To expect dog walkers to keep their giant dogs on leash around other peiple

[Thewithesarehere]

I am still quite sick after seeing a dog, nearly my DC’s size, running after my DC knocking them to the ground and running over them.
DC is covered in mud. I was taking a picture of them running to me and it happened in a flash. I shouted at the dog owner who something like put your own children on leash.
Why the hell people don’t keep such huge dogs and then let them off leash in a public park around children? DV is covered in mud, shivering and complaining that their leg hurts where it hit a rock and that they are scared of dogs. I wish I had done more but don’t know what else I could have done.
AIBU in feeling bloody furious?

Lol at pillock being offensive and getting deleted but threats of violence and false claims are OK to stay up.

Oh but LST we are the evil militants remember 😉

Those data, 6-year old actually, are more than enough to bring in new legislations, regardless of what has happened in the last few years and post-COVID (these dogs are going away once we get out the other end).

For example:

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7316443/

You will find a number of other resources, one Google away, if you don’t want to go to more science-oriented sources like PubMed.

I will not start a new thread, you can swamp this one all you like. So many people have picked up important resources from here, including myself.

I will ask one last time: how many incidents are too many?
And I will give you the answer for my family: four.

This is where I leave it.

My dog has had zero incidents OP. ZERO! So as I have said all along he shouldn't suffer. Carry on your pointless journey. I hope you get jumped on by an out of control squirrel next time you're at the park!

I’m a bit confused as to why you posted that study.
It’s American for one thing and different laws, cultural beliefs etc mean it may not necessarily be relevant to the UK.

Secondly, I’ve only skimmed it and will read in detail shortly but that study appears to be basically centred around reducing dog stress through the pandemic, a major source of dog stress is insufficient exercise and being kept on lead which hampers normal dog communication.

How does it support your argument that dogs are inherently dangerous and need to be leashed 24/7?

@Thewithesarehere once you've told me how that study about how coronavirus has increased dog stress supports your argument for leash law (which would increase dog stress further) perhaps yolo could be so kind as to explain how leash law will stop Spain’s feral dog problem?

I’m still waiting...,

From this one, the figure on the rise in incidences is a good example of how irresponsible dog owners have led to an increase in incidents during this pandemic.
As an example of the use of these data could be a temporary measure during this pandemic and any other similar future situations.
That’s just one example of the use of these data. I am looking into more local data as well to see what I can find.

I am quite astonished at the literature that is out there. I never imagined there would be so much evidence out there.
Anyhow, please go on and fill the thread. Thanks

From this one, the figure on the rise in incidences is a good example of how irresponsible dog owners have led to an increase in incidents during this pandemic
That’s not what the study said.

It said that dogs are picking up on owners stress around coronavirus and dogs are being given less exercise/stuck in a house with noisy children which has increased dog stress in combination with parents too busy to supervise adequately has led to an increase in dog bites over the pandemic.

It said nothing about owners being irresponsible.
It said nothing about keeping dogs on lead.

So I’ll ask again, how does it support your argument that all dogs should be exercised only on lead.

I am looking into more local data as well to see what I can find
Good, find me a study specifically showing a link between off lead exercise and increased bites.
I suspect you wont be able to.

I am quite astonished at the literature that is out there. I never imagined there would be so much evidence out there
What literature?!
There are studies and statistics showing an increase in bites yes.

However.

There are no studies (that I am aware of) finding a link between off lead exercise and aggression to people.

When your whole thread is centred around the importance of keeping dogs on lead, how do you expect to get anywhere with no evidence suggesting exercise on lead would reduce dog bites?!

The current evidence suggests the vast majority of dog bites occur in the home, by the family dog, to a child under 5.

Lead only exercise does not affect dogs in the family home.

There is evidence to suggest that aggression is inherited and therefore a result of poor breeding.

Again, on lead only exercise does not affect breeding.

This smacks of Brexit.
Screams of I am right but no evidence whatsoever to support.

Find me just one piece of evidence to suggest that off leash exercise specifically is linked to aggression to people.

@Swaddlemeinplants

I am quite astonished at the literature that is out there. I never imagined there would be so much evidence out there What literature?! There are studies and statistics showing an increase in bites yes.

However.

There are no studies (that I am aware of) finding a link between off lead exercise and aggression to people.

When your whole thread is centred around the importance of keeping dogs on lead, how do you expect to get anywhere with no evidence suggesting exercise on lead would reduce dog bites?!

The current evidence suggests the vast majority of dog bites occur in the home, by the family dog, to a child under 5.

Lead only exercise does not affect dogs in the family home.

There is evidence to suggest that aggression is inherited and therefore a result of poor breeding.

Again, on lead only exercise does not affect breeding.

This smacks of Brexit.
Screams of I am right but no evidence whatsoever to support.

Find me just one piece of evidence to suggest that off leash exercise specifically is linked to aggression to people.

You want to start a thread, please do that. I am back at work soon so I can’t anymore. However, I have found enough to write so I will complete what I started. Also, you have to be blind (in your case obtuse) to see how an off lead vs on lead is related to more risks as so many posters and other threads have proved on here but do go on and keep posting. We are filing this thread anyway.

People are so funny about dogs.

Yes I’m a dog lover.

No I don’t own one (my youngest was terrified until recently)

My families dog pack numbers 6

I am always nervous of an off leash dog bounding at me.

Swaddlemeinplants
But people with strong opinions love to read a little bit about their pet topic and then cherry pick and present things to support their views. It happens on every issue.

Let's apply the OP's 'how many is too many' logic to other topics:

How many car accidents is too many? We should ban cars.
How many motorcyclists being in accidents is too many? We should ban motorcyclists or limit them to specific courses for them to ride their bikes because their presence on the roads might make some drivers nervous.
How many drink driving offences is too many? We should refuse to sell alcohol to anyone who holds a driving licence just in case a couple decide to drink drive.
How many assaults occur after football matches? What counts as too many? Maybe we should ban fans from the ground because some of them go drinking and get antisocial after.
Some cyclists have accidents on british roads. Some is the fault of the cyclist and some is the fault of car drivers. How many is too many? Maybe we should ban cyclists from roads unless they have a permit.
How many rogue traders are there who cut corners? How many is too many? Guess there should be a law against doing DIY for other people.
How many pets come to harm in the UK each year? How many is too many? Guess we better ban pets or microchip every animal and tell owners to go on extensive courses about pet ownership as that will obviously stop irresponsible pet owners
What about parents? How many children are harmed by their parent getting a new partner who is abusive? How many is too many? There should be a way of recording all adult relationships and that way nobody would ever enter a relationship with a single parent and harm children.

The problem when people are so emotionally charged on a topic is they lose the ability to discuss with reason so resort to over emotive claims, arguing in hyperbole and getting snippy when anyone points out their lack of logic.

Really the OP's central argument is 'I don't like dogs, if I decide they are out of control then they are, therefore all dogs should be on a lead at all times to please me'.

I love big dogs 🐕

I forgot to say that I will be writing to a number of authorities, including all local MPs, dog warden offices in the area, police, neighbourhood watch, local parish and a number of dog charities/rescue centres

Hope you’ve stocked up on green ink, OP! There’s a big round file in most offices where letters like yours go very swiftly.

looking at the Australian solution to dogs:
www.rspcaqld.org.au/blog/trending-now/off-leash-dogs#:~:text=Here%20in%20Australia%20we%20have,situations%20for%20responsible%20dog%20owners.
Walking your dog is meant to be a nice casual and calming experience, however sometimes things can go wrong that are out of our hands.
Here in Australia we have leash laws that require all dogs to be on lead in public places unless in a designated off-lead area. Unfortunately, not everyone obeys these laws which can often result in stressful situations for responsible dog owners.
What do you do when you are enjoying your on lead walk with your pooch and an off-lead dog runs towards you? Many people are unsure what to do in these situations and sometimes our actions can make it worse. Here are some tips on how to deal with this situation.

Why put a lead on your dog?
As we mentioned, it is the law! Even if you have the friendliest dog in the world, not everyone does.

A friendly dog running at a nervous or fearful dog will cause long-term side effects for the unsuspecting dog. When a dog is on lead, they cannot ‘flight’, and dogs will often revert straight away to ‘fight’ as a dog running at them is a perceived threat.
Local councils charge owners for walking their dogs off-lead (around $252)
If you are aware of regular dog owners that disregard the rules, please call your council. If you ask a local dog owner to leash their dog and they do not, we encourage you to report to council.

Walking your dog off-lead is like saying, “I don’t need to wear a seatbelt because I am a perfect driver”.

You cannot control what the other cars do, and similar you cannot control what other dogs do. So please remember that laws are in place for a reason, so everyone can enjoy walking their dogs in a calm and safe environment without risk of being approached by unknown unleashed dogs. Please be courteous to your fellow pet owners.

So what should you do if an off-lead dog runs towards you?
When enjoying an on-lead walk with your pooch and an off-lead dog runs towards you it can be hard to know what do in these situations - Sometimes our actions can make it worse.

Here are some tips on how to deal with this situation.

Don’t be shy! Yell out to the owners of the unleashed dog
Ask them to put their dog back on their lead immediately. You will often be greeted with the owner saying, “It’s ok, he is friendly.”

This does not give the owner the right to let their dog ‘do what they want’ when out in public spaces. Even the most social of dogs can be caught off guard at another pooch running towards them.

Carry a distraction
There is no sure fire way stop a dog running at you but here is a few tips that may help in that situation.

Carry high value treats like chicken, cheese or meat. Not only will they help your dog focus on you, but often throwing a handful of high value treats in the face of an approaching dog can stop them in their tracks, so they can then find all the treats on the ground. This should give you enough time to walk away with your dog calmly.
Carry an umbrella! Even though you may not be expecting rain, an umbrella can be used to open as the dog approaches which should startle the oncoming dog and it can also be used a shield to shield your dog from the off-lead dog.
Carry a water bottle (the squirty kind). Not only can you stay hydrated, but the use of squirting water in the face of an approaching dog can also startle them enough to stop. It catches them by surprise and may buy time enough time for the owner to leash their dog and you to walk away with yours.
What happens if it all goes bad?
Do you break up the fight? Breaking up a dog fight is ALWAYS risky, however in the heat of the moment all we care about is our dog’s safety.

The best way to break up a fight is to grab the back legs of each dogs and raise them off the ground (like a wheelbarrow) and walk backwards. If you are the only person present, do this to the dog that is leading the attack, eventually the other dog will try and get away.

Carrying an extra lead can also assist if you need to urgently clip a dog to pull it away.

Remember it is not your fault
If an off-lead dogs runs at you and that dog or your dog attacks, it is important to remember to that you are not at fault. The person who did not have sufficient control of their dog is legally responsible and will be liable for all vet costs for any injuries to your dog and any humans caught in the crossfire.

Don't forget to:

Call your local council as soon as possible to report the incident and have their animal management quick response team attend.
Take photos of all injuries and get as much information as possible about the offending dog.
Remain calm! Making accusations and getting worked up will not help the situation.
Seek medical attention as soon as possible at your vet or doctor for those that have been injured.
Ask any witnesses for their details.

The problem isn’t out of control dogs though
Op wants us responsible owners tarred with the ones that don’t give a fuck.

And as someone else has pointed out if the dog hasn’t bitten they won’t get the response they are expecting.

You want to start a thread, please do that. I am back at work soon so I can’t anymore
Can’t be bothered because you found no actual studies more like.

However, I have found enough to write so I will complete what I started
Also, you have to be blind (in your case obtuse) to see how an off lead vs on lead is related to more risks as so many posters and other threads have proved on here but do go on and keep posting. We are filing this thread anyway
You found so much to write you haven’t been able to put forward a single study linking off lead exercise to aggression or lead only exercise to a reduction in aggression...?
You didn’t find anything, it’s blatently obvious.
🤣
By all means write whatever you fancy to whoever you fancy but without any evidence whatsoever you are unlikely to get anywhere.

It is interesting to note though, there are actually studies linking lack of exercise to aggression and at least one I’ve seen that specifically mentioned a lack of off lead exercise increasing the likelihood of exercise.
And the fact that enforcing lead only would break animal welfare laws.
So, yeah.
Good luck
🤣

Looks like Australia’s leash laws are doing a great job yoko 👍
Perhaps because leash laws don’t affect family dogs at home (where the vast majority of dog bites) and bad breeding (a massive factor in dog aggression) ....

TYPO - increasing the likelihood of aggression, not exercise

ah the OP can't answer the question so needs to be in work!

I thought that. She had all the time in the world earlier on today