made by their leaders.

@TheOneLeggedJockey

I have to stress - our lockdown was nothing like your ‘lockdowns’.

The reason our lockdown worked, and other countries’ ‘lockdowns’ haven’t, is because we did, actually, lockdown.

We got numbers incredibly low after first peak but the objective wasn’t the same

Do you think the U.K. could have done the same - what date would you go for to have done it?

In terms of countries that are comparable, all are comparable in terms of what worked and what didn't, and none precisely comparable as every country is unique.

The bottom line is - the UK government totally fucked up.

We look at our numbers of dead, our economy now - both could have been better.

The modelling shows if we had locked down one week earlier at the start, 21,000 fewer would have died. Plus far less covid circulating for us to (try and fail to) deal with post-lockdown.

Those failures belong to this government and our PM.

Hard not to feel pure envy when looking at New Zealand's celebrations last night.

We even allowed flights from China for ages through March , I think even into April. God knows why it took them so long to ban flights from there. With hindsight it wouldn’t have worked anyway because the virus got in more from people returning from ski holidays but it would have been a valid starting point!

One week earlier would not get us to NZ situation. Germany numbers are better but they are feeling the strain too right now. People are fed up there too.

I have family in another zero Covid place and it’s great for them but it has been easier to compare the situation from the start

They locked down at times with just a handful of cases. Can you imagine the outrage here if we did a full lockdown with just a handful of cases??

New Zealand is now 100% reliant on the vaccine working, and more importantly working to stop onward transmission, otherwise their tourist industry and therefore economy will collapse.

Who's going to bother flying 24 hours (or other long haul flights from elsewhere in the world) to then have to isolate for a minimum of 5 days before starting their holiday?!

It's a hell of a gamble, and I imagine they will have some tough times over the next couple of years as a result.

I don't think there is any perfect solution to this mess.

Excellent leadership that is collectively respected by the people

Hard and fast lockdown early

Smaller population

Much better decisions earlier, implemented and followed

@Whatelsecouldibecalled

Excellent leadership that is collectively respected by the people

Hard and fast lockdown early

Smaller population

Much better decisions earlier, implemented and followed

Early on the curve

Date wise around same time as U.K.

105 v 100k or whatever daily cases